Ledgering for Roach
- Thread starter Paul F
- Start date
A
Andy Thatcher 1
Guest
Any chance of a few more details like if you are fishing a river or lake ?
R
Ron Troversial Clay
Guest
If you are fishing a river, you need a very delicate quiver tip rod.
I use a simple link leger with swan shots as weight, adding eight or taking them away as is required.
Use a tiny swivel or a Drennan ring. Tie your reel line to it, tie another short length of reel line to the ring about 5 inches long. This you use to pinch your shots on. Your hook length is also tied to the ring. Most time in rivers like the Severn for instance I used to use an 18 for single maggots and a 16 for double maggots or casters.
If you are missing lots of bites, the secert is not to fish too close. Allow a bow in your line to develop by casting a little upstream and then allowing the leger to settle in place.
Fishing upstream can also be deadly. You cast upstream and then allow a fair amount of line to go downstream so that you get a big bow in your line going downstream.
Fish with a most delicate quiver tip you have. The tip will bend downstream due to the pull of the current, but when you get a bite ther tip will straighten. What you do then is wind in quite sharply and feel for the fish and then tighten.
Do not attempt to strike!
Another method is by laying on or Stret Pegging but that's not really legering.
Ive caught some of my biggest roach on rivers like the Severn using the legering methods I have described.
I use a simple link leger with swan shots as weight, adding eight or taking them away as is required.
Use a tiny swivel or a Drennan ring. Tie your reel line to it, tie another short length of reel line to the ring about 5 inches long. This you use to pinch your shots on. Your hook length is also tied to the ring. Most time in rivers like the Severn for instance I used to use an 18 for single maggots and a 16 for double maggots or casters.
If you are missing lots of bites, the secert is not to fish too close. Allow a bow in your line to develop by casting a little upstream and then allowing the leger to settle in place.
Fishing upstream can also be deadly. You cast upstream and then allow a fair amount of line to go downstream so that you get a big bow in your line going downstream.
Fish with a most delicate quiver tip you have. The tip will bend downstream due to the pull of the current, but when you get a bite ther tip will straighten. What you do then is wind in quite sharply and feel for the fish and then tighten.
Do not attempt to strike!
Another method is by laying on or Stret Pegging but that's not really legering.
Ive caught some of my biggest roach on rivers like the Severn using the legering methods I have described.
I'm fishing a lake about 10-12 feet deep, I was legering with about 1/4 once swim feeder with 3 l/b line, I use about a foot hook length. Is the weight to heavey 1/4 once? The roach seem to pull at the maggot and not take the hook would caster be a better bait, without movement maybe they would take it more freely?
R
Ron Troversial Clay
Guest
In a lake condirions are different.
If you have a bite on maggot and the bait is crushed or "sucked out" as it were, it means that the maggot has been right down the throat of the roach and has been crushed by its throat teeth. If you had struck at the right time you would have hooked your roach. Perhaps you should be float fishing.
If you want to leger, use a fairly heavy feeder, about 1/2 and about 12 inches up from your feeder make a link to a hook about 2 to 3 inches long. Cast out a fair distance, say 30 yeards at least or the rig will not work all that well.
Then tighten up carefully intil the pull on your line will just not make the feeder move.
Then put your rod in two rests, point the rod straight down the line and attatch a bobbin of bread paste on the line between reel and butt ring.
When the bobbin drops, lift the rod gently to set the hook.
This is known as the "bowstring bolt rig". It has been responsible for some of the biggest roach ever caught in stillwater.
If you have a bite on maggot and the bait is crushed or "sucked out" as it were, it means that the maggot has been right down the throat of the roach and has been crushed by its throat teeth. If you had struck at the right time you would have hooked your roach. Perhaps you should be float fishing.
If you want to leger, use a fairly heavy feeder, about 1/2 and about 12 inches up from your feeder make a link to a hook about 2 to 3 inches long. Cast out a fair distance, say 30 yeards at least or the rig will not work all that well.
Then tighten up carefully intil the pull on your line will just not make the feeder move.
Then put your rod in two rests, point the rod straight down the line and attatch a bobbin of bread paste on the line between reel and butt ring.
When the bobbin drops, lift the rod gently to set the hook.
This is known as the "bowstring bolt rig". It has been responsible for some of the biggest roach ever caught in stillwater.
J
jason fisher
Guest
if they are small fish less than a pound then a very soft quiver about 1/2 oz coupled with light lead on the end of a 4 turn waterknot paternoster will have you catching them. But if they are bigger fish let me know and i will email you a drawing of a rig which might help you out.
B
Big Rik
Guest
and if they are bigger than 2lb, then e-mail me and I'll visit your lake and show you first hand......
J
jason fisher
Guest
now now rik you'll be joining the circus next
D
Dave Barringham
Guest
Fixed paternoster - 3-feet tail (to start with), 9-inch bomb link (or feeder link). 1.5 pound bottom (0.10 - 0.12mm dia.), 2.5 - 3 pound main line. Smaller hook possibly. But the important bit is to try a SWINGTIP instead of the quiver...however, it may be a better idea to try some of the ideas already suggested if it means you having to buy extra gear.
B
Big Rik
Guest
Warren has lent me his clowns nose, so I'm getting there....
Anybody got Gerry Cottles number?
Anybody got Gerry Cottles number?
R
Ron Troversial Clay
Guest
A swing tip is an excellent idea. Tony Miles has caught lots of big still water roach by using a weighted swing tip pulled out almost straight with the bowstring bolt rig. The indication of a bite is when the tip drops of course.
And using this technique its surprising that you hook nearly all your roach neatly in the lips.
And using this technique its surprising that you hook nearly all your roach neatly in the lips.
R
Ron Troversial Clay
Guest
Some anglers also use a length of power gum or pole elastic tied in beween the line and the feeder. The principle is simple. Everything is so balanced that when a roach picks up the bait, the feeder will move forward quickly by the spring in the line or elastic, thus setting the hook much faster than you could by striking.
Way back in the 60s, someone invented a device called "The Autostrike". I've forgotten on what principle it worked but there may have been similarities to this rig.
The autostrike never caught on and was criticised heavily in the press as being unsporting. If the concept of the bolt rig had been invented then, I am sure this would have been similarly criticised. I say "concept" mainly because the bolt rig is certainly not new and goes back many years under other guises.
Way back in the 60s, someone invented a device called "The Autostrike". I've forgotten on what principle it worked but there may have been similarities to this rig.
The autostrike never caught on and was criticised heavily in the press as being unsporting. If the concept of the bolt rig had been invented then, I am sure this would have been similarly criticised. I say "concept" mainly because the bolt rig is certainly not new and goes back many years under other guises.
J
jason fisher
Guest
the main problem i've found with the swing tip is unless you have a range of different weighted tips or a handy supply of lead wire they are nigh on impossible to use in the wind. if you do happen to have the materials to use them then they are certainly a good idea.
also have a look at the summer roach fishing thread that was started within the last month in the coarse fishing section, there might be something useful in there.
I may as well describe the large roach rig that i was going to email anyway.
also have a look at the summer roach fishing thread that was started within the last month in the coarse fishing section, there might be something useful in there.
I may as well describe the large roach rig that i was going to email anyway.
J
jason fisher
Guest
roach rig.
using 3 or 4 lb mainline depending on the size of the fish you expect to encounter.
First thread on a small piece of float silicon.
Then thread on a suitable sized bead.
next either a drilled bullet(as in my original rig) if you are using drilled bullets it is best to thread a piece of silicon tube through the middle and glue it in place leaving 1 to 2 mm of silicon protruding either side before putting it on the line or thread on a run ring to allow the weight to be changed.
next thread on a second bead below the ring.
finally tie on a small swivel, the smallest you can get.
lastly tie on a suitable hooklength in daytlight i wouldn't use anything other the fluorocarbon for this now.in a breaking strain at least 1 lb less than your main line.
finally set the ammount of movement you want in the rig.
anywhere between 1 and 18 inches up from the swivel pinch a number 4 shot onto the piece of silicon. don't bite it onto the line you want the top bead to hit the shot and set the hook but the shot to fall off if it gets snagged.
using 3 or 4 lb mainline depending on the size of the fish you expect to encounter.
First thread on a small piece of float silicon.
Then thread on a suitable sized bead.
next either a drilled bullet(as in my original rig) if you are using drilled bullets it is best to thread a piece of silicon tube through the middle and glue it in place leaving 1 to 2 mm of silicon protruding either side before putting it on the line or thread on a run ring to allow the weight to be changed.
next thread on a second bead below the ring.
finally tie on a small swivel, the smallest you can get.
lastly tie on a suitable hooklength in daytlight i wouldn't use anything other the fluorocarbon for this now.in a breaking strain at least 1 lb less than your main line.
finally set the ammount of movement you want in the rig.
anywhere between 1 and 18 inches up from the swivel pinch a number 4 shot onto the piece of silicon. don't bite it onto the line you want the top bead to hit the shot and set the hook but the shot to fall off if it gets snagged.
R
Ron Troversial Clay
Guest
Oh by the way, another trick to hit delicately biting roach in either river or still water is by the following.
In a river you fish upstream.
Use a fairly heavy in line feeder in the normal way and a short hooklink, say 3 inches.
When your feeder hits bottom, tighten into it thereby putting a fair bend in your quiver tip until the force of the tip WILL NOT QUITE CAUSE THE FEEDER TO MOVE.
Any bite from a fish will cause the feeder to dislodge and shoot forward, thereby pricking the fish. The fish will generally bolt, hooking itself. A bite is often signalled by the tip jumping back and then the next second whipping around as the fish is hooked. This works well at short range.
Oooohh we are giving some secrets away arn't we....
)
In a river you fish upstream.
Use a fairly heavy in line feeder in the normal way and a short hooklink, say 3 inches.
When your feeder hits bottom, tighten into it thereby putting a fair bend in your quiver tip until the force of the tip WILL NOT QUITE CAUSE THE FEEDER TO MOVE.
Any bite from a fish will cause the feeder to dislodge and shoot forward, thereby pricking the fish. The fish will generally bolt, hooking itself. A bite is often signalled by the tip jumping back and then the next second whipping around as the fish is hooked. This works well at short range.
Oooohh we are giving some secrets away arn't we....
)
R
Ron Troversial Clay
Guest
Yes Jason I have used a rig amost identical to yours and can confirm have effective it is.
Swing tips are not used so much these days. You can use a weighted "Ringle" or a "Popeye" together with a bite alarm.
Any of you know what a "Ringle" or a "Popeye" is?
Swing tips are not used so much these days. You can use a weighted "Ringle" or a "Popeye" together with a bite alarm.
Any of you know what a "Ringle" or a "Popeye" is?
Graham Whatmore
Senior Member
4lb fluoro-mainline.
Thread on a plastic stop knot.
Helicopter rig with a 3" fluoro-hooklength.
Thread on bead.
Tie on small swivel.
1ft of 2lb fluoro line.
Attach 1oz bomb.
Catch fish.
Thread on a plastic stop knot.
Helicopter rig with a 3" fluoro-hooklength.
Thread on bead.
Tie on small swivel.
1ft of 2lb fluoro line.
Attach 1oz bomb.
Catch fish.
R
Ron Troversial Clay
Guest
So your'e a fluoro addict like me Graham.
What brand do you use?
What brand do you use?
A ringle is a horseshoe shaped indicator used pretty much the same way as a bobbin. Where the ends of the shoe are, they are joined by the horizontal bar. You wrap lead wire around the bar as required.
No idea on a "Popeye" apart from the usual spinach-scoffing-sailor guy!
No idea on a "Popeye" apart from the usual spinach-scoffing-sailor guy!