Losing a lot of bites

[rookie_fly_guy]

Went fishing today and had a slight problem for the last couple of fishing trips in that I kept on losing bites.

Basically I was fishing on a waggler with some hooks to nylon using 6mm soft hooker pellets or corn as bait. I had loads of bites but as soon as I struck or a few seconds after I struck the fish would lose the hook.

This was a little frustrating today (until I hooked a huge tench! Then lost it as I tried to net it, but it still put a big smile on my face) as I probably had a good thirty or forty bites but only landed four small roach.

I was wondering if it was possibly the hooks? I was using size 18 extra strong wide gape nickel barbless hooks to nylon (code B611) or possibly that the fish had grabbed the bait, not the hook and the few seconds of pulling on the line was long enough to pull the bait off.

I thought it may have been the way I was striking the bite, but I tried varying the speed I pulled the rod back, tried just winding in the line, tried striking in different directions but the net result was the same. So if anyone has any advice, or could point me at some pics showing the best way to hook on corn and pellets to ensure a good hook I'd really appreciate it!

 

[slime monster]

Your hooks are fine ..I use them but 16 or 14 would be my choice...if it is the bigger fish you seek ,other than that if it is roach change bait to caster

 

[rookie_fly_guy]

its not so much not getting the right type of fish, its more that I couldn't set the hook, they'd slip it in seconds or I'd reel in a hook sans bait. I've looked through most of the beginners guides on FM, but they all say bait your hook without telling you the best way to actually put bait on (unless its how to attach boillies)

So generally hoping for some advice on how the bait should go on to give the best presentation whilst still allowing me to easily hook the fish.

Alternatively if anyone goes fishing in north london (trent park, hampstead etc) and wouldn't mind me coming along to pester them for advice that would be handy too

 

[Fred Bonney]

Your basic problem could be that you are not keeping the tension between your rodtop and the fish.
Useing a barbless hook means you must keep in full contact with the fish until it's in the net!
Baiting your hook shouldn't be a problem ,just make sure the point of the hook is showing,although with soft baits that shouldn't really be a problem.

 

[quattro]

Are you fishing dead depth? It might be worth altering the depth a bit, perhaps a few more inches overdepth, or coming up a bit. I have had this problem before with most of the bites being line bites leading to a lot of foul hooks. I think on one of those occasions I came up off the bottom a few inches and started catching. Depth can definitely affect successful hooking (IMO)

 

[Rodney Wrestt]

Krian,
Can you describe your set up? shotting pattern, depth of water (have you plumbed up, are you at dead depth, shallow or over depth?) how far out are you fishing, are you sinking the line. What size float are you using?

 

[captainbarnacles]

if your useing soft hookers then a size 12 would be what i would use , if your useing an 18 then your probably just pulling the hook through the fishes mouth without hooking it. but it could be as others have said your setup.

 

[rookie_fly_guy]

Patterns vary a bit, but generally heres the setup:

Waters approx 3ft deep where I fish, its a shallow decline heading out to the center of the lake, I vary the floats depending on the conditions but recently I've been using a inset waggler puddle chucker with a 1.75g weight attached, a 0.2g and a 0.1g split shot spread down the line. Tied off to a link swivel (one of those swivels where you can open up the swivel to change hooks easily)

Generally use a size 18 or 20 hook to nylon, with a 6mm soft hooker pellet attached or corn, I've tried fishing over depth, at dead depth and a bit short. The fish take the bait (waggler goes completely underwater) I strike and either miss it or get two or three seconds fighting the fish then the line goes limp. The bait is always off the hook when this happens.

Couple of points, when I was fishing with maggots on the line I didn't tend to miss the bites, it would be a good hook through the upper or lower lip, except for a few roach that downed the whole lot. So I was wondering if the fish had grabbed the bait and I just pulled the hook through the bait and out of the fishes mouth before it had actually hooked the fish.

Secondly, I was thinking it might partially be that im striking too hard, I was float fishing with my quivertip the other day (don't ask!) and although I still missed a fair few bites I didn't lose nearly as many as I did with the normal rods I use for float fishing.

 

[captainbarnacles]

well for me you can forget the swivels , just tie a hook to nylon to your mainline, put 1 no8 shot on your hooklength around 4 inches from the hook, then shot your float down as you would normally with the bulk underneath the float to a quarter of an inch obove surface. You can mess around with your shot till you get it right we all have to do this learning as we go. Again depends on if your trying to get bites on the drop or on the bottom, i suggest you start off simple and work on it as you go. Plenty of guys in here give you a hand.The swivel is prob whats the main problem the fish are feeling the wieght of it and spitting out too quick for you, just go with the least shot on your hooklenght and try it.Also your rods maybe a bit too heavy for the smaller fish and also on 6mm pellets you need min size 12 hook. Hope that helps.

---------- Post added at 13:39 ---------- Previous post was at 13:27 ----------

reading more into what you say about the maggotts and the roach swallowing them, brings me back to the swivels , the swivel is so heavy for these type of fish that your not registering the bite until the fish swims away from swallowing the bait or it spits the bait but prob had it in its mouth for ages and your not seeing it, so them go with the rig i explained earlier and you should start seeing them earlier and so strike more quickly.

 

[rookie_fly_guy]

Ah, cool, i'll try ditching the swivels then. I mainly use them for my partner - shes not the most accurate caster in the world (nor am I for that matter) and I'll have to pull for a break from trees/reeds/bushes etc at least twice during a four hour session, so its become habbit to tie everything to a swivel so she can change the hook without me having to re-tie the rig for her (she tends to yell for me every time something needs tying, gets tangled or when she hooks a fish )

As for hook sizes I've been desperately trying to catch a tench at the local pond (managed to hook one that got away out of about 15 sessions, I know they're there just havent had much luck yet) and I'd read they were quite hook shy, hence using smaller hooks.

 

[Rodney Wrestt]

Hi Krian,
The loaded puddle chuckers are nice floats and a fair choice on a water as shallow as you've described because they don't dive too deep as they land.

For the shotting pattern I'd amend it a little with a small bulk of 3x No8 at about 18" instead of your single No4 (0.2g) then 2x No10's 5" apart (the first above the hooklength knot.)

Which brings me to the hooklength, I'd get rid of the swivel (unless it's a micro version and takes the place of a No8 shot) and shorten the hooklength to 8".

The hook, I'd step up to a size 16 (minimum, a 14 if you still get bites) the reason you're connecting with more bites on maggot is because the hooksize is suited to them but it's too small for the 6mm pellet.

As you've plumbed the depth I'd start at dead depth, if the bites are too finicky and difficult to hit, try going over-depth, I tend to go the length of the float as a general rule.

Don't strike into the fish, the description gives the wrong idea, you're not fishing at range and the hooks are very thin gauge, usually chemically sharpened. All that's required is to lift the rod and feel the hook home. It comes with experience and as your confidence grows you won't worry about it not setting properly. I know some species have tough mouths but not what you're after on your venue.

 

[rookie_fly_guy]

Don't strike into the fish, the description gives the wrong idea, you're not fishing at range and the hooks are very thin gauge, usually chemically sharpened. All that's required is to lift the rod and feel the hook home. It comes with experience and as your confidence grows you won't worry about it not setting properly. I know some species have tough mouths but not what you're after on your venue.

Cheers, I think some of thats from watching a variety of fishing vids on youtube, they always seemed to whip the rod up and away, although thinking about it that may be because they all tend to be fishing out at 40 odd yards away, rather than ten, fifteen feet.

I'll pick up some smaller weights then (the smallest I have in my packs are 0.1g) and see how it goes on saturday, with any luck I'll be writing a post about landing my first tench