Bomb over waggler line

[binka]

This is something I’ve dropped upon by accident and which I'm really struggling to find an explanation for.

Over the last few weeks I’ve been doing a lot of big perch fishing with both the waggler and the bomb, typically starting on the waggler and changing to the bomb over the baited waggler line when conditions dictate such as wind and tow becoming too much to offer a good presentation with the float and it's been doing the trick nicely.

I usually pick up a fish fairly quickly and often a good one at that which figures as it's a better presentation over one which has deteriorated which is all good and well.

However...

During a very slow session last week and again yesterday I put the bomb out in good conditions where the float had previously been giving me a good presentation and twenty minutes later I’m into a good perch, and despite my best efforts with the float throughout the remainder of the day I couldn’t buy a bite until the bomb again went out and accounted for the second of the only two fish I took.

Exactly the same thing last week after switching to the bomb when I had been offering the same and good presentation with the float, this time accounting for four fish which wouldn't succumb to the same presentation via the float.

As far as the hookbait goes it’s essentially the same presentation, static and nailed to the deck so what’s making the difference as it’s now happened too many times for it to be a coincidence?

My own very unconvincing theory is that maybe the fish are spooking off of the vertical mainline and/or the deep bulk droppers in the reasonably clear water when on the waggler as these will be a few inches away in their sight line but moving the droppers higher made no difference (apart from spoiling the presentation by subjecting it to the tow) and it’s not the fast movement of the bait as it hits the deck because it was over twenty minutes after casting in on each occasion before the bites materialised.


Anyone have a theory?

 

[john step]

I think you are right about the line spooking the perch. This winter I have found the perch particularly tackle shy. On the float, unless I went "silly" small on hook size I didn't get a bite. Normally you associate perch with being greedy so and so's.
However, as you found, they would give good bites on the bottom providing the running lead was free running.

On live and dead baits they would often give real screamers of runs.
That was to a larger hook on a hair.
Maybe the hair was the answer.
As an aside I have had a few great clonking roach this winter on the hair rig when I was using a big worm as bait. The bites were normally good just like the perch.

 

[S-Kippy]

Definitely the vertical line. Same issue at Bury Hill with the zander.

 

[rubio]

Often a tactic I try on rivers too. Generally when switching to bomb rod I will catapault 3/4 pouches of maggot over where I've already been feeding and see what is lurking beneath. Reliable for a few more fish in most swims but I can't be certain why I'm afraid.

 

[greenie62]

This is something I’ve dropped upon by accident and which I'm really struggling to find an explanation for....
.....Anyone have a theory?

Good thread this Binka!
Makes ya wonder why - if ya want to fish bang on the bottom - why ever use a float?

As others have commented - it's the vertical line through the water column that's spooking the fish - maybe by feel rather than by sight - have you noticed an increase in dithering touches transmitted through to the float?
Tight (well-sunk) Lines!

 

[tigger]

Steve, have you tried float legering ? I like to use a peice of peacock quill attatched with a rubber So fixed on the line). If you fish straight through and pinch on a small shot to stop your bomb / weight at the desired distance from you hook the fish shouldn't be put off by your mainline and you can alter the amount of line laying on the bottom in simply by moving the shot up or down the line. You can fish your float overdepth so as you need to tighten up to cock your float which will pull your line on an angle away from your bomb / weight and so further still away from your bait. I often fish like this and it does work very well. I like to let the quill lye flat or nearly flat so the line isn't to tight to the hook but I do vary it and to do that is so simple as you just turn the reel handle a bit either way to get the desired set up.

 

[binka]

Thanks for the excellent input fellas.

Looks like the vertical mainline could be the issue then, I had toyed with the idea of a fluorocarbon leader between the hooklink and the float but that still leaves the bulk shot.

There's some good, thought provoking comments and ideas there for me to have a go at :thumbs:

If I have a major breakthrough i'll let you know

 

[S-Kippy]

Pinning the line down when carping or backleading for barbel seem obvious things to do but it doesn't immediately occur to do that when after other species.I will often do this if I'm fishing shallow or open water...especially if its clear but I'm talking of lead or feeder work here not float. Water clarity,light levels and proximity to weed [or not] are all factors that need thinking about....even line colour. There is one place I fish where no matter what you do if the sun is out then it lights up your line like a string of leds....that cannot be good.

I'd be perfectly happy fishing the lead if it was working.

 

[itsfishingnotcatching]

Would it be worth fishing over depth on the waggler using a largish shot to hold bottom but allowing the tow on the water to take the bait away from the vertical line?

 

[binka]

Would it be worth fishing over depth on the waggler using a largish shot to hold bottom but allowing the tow on the water to take the bait away from the vertical line?

Thanks for a good suggestion Ian, something I've contemplated but the trouble is the bigger perch are so damn cute when it comes to resistance and anything heavy to drag along the bottom makes me back off the idea, I might well try it though.

When I've been getting 'em on the bomb I've literally been slackening off when setting a 1oz tip after casting so that it is bolt straight without any play and when a slight curve appears due to the tow slackening off again to remove it, I actually feel more confident after this second slackening off as the bites still register fine with a slight bow but the fish has more slack to play with before feeling anything too solid.

I sometimes think that bobbins are the way to go but I just enjoy catching 'em on the float so much.

 

[john step]

Binka further to my input about bites and screamers on hair rigs for perch...............I have to confess to using a light quiver tip instead of a bobbin at times and the bites can be like a pull round from a carp.
It may be peculiar to where I fish but it happens on two different waters.

 

[binka]

Binka further to my input about bites and screamers on hair rigs for perch...............I have to confess to using a light quiver tip instead of a bobbin at times and the bites can be like a pull round from a carp.
It may be peculiar to where I fish but it happens on two different waters.

Thanks John.

Out of interest, had you fed the swim with much beforehand as that's the type of bite I would associate with a fish feeding confidently, I appreciate though that with perch (like many other species) the rule book can easily go out of the window?

 

[laguna]

Have you considered using a paternoster with the float Steve?

 

[binka]

Have you considered using a paternoster with the float Steve?

The idea had never crossed my mind Chris, strange really as it's a perchy type of method although I associate it more with small lives than the worms I tend to use.

Interesting idea, it might be an option with a fluorocarbon link.

 

[laguna]

The idea had never crossed my mind Chris, strange really as it's a perchy type of method although I associate it more with small lives than the worms I tend to use.

Interesting idea, it might be an option with a fluorocarbon link.

Yes, more associated with dead baits for pike using a sunken float and bomb.
My setup consists of just 2 or 3 swan shot suspended just off bottom with the tip of a pencil float visible on the surface. It works particularly well in windy conditions due to the waves jigging the worm around a little.