Let's talk Roach

[Ron Troversial Clay]

I've noticed very few articles and threads on FM about catching roach.

Roach are one of our more popular species. Yet the art of catching quality roach seems to be sidelined these days due the the incredible popularity of barbel. I intend to do a bit more roach fishing this winter than in the past. We have had an interesting thread on the roach of the Severn.

Let's talk a little bit about big roach and the best methods of catching them.

Over to you.

 

[Baz]

The thing I learned about the bigger roach, is that they are a solitary fish.
Before I am jumped on, let me say, I am not talking of the Severn or where Bob James had that bumper catch on passsion for angling,I am talking of my local canal.
I spent years fishing for them in different places on the cut. If I was lucky, I'd get one to about half a pound, then the bream would move in.
The lesson I learned was not to put too much bait in, as it always attracted other species.
I started getting better quality roach, when I either fed a main swim, and fished away from this main area, or put very little bait in one swim and fish that. On this last method my best canal roach was a pound and a half, and I honestly thought I had a bream on, it fought that good, slow and thumping, as it took me by surprise. I wouldn't get any more out of this swim, as it was a matter of picking them off or trying to lay an ambush so to speak.

 

[Baz]

Another point is, although I thought I had a few good spots ear marked, next to outlet pipes or underneath the back of a canal barge that hadn?t moved for a couple of months, on nice misty mornings, these places were for the romantics amongst us, as I always caught out in the open down the boat channel.
Maybe the wiser roach used the open areas to avoid the pike, of which there are plenty.
I?ll have to stop this as it is making me think of getting my roach tackle out again.
A Harrison 12? match rod, coupled with an Aero Match 111, and a set of porcupine quill floats or the Peter Drennan canal greys, you couldn?t get more sensitive than that. All the little tricks you learn are soon lost when you start to target other species. I think I?ve just talked myself back into doing a bit.
Incidentally, I allways found evenings the best time.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Two very good posts Baz.

Most anglers only think there are tiny roach in canals. Don't you believe it.

Get a copy of Graham's book: "Advanced Coarse Fishing". In the chapter on roach he describes the experiences he had as a boy of the old bloke who fished his local canal who really knew how to get the big roach out of it.

When I was no more than a kid I met a very similar character on the Chesterfield Canal near Worksop. This old guy caught some whoppers from this canal. He used bread paste most of the time and the occasional lobworm - nothing else. He scorned the Sheffield anglers who fished there with "pimping" tackle as he called it - you know - 20 hook, single maggot, cloud bait.

This guy used 10 and 12 hooks and he used a bit of sloppy mashed bread or a few chpped worms for groundbait. He fished right under his rod tip, at least a foot over depth, next to rush beds or as close to the other bank as possible, never in the middle of the canal.

He always fishing into the evening, winter and summer. His catches were astounding. Whether he ever caught any two pound roach I can't say but he caught lots over 1 1/2 lbs. Those fish looked huge to my eyes.

I shall never forget him. He had an old 11 foot Wallis Wizard rod and a wooden centre-pin reel. He could roll a cigarette from thick black navy shag with one hand. I can still smell that tobacco.

 

[Graham Whatmore]

Canal roach will mostly be found under some sort of cover, barge, bush, tree, it gives them protection from predators. Caster and hemp reign supreme in my experience, though bread punch will sort some out as well, aspecially when its clear.

One thing for sure though the pole is the best way to fish because you can put the bait right on the button every time and keep it there. I don't care how good a person is at casting he will never put it under an overhanging bush, its physically impossible, even letting the tow take it under doesn't work because it drifts out the other side. Add to this the fact that most of the fish will be up on the top shelf close to the bank and given that most far banks are overgrown with ramblers and the like then its not hard to see why its near impossible.

I used to fish one of the canals in the heart of Birmingham and I've had many many big roach of 1.5lbs on hemp and caster there to the accompaniment of rush hour traffic. There is some cracking canal sport in Birmingham and one of the best spots was right underneath spaghetti junction, amazing isn't it?

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Not really amazing at all Graham.

A few years ago I did a picture feature for Angling Star on the roach fishing in the South Yorks Navigation canal right in the middle of Rotherham. I got Dave Parkes, one of our local tackle dealers to go out and catch them one the pole.

He caught over 15 pounds of belting roach by fishing the pole using casters fished under some willows on the opposite bank. There were many fish over 1 pound in that bag.

I then bought a pole from Dave and caught lots of good ones myself, until my pole was nicked.

I agree fully, the pole is the business for big canal roach. You also need one of those special rod rests that swing away to rest your pole.

 

[Baz]

Good stuff ron,
what you have just said, took me a long time to realize, if I wanted the bigger roach.
I hope somebody can pick a bit of useful information out of my roach fishing days on the canal.
To start with, although it is classed as a still water, (land locked) there is plenty of movement, and at times too much. This is when my 8 foot winkle picker rod would come out, but I never had much luck on this method. It was always better to let a float drift over a baited area.
Although the surface layer of the water was moving from right to left, the bottom layer nearly always moved from left to right. Something to think about as the roach usually face into the flow, which would affect the direction in which I would strike into a fish. My float was always positioned to my left so I would be striking against the surface flow.
2lb mainline with a 12 inch 1.75 hook link and a size 20 or 18 hook, buried in a caster, which was my favourite bait fished over a bed of hemp seed. I would have a constant supply of casters on the go, depending on the time of year I would buy one or two pints of white maggots a week, and turn them myself, even taking them to work with me as I was very fussy as to how I wanted the finished product.
Once I had them to a light brown colour, I would then line a bait box with damp newspaper, put a piece of plastic bag over the box, then put the lid on. And put them in the fridge. The next morning they would be a really nice deep red colour and very crisp. At this stage they would go into a bucket of water ready for the evening session.
Shamefully, as what seemed like years, it suddenly dawned on me that the canal was full of match anglers all doing what I was doing and catching the same 8oz or a little more stamp roach.
As I said, the penny suddenly dropped that if I wanted better, I would have to do something different, and use other baits than caster.
One elderly chap used cheese, the triangular type that came in a round cardboard box. That is when I started to use size sixteen and fourteen hooks with cheese, bread, or single sweet corn. And that is when I started getting the bigger roach, not as many but deffinately bigger.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

When I get some money, I must fully compliment my tackle by acquiring a pole. What do you recommend Graham for canal fishing?

The last thing I am interested in catching is carp on the pole. When I fished this canal I used no 3 elastic to a size 18 rig if I remember. The Pole was a Daiwa - 12.5 metres long.

 

[Baz]

Although I agree entirely with what Graham says about the pole being the best method for presentation, and getting under the bushes, I find a pole hard work, but I am not knocking it. Every man to his own.
Personally I get great satisfaction in side casting a float under the low hanging trees and in between the bushes. There was one tree in particular a soft leafed holly, that I could actually cast into and not get caught up. The far bank for me was full of bream, carp, and pike. It?s amazing how different canals can fish so differently to each other.
Sadly, rod and line fishing has become a pretty rare thing on canals today. And it does have its advantages over a pole. Distance being one of them. But that is getting off the subject.

 

[John Jones]

My mucker Graham is spot on about the quality roach in Birmingham's inner city canals.

Trouble is if you want to fish for them you have to take the Black Watch along for protection!

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

I have spent hours watching roach in little rivers like the Warks Leam, Upper Ouse and River Ryton in Notts when I was a kid.

Often you get a shoal of roach that will be composed of many of different sizes. The small ones swim higher in the water and will be on the look out for any food that comes along. They are easy to catch by the normal match style methods. The bigger roach hang back and pick up food from the bottom. As evening approaches it seems that the big roach push out the little one and then get their heads down.

On the Leam there were some whoppers. I have had some excellent catches of these fish using bread flake fished upstream using a tiny feeder with liquidised bread in it.

So has Tony Miles, who pinpointed a few good roach swims for me.

 

[John Jones]

Baz is right. You dont always need a pole to catch quality roach from a canal.

While it is true the pole offers the best presentation for fishing the far bank or up against a barge, there are times when big roach are right under your feet.

On the B'ham/Worcs canal one of the favoured methods is cheese paste on a little waggler hard against the inside rushes just a few feet from where you are sitting.

Around the Tibberton area I have had lots of fish over a pound in less than 2ft of water. The secret is to sit well back and introduce small helpings of an alternative bait such as pinkies or caster.

This seems to attract the bigger fish amongst the bits who then take the larger smellier bait.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

When I pole fished the local canal, I indeed found it hard work. Then I was hown a little device called a "Clever Claw" by Dave Parkes.

This device will grip the bottom end of your pole whilst you put the other bit in a secure rod rest. This holds your pole securely taking the strain off your forearms. When you get a bite, the claw will swing away. I was going to get one of these devices just before my pole was nicked.

The guy that makes them is Nick Palmer of "Real Ideas". I met him at the recent match we had on the Tidal Trent.

He has a web site: www.cleverclaw.com

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

"Take the Black Watch for protection."

Whenever I read comments like this and I'm not getting at you John, I often wonder if we are living in a civilised society.

Oh shut up Clay, concentrate on roach fishing!

 

[Graham Whatmore]

Poles are quite cheap and rather than going for the all singing all dancing ones have a look at some of the cheaper ones on the market. Some of the most enjoyable canal fishing I ever had was with a Shakespeare 12.5 mtr and a number 4 elastic but 14.5 mtr is probably the best length to go for. The lighter the better, around 800gms/900gms, and if it was just for canals Ron I would opt for a second hand one, you would pick up a pretty good one for ?100 to ?150 but you must have a couple of spare top 3's with it. Just make sure its not one of these carp poles because you won't need any more than a No.4 elastic and carp poles tend to be slightly heavier because they are reinforced, the cheaper ones anyway.

I'll have a look at the Shaky range Ron and let you know later.

 

[Coops]

I love roach fishing. Since I have lived in Peterborough I have spent many really good sessions experimenting with roach on the Nene. There are miles of river that hardly get fished.

Although I'm yet to find a 'two' there are roach to well over 1lb and the best bait for the bigger fish has to be a lob tail.

Find a nice crease swim and link leger a half inch piece of lobworm with the 14 fine wire hook nicked through the 'wound' end of the worm and the bigger roach nearly drag the rod in.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Thanks Graham.

A met a guy a little while ago who spent nearly ?4k on a pole. On the first trip out a carp smashed one of the joints. He was gutted. It cost several hundreds of pounds to replace the joint.

I would also appreciate a pole that is not decorated up to the nines with a dirty great big advertising blurb complete with fluorescent paint on the bottom joint.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

And that looks like a real class roach that you are holding Coops.

What did it weigh?

 

[Baz]

One tip I can give to anybody wanting to find the bigger roach on the canal or any other species, is to wait until we have had a good frost and it is frozen over.
I have one of these smart lamps which is very powerful, (it also comes in handy for accidentally shining in illegal angler eyes) It does not bother the fish although a heavy foot fall will. One year people were complaining that the bream had vanished, I can tell you that there were plenty and very active under the ice.
Also in one area there would be lots of roach in the 8oz bracket, but walk a couple of miles and you would find the bigger roach although smaller in numbers. Fish spotting in this manner is good fun and very rewarding, you will be surprised at what you can see though the ice, and therefore get to know on where to target.
I watched an upper double carp last night with the aid of my lamp. As I say, the light of the lamp doesn?t bother them.

 

[Big Rik]

Coops roach was 2-11, photo'd by my fair hand.

Sway lakes, back in early 2001.
Story and pics
It also won a Fox ?50 weekly award as I mailed it to the paper for him and the selfish git didn't even buy me a beer.