Question for all you floatfishers...

[captainbarnacles]

I,d keep the same setup but instead of watching the float , watch for the line to slacken and strike on that. Thats why the polaris was invented.

 

[Tee-Cee]

Philip......Perhaps I'm reading it incorrectly but having just read your last post it seems to me that you're trying to fishing two entirely different methods at the SAME TIME-the Lift method AND the Sliding float method........

In 15' of water only be the Sliding float method can work effectively(for ease of casting etc),unless you have a very,very long rod-in the same way the lift method can only be really effective in water up to 8' deep or so,and even this is pushing your luck when trying to cast with the float set(overdepth)at 10' or more as required by this method.

As I say I could well be misreading your postin which case please let me know!!

 

[captainbarnacles]

you are correct tee cee he is fishing 2 dif methods the slider and lift at same time, As i have advised him he either strikes on line going slack or uses diferent method. i would prob recomend in 15 ft of water that he uses a quivertip with feeder or bomb dependent on feed tactics. That way he can put a slight bend in the quiver to detect the dropback.

 

[Tee-Cee]

Yes,I agree a feeder is a good alternative but the slider is very nice to use(I love to watch a float!!)and can be deadly if shotted correctly....

I have mentioned before I made some 12/14" loaded sliders some years ago(from Sarkandas reed)to fish for tench in very deep water over heavy weed growth(even at that depth!).The swim was very tight,under big oaks and the cast considerable so I loaded the floats to stop them travelling back towards me after casting-and it worked beautifully!!
Because the shotting was worked out over time(and with patience)the heavy shotting involved did not stop even very small fish sinking the float and the time I spent(some 3/4 months from working out a plan)taking fish from that swim proved well worth the effort.........
I still look at those floats(hardly ever used since)and they reinforce the premise that effort = results................well,some of the time anyway!!

I hope Philip comes back on this subject......as I hope others do........................

 

[captainbarnacles]

he could also use the polaris this would show both lift and slide away and enable the float to be used , would be my prefered method.

 

[the indifferent crucian]

It's fairly clear, reading this thread, that many people are confusing fishing the 'lift method' with fising for lift bites.

They aren't the same thing.


The true' 'lift method' uses a pice of quill long enough that when it is raised by the weight being lifted by the taking fish, the float topples over and lays flat on the surface. As it topples it takes the weight of the shot briefly, thus not letting the fish feel the weight as it takes the bait down.

At least that is the description as given by John Wilson, who goes on to say that more has been written wrongly about the method than any other style of fishing.

Personally, I would have thought the fish would detect the weight the very moment it dislodged it and before the float canted over, but if JW says that's how it works, who am I to argue?

I would also wonder about how well it would work fished over-depth. JW says it must be plumbed with absolute accuracy, but then goes on to say it works well over-depth with the bait walked across the bottom.

I think either way only works if the fish are in the mood to take a bait and eat it there and then. If they are in the mood to take and run, you will never get a lift bite, you'll get a 'sail-away' and your shot will act like a bolt-rig to set the hook.

 

[captainbarnacles]

Well to me a lift is a lift is a lift , even if it lifts a fraction its still a lift. J w is right that he fishes it dead bottom as i would , then every movement can be detected , but as for the float laying flat thats ok in a perfect world but we aint in one are we, fishing back in jw ,s and my young days were a dam sight different than they are now. And also the places jw fishes too ,like all on telly who we all seem to believe are experts , well they aint realy they just got more money than us ,the best places to fish and time means nothing to them, so when you think about it there ruddy entitled to catch arnt they. Get them to come out with any of us on our waters and see if they can catch then. On the ouse in the seventies you could fish for bream on the lift and boy did it lift , fly a foot out of the water, not today bream have gotten stealthy no more here i am take me , you have to work for it now. I fish a place where if you have anymore than 2mm of float showing you cant see a bite.And i,m talking pole float too, but thats how i,ve addapted my fishing not by keep doing the things i did in the seventies , of course i,m doing the same style but thinking a lot more now than i had to then. Change all the time right or wrong . Just because jw or m h says its right dont mean it is. There are around 6 different styles of float fishing ie: waggler , trotting , lift , on the drop , on the bottom , laying on. if i missed any i,m sorry , but in those 6 styles are a million variations none of which are right or wrong if they suit you and the conditions on the day. Shotting patterns are endless , floats styles are endless , thats what makes fishing what it is , the endless changes. Graham says you have to fish well over depth jw says fish dead wieght as i do niether graham or i or mr wilson are right or wrong , there just our persepsion of how it should be . But when your talking lift method whatever float your useing thin thick or long piece of quill if the wieght is keeping it down and the fish picks up the bait the float will LIFT. and just to add a swann shot is not a bolt rig , it aint big enough to prick a buggies bum on a cold day.tight lines.

 

[Ray Daywalker Clarke]

Personally, I would have thought the fish would detect the weight the very moment it dislodged it and before the float canted over, but if JW says that's how it works, who am I to argue?

I am with you 100% on this part of the lift method.

To fish the lift method in the correct way, the line must be tight from the weight back to the rod, without that tension the method wouldn't work. To release that tension the weight must be moved first, therefore the fish must detect the weight.

I am sure we have been over this before on FM, but it's good to go over it again.

I would like to ask members, how do you set up to fish the lift method. It would be interesting to see who does what.

 

[captainbarnacles]

Well ray i fish the lightest i can get away with in a given situation , flat calm lake , i normally fish swan or crow quill , Small enough so the minimum shot needed to sink it, some times a float of only 3 inches with a swan on the deck ,if you want the float to lay flat as suggested then all your shot has to be on the deck ,If i have to fish with a larger float then i will have a bulk 2 thirds down and a shot on the bottom the float will only lift a small amount , but is still a lift to me whatever way you do it. And the way i prefer to do it as i have less wieght for the fish to feel.These are my 2 ways . They work for me. And lets now take in to account the lift method and what it was designed for, I had always believed it was designed for bream. because of the way a bream feeds, if youve ever watch bream feeding they come in to the feed in a horizontal position , that making the mouth because of there shape around 3 inches off the deck for a medium sized bream, now when it goe,s down to feed it upends its self nose downward grabs the bait then rights its self back to horizontal ,therfore the bait rises with the fish and brings about the lift bite. Now you will only get a lift bite if you are fishing the lift method , therefore i would say that they are one in the same thing. And you can fish with a swing tip under tention , a quiver tip under tension, a piece of plasticine on the line , a monkey climber , or float they will all show a lift bite or if you prefer a drop back it all amounts to the same thing only in a different style. Tight lines

 

[Ray Daywalker Clarke]

Well I have had lift bites when fishing a waggler on still waters, this IMO comes about because the fish is lifting the weight up in the water, therefore making the float rise and start to lay flat.

I fish the lift method with a small bit of peacock quill, 3 to 4 inches in size.

The shot is on the bottom, and the float set over depth. I fish over depth to match the float, so a 3 inch float, i fish 3 inches over depth. When i cast out, the float lays flat, I tighten the line so the float tip is set just above the water. When a fish moves the bait and the weight, the float will lift and start to lay flat again.

I have also found that i get lift bites when I fish the slider method.

 

[captainbarnacles]

I said that wrong didnt i , of course you will always get a rise on any float as long as the fish lifts the wieght high enough, just depends where the wieght is. We fish basicly the same but i dont tighten down i set dead depth so the float is set by the shot.

 

[alan whittington]

Well I have had lift bites when fishing a waggler on still waters, this IMO comes about because the fish is lifting the weight up in the water, therefore making the float rise and start to lay flat.

I fish the lift method with a small bit of peacock quill, 3 to 4 inches in size.

The shot is on the bottom, and the float set over depth. I fish over depth to match the float, so a 3 inch float, i fish 3 inches over depth. When i cast out, the float lays flat, I tighten the line so the float tip is set just above the water. When a fish moves the bait and the weight, the float will lift and start to lay flat again.

I have also found that i get lift bites when I fish the slider method.

Ray,in normal 'slider' situations lift bites would be a relatively common occurance,as 'tell tale' shot would normally be relatively large ie no.1s up(unless fishing on the drop style in the last few feet of fall)for better presentation.
As for sensativity,certain species require more sensative floats and presentation than others ie crucians(among others),peacock quill is not particularly sensative as a float,due to its bouyancy,but shotting and fishing various depths make the different presentations sensative for the applications used,there is no set rules,for many top match anglers of the past and present,all have differing solutions to the same float fishing problems,all the experience float anglers on site will have their own little wrangles to try when certain setbacks are encountered,i know i have and many of my mates have 'benefited' from these.

 

[Ray Daywalker Clarke]

Alan,

Your right there is no rule set as to how anyone should fish any method, I know i am always mucking around with the shot and hook length's.

Thats why I asked how members set up for the lift method, it shows how different we all are.

I use Peacock Quill for a great deal of my fishing, I have hundreds of floats, sliders, wagglers, Cork and balsa floats, and some very old Quill's, but unless i am fishing ultra light, i haven't found anything better than a Peacock Quill, maybe thats why many wagglers etc are made from it.

When on the rivers it's a different matter for my stick float fishing.

 

[Philip]

Philip......Perhaps I'm reading it incorrectly but having just read your last post it seems to me that you're trying to fishing two entirely different methods at the SAME TIME-the Lift method AND the Sliding float method........

In 15' of water only be the Sliding float method can work effectively(for ease of casting etc),unless you have a very,very long rod-in the same way the lift method can only be really effective in water up to 8' deep or so,and even this is pushing your luck when trying to cast with the float set(overdepth)at 10' or more as required by this method.

As I say I could well be misreading your postin which case please let me know!!

Just to clarify, no, I am not trying to fish two different methods at the same time. Lets be clear if we take it text book, I am fishing a slider. However due to the way I am fishing it the majority of bites will appear like lift bites.

I'm fishing in 15+ foot of water, bulk shot a few inches from the hook, stop knot set a little over depth, I cast out let the shot settle on the bottom then slowly draw the line tight till the float cocks. When a fish picks up the bait it dislodges the shot, the float rises up keels over and I strike. If the fish picks up the baits and moves away from me into deeper water the float will sink and I strike.

In that respect it is like fishing the lift method, the difference is that the float is not fixed in position « classic » text book lift method style.

Someone mentioned it would be easier to fish a bomb and quiver...I agree it probably would be easier to fish a lead or a feeder, but I am fishing the float on purpose as I set myself a target to catch a fish on the float..no other reason really, just a challenge if you like.

 

[captainbarnacles]

Well theres 2 things you might try, You dont say how much bulk shot your useing , now if its say 2 aa then move one of them up the line a bit so that you have minimal shot on the deck , this might encourage the fish to hold on to the bait a bit longer and i would also try fishing dead depth , what will ensure a faster float lift instead of line going slack and then float movement.