If RW hadn't caught Clarissa?

geoffmaynard

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On the roach thread cg74 asks "Where would Walker's legacy be now if he hadn't caught Clarissa"

It's true Clarissa focussed the entire angling world's attention on him but I think he would still be the most highly regarded angler of his time and still revered today. We needed a 'rock-star' at the time and he was the right man with the right qualifications in the right place at the right time.

Agree/disagree?
 

jayh

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Got to agree there Geoff. Walker's legacy is much more than Clarissa. I remember reading his articles in A.T as a boy & could only wonder & dream.
 

Sean Meeghan

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Hmm... Not so sure. What if someone else had caught Clarissa? After all even Walker admitted that it was a matter of luck. Would he have been as famous if Peter Tombleson had caught the big 'un?

Probably not.
 

Tee-Cee

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It all comes down to right time/right place as with most things in life.Luck is always a factor but with him(Walker)he still had to find the place(Redmire),he still had to work out how he was going to catch them and then he had to do it!
Its this that most people seem to overlook when running him down-the man had a good brain and he did what many anglers don't do-THINK deeply about every aspect of the sport and try yo be as successful as possible...
I don't know how he found Redmire-mabe he had friends in high places but I don't think so....and yes it could have been someone else BUT how many at the time could have done it .....3/4 people(maybe)....

I did go to Redmire and standing on the dam looking over the water I still found it staggering that such a water could produce such a fish!

...and I will always be grateful to him for what he did for me-he,and nobody else made me think about my sport and for me he deserved his success-every single bit of it!
 

dezza

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I did go to Redmire and standing on the dam looking over the water I still found it staggering that such a water could produce such a fish!

Nothing more than a farm pond really.

Yet for a period the water was extremely rich. The bloodworm and daphnia content of the water was tremendous. Today, I am told, the lake is only a shadow of what it used to be.
 

noknot

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Walker was indeed a great thinking angler, when he caught the "44" he was not lucky! He obviously had the bait in the right place at the right time, and that's all that counts! Also he was a well respected angler and writer on all disciplines of angling, so I would say he would still be famous without the 44! But I must just add there were at the time better Carp anglers than Walker, that caught many great Carp, even though not of the same size!
To me Walker started modern day Carp angling (or the interest) and if he could see the Carp "circus" today (which he sparked) would probably turn in his grave, and never have fished Redmire.
 

Merv Harrison

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Nothing more than a farm pond really.

Yet for a period the water was extremely rich. The bloodworm and daphnia content of the water was tremendous. Today, I am told, the lake is only a shadow of what it used to be.

Ron,it was only a farm pond, but some of the 'top' anglers of the day were fishing it....the thought has often crossed my mind, but had it been caught previously, but never reported by the captor to maintain the 'secrecy' of the pond. Have you any knowledge ??.
 

Mark Wintle

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The previous year (1951) Bob Richards had caught a new record carp of 31lbs which I believe put Walker and others on the trail of Redmire.
 

dezza

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What made Walker want to catch a really big carp was the fact that a number of ichthyologists had stated that carp would never grow to a size larger than 40 lbs in the UK. When he saw a few huge carp - for the time - in Bernithan Court Lake, (its proper name) Walker set out to fish this water hoping that he, or any other member of the Carp Catcher's Club would catch, by design, a fish that would confound the scientists.

Bob Richards 31 1/4 pounder was the fish that led to Walker getting permission to fish at Bernithan. The fact that he did get permission was probably a greater feat of Walker's talents than catching the 40 pounder on rod and line.

And without Pete Thomas' help, that fish would never have been landed.
 
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Tee-Cee

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Sorry to labour the point but I still don't know HOW this tiny little water(fairly)deep in the Herefordshire countryside came to the notice of Walker & Co in the first place.......lets face it,its not exactly easy to find is it?

Also,we are talking about the early 50's when telephones did not exist in everyones home so communication was not as it is today.....not to mention the journey to and from the place-must've been a nightmare-no motorways and cars not exactly reliable,all of which would've put most people off...

No,its not THAT important-I'm just interested and maybe others are as well...so for the sake of angling history does anyone actually know??
 

Mark Wintle

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TeeCee,

News of the record caught by Bob Richards in 1951 would have been reported in the Fishing Gazette and Angler's News.
 

Jeff Woodhouse

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cg74 asks "Where would Walker's legacy be now if he hadn't caught Clarissa"
That was the original question. The answer is - who knows?

The man was talented as a writer and a communicator, this is witnessed by his thousands of contributions to Angling Times and other journals of the day. He was a thinker, had to be, dreaming up all that stuff to challenge his and other people's minds for all that time. Most of all, he could apply his thoughts to his fishing and through them become more successful as an angler regardless of whether he always caught the biggest fish.

What Clarissa did for him was to give him an enormous leg up, propelled him into the limelight and gave him a podium from which to inform and educate other anglers.

It was chance, you can argue, but he was also prepared for it in his education and his other talents. He may still have made it, in time, but she drew a great big line under his name for years to come!
 

dezza

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Walker was in contact with Don Leney of the Surrey Trout Farm, Haslemere.

He got Don to send him a copy of virtually every invoice for the stockings undertaken by the STF in the 30s and 40s. Redmire was stocked with 50 carp about 8 inches long in 1934. The owner had a problem with weed and Leney suggested a few carp might help to keep the weed down.

Redmire was also stocked with trout in the 30s - Leney again!

Walker spent a lot of time, expecially with BB and Maurice Ingham contacting the receptors of the "Leney Strain" of common and mirror carp as they came to be known.

I fished, with Tag Barnes, a Yorkshire lake near Pateley Bridge that was stocked with Leney fish. On the one occasion in 1965 using bread flake I caught a 9 lbs 15oz mirror which was the third largest carp taken in Yorkshire that year.

The Leney fish in actual fact were not British. Most of them came from the "Nederlandsche Heidemaatschappje" in Arnhem - Holland.

---------- Post added at 17:11 ---------- Previous post was at 17:03 ----------

The man was talented as a writer and a communicator, this is witnessed by his thousands of contributions to Angling Times and other journals of the day. He was a thinker, had to be, dreaming up all that stuff to challenge his and other people's minds for all that time. Most of all, he could apply his thoughts to his fishing and through them become more successful as an angler regardless of whether he always caught the biggest fish

As Jeff says, Walker was a great communicator. He, as a coarse fisherman, was also an intellectual, something that was rare to find in the field of coarse angling. I hope that doesn't sound like I'm making Walker out to be a snob, as he was not like this at all. In fact Walker baulked at the terms "game" and "coarse".

Because of who he was, he elevated coarse angling, taking it out of the "cloth cap, spittoon and whippet" image that many game anglers gave to this part of our sport.
 
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the indifferent crucian

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Chris Yates became a friend Of Donald Leney in his later years as they both lived in Haslemere, ...I'm not sure from whom he got them, but Chris Ball has a lot of those stocking lists now and we have discovered that a lot of waters local to Haslemere were also stocked with Leney's 'Galician' carp.

In fact a 41lb er was caught this year that is possibly one of the last alive.
 

dezza

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Kevin Clifford is in the process of updating his excellent book: "A History of Carp Fishing". A lot of the facts regarding the early history of carp fishing in England will be laid out.

This is one book I will not miss. I have the first edition which was also very informative.
 

Tee-Cee

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Thanks for information Ron-makes more sense now!

IC.....I seem to remember an episode of 'Passion for Angling'(the one where Yates went after the carp called Harry on that beautiful seclude water....)and he was talking in the pub with the gamekeeper when he produced a book or ledger of Lennys records indicating where and who bought fish from his company(bit of guesswork or embelishment in what I've said!).............perhaps this the same book that you mention above.............

I find this all very interesting............I love all this angling history-carp,Walker et al-just facinating...........

Anyway I shall buy the Clifford book when available-perhaps you would let us know when this might be Ron(if you don't mind)?
 

dezza

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Oh that carp "Harry"!!!!!

:j:j:j:j:j

What more can I say?

---------- Post added at 12:26 ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 ----------

We must never let the facts stand in the way of a good story!

;)
 

Rodney Wrestt

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On the roach thread cg74 asks "Where would Walker's legacy be now if he hadn't caught Clarissa"

It's true Clarissa focussed the entire angling world's attention on him but I think he would still be the most highly regarded angler of his time and still revered today. We needed a 'rock-star' at the time and he was the right man with the right qualifications in the right place at the right time.

Agree/disagree?
Hmmmmm, not sure about R.W but Ron's post count would be down at least 50% :D
 
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