Chris Yates

[BAZ (Angel of the North)]

I have been watching a number of C.Yates video?s and reading his books over the past few weeks.
Although I find them fascinating and interesting to watch and read, I can?t help but think if he is seriously under gunned in his choice of tackle, rod, reel etc. I know this is what he does and this is the kind of tackle he caught his record Carp on from Redmire, but I do get that niggling feeling at times.
One of his comments on video was;
Yes it?s a Tench, I?m glad it?s a Tench because I?m not really tooled up for a big Carp. Although he was after Carp at the time.

Anybody else think like this?

 

[Julian Barber]

I haven't seen the videos/articles in question, but agree is not cricket to fish for any species with tackle that is not up to the job.
I remember seeing a documentary about IGFA Records, where twonks fish for sharks and marlin with line rated as low as 6lbs and fly rods. Regardless of wether the capture is gonna be nutted off at the end of the experience, the thought of exhausting a fish to the point of near-death just to prove you can catch it on ridiculously inadequate tackle leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.
Its inevitable when tench fishing that a carp may intercept the bait and a protracted battle ensue due to inability to bully it a bit, but that different to targeting the carp with such tackle. Seems the likely outcome of such an approach is going to be either a carp that requires a lot of nursing before release, or a carp left hook and line trailing, neither a good situation just for a 'bit of sport'.

 

[BAZ (Angel of the North)]

I was wondering if such ancient tackle as he is useing was really up to the job?
he really did seem to struggle at times getting any Carp away from the snags with his cane rod.

I am not knocking him, but I don't think I would take the risk.

 

[Julian Barber]

Ok..I'll knock him for you Baz... He's a twonk ( only joking Chris baby...)

 

[Keith Moors]

Hi Baz. I think the problem is that not only do anglers follow Chris's teachings and go undergunned, some of them read about the latest super duper broomstick and believe that that is a must have. The rod ideally needs to be balanced for the size of fish that you are after but also to suit their make up. As an example of what I mean, our lake is rich clay bed so the carp are wearing a face pack every day and therefore have very soft mouths. An over-poerful rod will rip their mouths to shreds so in some ways the soft rod wins but this can then lead to protracted battles and knackered carp. On gravel pits, more often than not the carp have hard mouths and can be bullied slightly so the stiffer rod wins. when you have a choice you can choose the rod to suit but when you are starting out you have to make do with what you've got. My own opinion is that a 2 3/4 is as close as you can get to medium.

 

[will spencer]

best example was on one of john wilson progs and he was playing what he estimated to be a 20-30-lber on one of his avon/quivers with 8lb mainline.he was ranting that you dont need 2 and a half pound scaffold poles when ping!the line broke.red faced wilson turned to the camera and said thats why you need a two and half pound rod.
the avon may be up to the job on an acre or so water like redmire if you're float fishing for carp,but if you've got a large expanse of water and a three ounce lead is the only option with a pva bag you ain't gonna cast this baby with a avon.would chris yates fish st johns at linear?
i remember the peg i fished at the blue pool a few years back.that dropped out of sight at the rod tip.
i agree with what you say keith regarding the balance of set up,but i think that the size of the water has an effect too.
do you alter the hook pattern you use as well keith?on a water i fish locally i used to use fox hooks and carp r us hooks but found i was losing fish,i switched to esp hooks and landed more fish.the water is an old reservoir with very deep silt beds,i think i have to do a lot more thinking regarding hook choice on this venue.

 

[Keith Moors]

I agree with you Will, the way that you are intending to fish also has a bearing on what rod you're going to be using; method or light lead etc.
With regard to hooks i find that I need to use a pattern which suits my hook link material as well. ie. ESP stiff-rigger for mono or fluoro (which is my favourite) or a big T etc for braid. The difference in the angle of the eye makes a massive difference to how the hook reacts on the pick up. My lake is soft bottomed and I use light running leads, fluoro hook links and ESP stiff riggers and that set up catches me a lot of fish. Give it a go and let me know how it holds up.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

Which video was that Baz?

If it the one I am thinking of then I think you'll find that Chris knows that venue pretty well and apart from a 'mythical' big Carp the majority of the residents are in the upper doubles range.

Don't forget that when making a video you typically go to a 'runs water' so that you get a 'catch' on tape.

In any event I am not sure I would agree with you that Chris goes out deliberately 'undergunned' for any particular species.

The majority of cane users will tell you that the action of a cane rod is totally different to that of carbon. Whether the rod in question happens to be a new Barder Merlin, or an old Richard Walker Mk IV Carp rod.

Not only will a cane rod progressively take on a bend throughout its full length the nature of the material is that it is always trying to return to its original straight line state.
(unlike so many of todays so called "Carp Rods")

As to Chris' reels, then do a little research and see what reels were used for Walker's and Yates' biggest Carp captures.

We haven't always had super-dooper baitrunners or Big (s)Pit reels Baz, and quite honestly for a lot of the style of fishing that Chris undertakes on his videos, they are simply "over-gunned"

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA)]

Whoops!!

"Not only will a cane rod progressively take on a bend throughout it's whole length, the nature of the material is that it is always trying to return to its original straight line state".

Well Peter, how do you think my fly rods behave, to say nothing of most of all the other carbon rods I possess?

The only diffence between cane and carbon is that cane is a solid cross section and does not tend to turn ovular as circular cross sections will do.

And I can assure you that carbon fly rods will outcast any cane rod that has ever existed. And with the exception of short river rods for accuracy casting, the carbon rods are a hell of a lot more pleasant to use.

And they return to their original straight state a hell of a lot better than cane.

I have used dozens of cane rods in my life and they all had a tendency NOT to stay straight. Most of them took on a set!

 

[Blunderer]

Chris Yates has been a magnificent ambassador for angling for decades. To accuse him of unsafe angling practices or setting a bad example is nonsense.

I would much rather Chris Yates was teaching Britain's young anglers how to fish (and how to care for the environment) than a lot of todays big names.

Stupid thread. How many times has Chris yates left a fish trailing 6 feet of leadcore, a 5oz lead and 12 inches of braid around a lake?

Like all decent anglers, he balances his tackle to the water and his quarry.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

"Most of them took on a set!"

See, thats what you get for buying the cheap stuff Ron ;-)

I still own dozens of old cane rods, (in use) as you know, and not one of them has a set at all.

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA)]

B James, Hardys, Sharps of Aberdeen,JB Walker etc.

They all took sets.

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA)]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with Chris Yates. I must admit that I like the bloke and his writings, although I don't agree with all he says.

He may be a bit of an eccentric that is true, and he may harp a bit too much on ancient tackle, and he may be a lousy fly fisher, but let's be honest, angling needs characters like Chris.

I would have loved to have seen Chris and Ray Webb fishing together.

He is a far better person than that old mate of his who shall be nameless.

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA)]

And I also like tea and plum cake!!

 

[Keith Moors]

How can the thread be "stupid" blunderer or is it that everyone who doesn't agree with your thinking is wrong. I like Chris Yates and I thought Passion was the best there has ever been.......for entertainment value. I'm not sure that I would encourage my grandson to follow exactly how Chris fishes. He is experienced enough to get away with a lot that lesser mortals can't and I certainly wouldn't want my grandson jumping into lakes out of trees. It's discussions like this that show the wide range of thinking in our sport and that's got to be good.

 

[John Ledger (ACA)]

Chris Yates is an angler i cannot take seriously and would be better used as a prop in the next Sherlock Holmes film.
Passion for Angling was ok for Hugh Miles photography and Bernard Cribbens narration,as for the two overgrown giggling schoolboys ,no time.
As it took about 4years to film or so im led to believe they should have caught some fish.I dont even think Chris Yates is a good angler and if im going to watch a programne on angling would rather see a real angler than a Sherlock Holmes clone living in the past and trying to attract attention to himself by doing so.
Chris Pillock more like

 

[Cakey]

Im with Keith Softbottom Moors ......................Passion was very watchable but...................

 

[BAZ (Angel of the North)]

Peter.
It was the "Caught In Time" video.
This is a real refresher of a Carp video to watch. Nothing hurried, and as usual with his writings or video's, it really captures your imagination and puts you there with him.

I too have long admired his approach to angling, but as Keith says, I would question the wisdom of jumping out of trees into murky water. Although that particular video (Redmire) in its self was enjoyable to watch.

The other point I would make is in his book (Casting At The Sun).

Again a rivetting and enjoyable read, but he recalls the story of his 40lb plus from Redmire.
I think it was Rod Hutchinson that he said jumped into the water to divert the Carp from swimming into a snag. It was this action that enabled him to make the capture.

As far as I am concerned, that is all fair and square, and only adds to the story. But had he been useing more up to date tackle, he could have landed it without any help. Indeed without any help, he says that he would have most probably lost it in the snags.

I hope you chaps can see my point, as I am an admirer of C. Yates and am not trying to put him down. It is merely an observation or two that I have made.

 

[GrahamM]

I think we need to remind ourselves that today's tackle is very much over-gunned in most instances, rather than older tackle being under-gunned.

If a water is snag-free you can land any carp that swims on 10lb line, and you can land it without prolonging the fight unduly. And you need only a 1.5lb TC rod when using 10lb line.

Rods and lines became heavier over the years, not to enable a carp angler to land fish more easily, but to enable him to cast further and to be able to throw out heavy loads in the shape of PVA bags, etc.

Instead of the balanced (and often safer) tackle of yesteryear, when reel lines were 12lb and hooklengths were 10lb, we now have 12 or 15lb reel lines and 25lb stiff link hooklengths and similar.

Older rods, especially cane rods, bend more easily and throughout their full length, therefore offering a much more effective shock absorber for the line. The same thing cannot be said of many modern rods that are poker-like for at least two thirds of their length.

No, older rods may appear to be under-gunned, but when balanced with the right reel lines and hooklengths they can be much safer and more effective.

 

[BAZ (Angel of the North)]

My point Graham is that when fishing next to a half sunken tree, then surely a more stiffer actioned rod would be better than a cane rod, that will bend through to the butt, and give the Carp that much more fredom to get into the snag?