I wondered how long it would be before I saw this

[lambert1]

Signed Cloth Bound Edition of Big Roach 2 | eBay
Is it me or is this a little against the spirit of buying a signed copy of a specialist book? I know that some members of this forum queued at a recent signing for this book and if I read them right (no pun intended) they will be treasuring their copies and would not look to make a fast buck. You see this a lot on Ebay for all manner of books and yes the people concerned would have had to queue etc, but I wonder how the authors feel?

 

[sam vimes]

As Mark is on here, perhaps he'll answer as to how he feels about it?
I can't quite see why an author would care unduly. It might actually help sales by creating greater interest. The truth is that the relatively small scale of angling publications means that a secondary market is pretty much inevitable. Even when books are more mainstream, and much more abundant, collectors will find some way of valueing some more highly. There's little to no greater intrinsic value of a first edition, hardcover, leather bound cover, signed edition, etc etc. That won't stop people paying far more for them. It's largely immaterial whether that's at the primary point of sale or as a secondary sale.

As with anything someone sells, the future of the item ceases to be the concern of the seller once they've taken money for it. I tend to view most second hand traders (antique dealers, car sales, those that trawl forums to buy cheap tackle at low prices just to sell on) in a similarly dim way. However, I have to concede that no one is forced to buy or sell for a certain price. It's not particularly logical to take a dim view of any trader, unless they are actually conning/coercing buyers or sellers.

 

[Mark Wintle]

Quite honestly I don't worry about it at all. Yet to see any sales figures but the book has been well-received and the interest has caused sufficient sales of the original Big Roach to make that one sold out no matter what Amazon claims. All being well I will get enough from the run to justify a year's enjoyable work and a book to be proud of on the shelf. Onward and upward with the next project - Ivan Marks and the Likely Lads - due out next year if I can make the progress I intend, and it's going well so far.

 

[cg74]

Isn't the sole purpose of getting a book signed by the author to raise its desirability therefore increase its value?

 

[lambert1]

As Mark is on here, perhaps he'll answer as to how he feels about it?
I can't quite see why an author would care unduly. It might actually help sales by creating greater interest. The truth is that the relatively small scale of angling publications means that a secondary market is pretty much inevitable. Even when books are more mainstream, and much more abundant, collectors will find some way of valueing some more highly. There's little to no greater intrinsic value of a first edition, hardcover, leather bound cover, signed edition, etc etc. That won't stop people paying far more for them. It's largely immaterial whether that's at the primary point of sale or as a secondary sale.

As with anything someone sells, the future of the item ceases to be the concern of the seller once they've taken money for it. I tend to view most second hand traders (antique dealers, car sales, those that trawl forums to buy cheap tackle at low prices just to sell on) in a similarly dim way. However, I have to concede that no one is forced to buy or sell for a certain price. It's not particularly logical to take a dim view of any trader, unless they are actually conning/coercing buyers or sellers.

Yes the reality is as you say Sam and I guess that as long as books are sold the authors have achieved their aim. Doubtless whoever buys the book, albeit at an inflated price, will enjoy it.

---------- Post added at 12:25 ---------- Previous post was at 12:20 ----------

Quite honestly I don't worry about it at all. Yet to see any sales figures but the book has been well-received and the interest has caused sufficient sales of the original Big Roach to make that one sold out no matter what Amazon claims. All being well I will get enough from the run to justify a year's enjoyable work and a book to be proud of on the shelf. Onward and upward with the next project - Ivan Marks and the Likely Lads - due out next year if I can make the progress I intend, and it's going well so far.

As long as you are not worried Mark, then no more needs to be said. Glad to hear that sales have increased and there is good demand. Best wishes for your future projects.

---------- Post added at 12:48 ---------- Previous post was at 12:25 ----------

Isn't the sole purpose of getting a book signed by the author to raise its desirability therefore increase its value?

Not for me, but quite probably for collectors. The few signed books I have were bought after talking to the author and have only a sentimental value to me and I would not dream of selling them. To me it was all about letting the author know how much I appreciated their work and was the reason for getting them to sign it and the message was personal to me. On reflection I am clearly a little romantic in my view of signed copies. I better go and read a book!

 

[Bob Hornegold]

I don't see a lot wrong with as a commercial book, the author got a sale and the publisher got his costs covered.

What really got up my nose was the same collectors of signatures are making money on books where the all the profits are going to charity, like The Osprey Specimen Group and Friends book.

Some people can't see anything wrong in it ?

Bob

 

[Mark Wintle]

Ironically, the copy listed on ebay seems to have gone for the original retail price!

 

[Lord Paul of Sheffield]

To me it just shows the respect Mark deserves

 

[no-one in particular]

Is it a case of once someone buys a book, it becomes their property and they can do what they like with it or; is it illegal to sell it on under copyright law which often states it is illegal to sell on for profit without the authors permission.?
If a lot of second hand copies appear for Marks book for example, would not his sales of the original suffer?

 

[sam vimes]

Is it a case of once someone buys a book, it becomes their property and they can do what they like with it or; is it illegal to sell it on under copyright law which often states it is illegal to sell on for profit without the authors permission.?

Once upon a time, the front pages of books used to have a load of legaleese that included a bit about lending and selling the book. "This book is sold subject to the condition that it shall not, by way of trade or otherwise, be lent, resold, hired out, or otherwise circulated without the publisher's prior consent in any form of binding or cover other than that in which it is published and without a similar condition including this condition being imposed on the subsequent purchaser."

It's all guff that had some people believing that they couldn't sell their original book. However, what it really means is that you couldn't copy it (whole or in part) or split it up into smaller parts to further distribute.

In the very latest book I've bought, most of it has gone. All that remains is two sentences. "All rights reserved. No part of this publication may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system, or transmitted, in any form or by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, recording or otherwise, without prior permission of the publisher."

Once a book is bought, it's the buyers to do with as they see fit. If they choose to sell it on (whole and uncopied), they are quite entitled to do so, regardless of whether they make a profit or not.

 

[no-one in particular]

Once upon a time, the front pages of books used to have a load of legaleese that included a bit about lending and selling the book. "This book is sold subject to the condition that it shall not, by way of trade or otherwise, be lent, resold, hired out, or otherwise circulated without the publisher's prior consent in any form of binding or cover other than that in which it is published and without a similar condition including this condition being imposed on the subsequent purchaser."

It's all guff that had some people believing that they couldn't sell their original book. However, what it really means is that you couldn't copy it (whole or in part) or split it up into smaller parts to further distribute.

In the very latest book I've bought, most of it has gone. All that remains is two sentences. "All rights reserved. No part of this publication may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system, or transmitted, in any form or by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, recording or otherwise, without prior permission of the publisher."

Once a book is bought, it's the buyers to do with as they see fit. If they choose to sell it on (whole and uncopied), they are quite entitled to do so, regardless of whether they make a profit or not.

Thanks, that's cleared that one up then.

 

[Titus]

I tend to view most second hand traders (antique dealers, car sales, those that trawl forums to buy cheap tackle at low prices just to sell on) in a similarly dim way. However, I have to concede that no one is forced to buy or sell for a certain price. It's not particularly logical to take a dim view of any trader, unless they are actually conning/coercing buyers or sellers.

As you say Sam, "It's not particularly logical to take a dim view of any trader", you are free to offer your services or skills to whoever you wish just as a dealer is free to purchase his stock from whoever he wants (so long as it's legal).

By trawling speciality areas for the cheapest prices and then offering the goods to a larger audience for a profit the trader is simply doing what people have always done since Adam traded an apple for a peek behind the fig leaf.

We live in a free market society Sam and the world as we know it depends on somebody selling something, An old dealer once said to me that if three shipwrecked dealers were washed up on an island with a chair they would all make a living. He was probably right.

Now.....Anyone want to sell or buy any tackle?

 

[terry m]

You buy something, signed or not, then you choose to sell it.

No problem whatsoever.

 

[Bob Hornegold]

I completely understand about a book and signatures being sold on for profit !!

But what about a book that has been put together in aid of a charity, with all profits going to in our case Cancer Research UK.

This is where I disagree with a book of this type being sold at a profit and none of that profit going to the charity.

This will of course spark the old, but charities take their cut and I agree, but the contributors to the book gave their contribution's for nothing and the publishers made no profit, the only losers were the charity.

It leaves a bad taste.

Osprey Specimen Group

Bob

 

[no-one in particular]

I completely understand about a book and signatures being sold on for profit !!

But what about a book that has been put together in aid of a charity, with all profits going to in our case Cancer Research UK.

This is where I disagree with a book of this type being sold at a profit and none of that profit going to the charity.

This will of course spark the old, but charities take their cut and I agree, but the contributors to the book gave their contribution's for nothing and the publishers made no profit, the only losers were the charity.

It leaves a bad taste.

Osprey Specimen Group

Bob

Perhaps they could have a paragraph in asking - If this book is sold second hand would the owner contribute some of the profit to the said charity and a explanation as above. I doubt there would be many that would but, a few might and somethings better than nothing.
Bob-I have a Osprey book somewhere, I think its called Skates and Rays. Its buried somewhere in my piles of books. I am sure its by Osprey. Quite old, is this anything to do with your group?