Fighting Carp

[dezza]

As some of you may know, I have just spent 2 weeks with friends in South Africa. I fished every day and caught conservatively over 300 carp, together with other species from the Vaal River and Vaal Dam. These carp are wild fully scaled commons, which although not growing to huge sizes, are capable of fighting like tigers.

I used for most of this fishing an 11 foot 1 1/4lb Avon rod with 10 lb line straight through to a Fox hook, size 6 or 8, baited with brown bread flake, sweetcorn or a single large grain of boiled maize. The rig was a simple 3 AA Drennan waggler with locking shot and a tell tale shot located about 8 inches from the hook.

The carp from this particular part of the Vaal river fought with a ferocity that would astound many. They took off on long fast runs where around 50 yards of line was taken from the reel, almost instantly. And you daren't try to stop them, and you use backwinding techniques at your peril.

But have you experienced incredibly powerful carp, fish that have virtually burned your fingers when you have tried to stop them by finger pressure on the spool?

My experience of many English carp is that they are plodders. They don't move off at intensive speed and judging by the fact that many local anglers backwind carp, they can be controlled quite easily.

But these SA carp are different!

 

[mol]

Everything in South Africa is better

 

[cg74]

Everything in South Africa is better

Ah yes, the gospel according to Ron Clay.

SA carp fight harder than their UK counterparts; that really is such a stupid, if not naive statement to make. Would it have anything to do with the temps currently found in the Orange Free State 30+C in the day and 15ish C at night.
Then you look at the size of the water; more sq miles than most English lakes are acres and add to that the flow of the river...

Did you know in the summer Ebro carp fight harder than English ones....

BORING!!

 

[The Monk]

Glad you had a good trip mate, those carp sound like the St Lawrence fish which I found had far most fighting qualities than the Frence carp, classic long lean commons not unlike our original Wildies, you could sit and catch them all day, our average size was around 12 to 18 the pound mark, great to fish on rivers like this and a nice change from English still water fish. You can`t backwind these things despite what the so called experts say. Did you fish Harterbeerspoort Dam Ron for the Barbel as they call them, cats?

 

[dezza]

Did you fish Harterbeerspoort Dam Ron for the Barbel as they call them, cats?

No I didn't fish at Harties as I was staying over 120 miles away, and petrol in SA is as near as dammit as expensive as the UK.

Yes mate I would like to pitch some of the backwinding superkinde against a 4 lb yellowfish, never mind a Vaal River wildie.

 

[Keith M]

those carp sound like the St Lawrence fish which I found had far most fighting qualities than the Frence carp, classic long lean commons not unlike our original Wildies, you could sit and catch them all day, our average size was around 12 to 18 the pound mark, great to fish on rivers like this and a nice change from English still water fish. You can`t backwind these things despite what the so called experts say. Did you fish Harterbeerspoort Dam Ron for the Barbel as they call them, cats?

Hi Monk,
Whereabouts on the St' Lawrence where you fishing? I remember sailing up the St.Lawrence on an Aircraft carrier in the late 70's and I have often heard of the carp that come out further up the river.
I may be going back there this year for a few weeks so I might take a rod with me this time.

Those Vaal River fish sound fantastic Ron, glad you had such a good time; I'm very envious.

 

[Catfishingham]

Ron, I still live near the river I fished as a kid. We made paste bait, (corn meal flavored with vanilla), it was so soft we had to hand throw it in. We use non-freespool multiplier reels, clicker would scream on a run and handle would spin like a hundred miles an hour, we called them "nuckle busters"! I can still remember running up the river reaching the rod around trees, (reels were usualy short on line and got spooled a lot)! I remember 30"+ fish, we didn't weigh them then, I hope to catch some big ones this season and get some weights. Great sport.

Tight Lines,
Cat

 

[nicky]

Great to hear you had a nice trip Ron.
The fishing sounds like great fun especially with good friends.

 

[Philip]

Glad to see you have progressed from Roach to a proper fish then...trotting for 8 oz silvers day after day can become a frightful bore....


Of course there are no hard and fast rules but for the most part I would say river Carp fight harder than their Lake counterparts. Another very general rule of thumb is that I find the faster the flow of the river the harder the Carp fight…maybe a consequence of the flow keeping them “fit” ?

Maybe genetics also plays a part, some rivers just tend to have very hard fighting Carp in them. The Loire in France is a good example and is reputed for how hard its Carp pull back.

 

[The Monk]

Hi Monk,
Whereabouts on the St' Lawrence where you fishing? I remember sailing up the St.Lawrence on an Aircraft carrier in the late 70's and I have often heard of the carp that come out further up the river.
I may be going back there this year for a few weeks so I might take a rod with me this time.

Those Vaal River fish sound fantastic Ron, glad you had such a good time; I'm very envious.

Hi Keith, sorry for the late reply, we did the Bernie Haines trip for two week and had a couple of weeks in Montreal also, based at Massina, NY State, he`d take us out in the boat to various places and backwaters on the St Lawrence, including the dam at the Cornwall indian reservation, I go pally with a Cree indian chief there who also took me out

 

[Wooly]

The carp from this particular part of the Vaal river fought with a ferocity that would astound many. They took off on long fast runs where around 50 yards of line was taken from the reel, almost instantly. And you daren't try to stop them, and you use backwinding techniques at your peril.

But have you experienced incredibly powerful carp, fish that have virtually burned your fingers when you have tried to stop them by finger pressure on the spool?

My experience of many English carp is that they are plodders. They don't move off at intensive speed and judging by the fact that many local anglers backwind carp, they can be controlled quite easily.

But these SA carp are different![/QUOTE]

I bet if you fish with 4 lb line and a delicate float rod, they'll fight even harder.....

 

[dezza]

I bet if you fish with 4 lb line and a delicate float rod, they'll fight even harder.....

But many of these carp had to be stopped from reaching snags which were rushes, reedmace, lilies and tree roots. No 8 and no 6 hooks with 8 to 10 lb line was not being overgunned in the circumstances. I didn't leave one of these fish with a hook in it's mouth, and I didn't take much longer than 5 minutes to land the largest of the fish.

I made them work for every inch of line they took.

 

[Wooly]

Ron you contradict yourself, were you fishing more than 50 metres away from these roots and snags and stopped the fish just short of them, or did they not run for 50 metres and you in fact played them hit and hold?

When i lived in Milton Keynes I caught many carp from the Grand Union Canal fishing up close to the far bank snags about 11 to 12 metres out. My rod of choice being a 2 1/4 TC North Western carbon Kevlar rod. When I got a pick up I would point it over my left shoulder and hold on tight with my hand clamped over the spool. The rod would take on a scary curve and hold the fish on the edge of the snags. I used GR60 in 15lb breaking strain. Anything less and I was snapped off immediately. Fights were brutal and short, other than my first few trips when I was undergunned on line strength I never lost a fish to the snags, the early losses all being break offs.

 

[fishingjack]

I find the same with Thai fish Ron. Unfortunately I think it's down to the climate.
It is probably better to be more conservative with your energy in colder climates where food is harder to find and available for less time per annum. More energy is lost to the cold.

A pacu over there will go harder than a carp 2 to 3 times it's size.

We just have to make do. I have found trout very strong for their size. They fight to the death. There are species like barbel though that can put up a great fight by taking advantage of the current in a fast river.