Bob Southwell

[hugo curgudgeon]

I was fortunate enough to have met the great man and was talking to a realtives of his only the other day. There is little doubt that he was the greatest cane maker of his day. He supplied B.James & Co amongst others. Friends were lucky enough to have bought directly from Bob, they knew him better than I did. MK IV Avons, Carp and stepped up carp rods and Kennet Perfections. They were a dark coloured cane with no intermediate whippings and never took a set. I had not realised that Southwell designed the Wallis Wizard upon which FWK set his seal. Fascinating chat, I shall try and remember more.........


AS ever

Hugo

 

[Sean Meeghan]

It would be great to hear more Hugo. Whatever you think about cane (this means you Mr Clay) it's got to be said that we're in danger of forgetting the history of our fishing tackle.

 

[dezza]

Now now Mr. Meeghan, there is no greater champion of angling's history than myself.

However I am a realist and will never say that with one exception, cane is better that carbon, because quite simply it isn't! And I certainly have nothing against anglers who wish to use cane in preference to modern materials.

Where I do get a bit miffed is when these false traditionalists start putting on airs and graces and exuding false superiority because they fish with splt cane rods by Barder etc.

There is absolutely nothing superior about a Barder rod. I have handled one. The only thing that is superior is the amount of cash one is expected to disperse for these overweight anachronisms.

Of course I have used cane rods. I am probably old enough and qualified enough to talk about cane rods with a degree of reason. I have actually made cane rods and in their day, they were the best rods around.

But would I use them today? As an ornament on the wall - yes, as a practical angling tool - no way, not a damn.

And don't come that old chestnut about cane having a "soul". The cane used in fishing rods is dead, killed by the gas flame used to temper it.

And Bob Southwell did make the finest cane rods of all time.

 

[Fred Bonney]

Great response Ron.
I would certainly like to read more about Mr Southwell too.

Anybody want to buy a cane rod, I can't get on with my one, built just over a year ago by a man from Hull ?

 

[watatoad]

Having used and built both cane rods and split cane rods and yes greenheart tips on some and having even made my own split cane from raw material. I still have some and about once a year I pick up the rod given to me on my eighth birthday and give it a go just for a touch of nostalgia its cane with a greenheart tip and a wood handle, it certainly builds up the muscles in my right wrist and arm...hehehe

Even today I will fish with all of my rods but my personal preference for general fishing is a carbon for most spots although you can find me at least once a week with an old ABU hollowglass I just love them and will openly admit to preferring them to carbon rods. I use the carbons most often just for the weight saving when getting to the water and not for their actions. If I was fitter I would leave my carbons at home without a thought.

 

[Alan Tyler]

Cane still does what it was meant to do very well, just a bit more heavily.
I choose to bamboozle fish rather than carbonise them, if I possibly can; just get more fun out of it that way. Same goes for 'pins.
A session trying to Wallis a slider rig to the same spot soon reminds me when it's time to break out the carbon and egg-beaters...

Yes, Hugo, more about Mr Southwell, please!

Did he supply Dawson's at all, do you know? My old Sabina had a dark, highly-toasted look to it, which makes me wonder.
(no, I'm not trying to bump Dawson's prices; it may (or may not) have been a great blank, but as a rod, it left a lot to be desired). And I gave it away decades ago.

 

[fsouthwell]

I know this post is quite old but hopefully it is still active. Bob Southwell was my grandad. My dad (his son David) has many of his rods and feels that it is time to sell a few if his collection but he has no idea where to advertise or even enquire, I found this post and wondered if any of you had any suggestions.

Many thanks

Felicity

 

[Peter Jacobs]

I know this post is quite old but hopefully it is still active. Bob Southwell was my grandad. My dad (his son David) has many of his rods and feels that it is time to sell a few if his collection but he has no idea where to advertise or even enquire, I found this post and wondered if any of you had any suggestions.

Many thanks

Felicity

Hello Felicity,

Your grandad was one of the great rodmakers!

As for advertising his rods I would suggest firstly here on FishingMagic as many of us are cane rod collectors and users.

Fishing Tackle Classifieds; - FishingMagic Forums

Alternatively, you could try this forum as well:

The Traditional Fisherman's Forum • View forum - General Traditional Coarse Fishing Chat

If you prefer an auction site then try:

Angling Auctions

or,

Fishing Tackle Auction Details | Vintage Fishing Tackle | Mullock's Auctions

Whatever you do try to avoid e-bay as you are guaranteed much better prices at a proper auction.

Hope this helps, and Welcome to FishingMagic . . . . . . . . .

 

[the indifferent crucian]

I'm not sure I'd agree about auctions getting better prices. With it's huge audience ( is that the right word? ) it reaches a LOT of people, far more than might attend any auction.

A Southwell built rod, actually owned by the man himself, would be heady stuff indeed and might drive bidders into a frenzy!

As an example two of Ted Oliver's rods were recently on eBay. Ted was of course, initially a Southwell employee.


The bidding almost reached £2000 for the pair before the auction was pulled. Sadly the seller, a member oin here actually, always does that with his auctions so we don't know the price he got, but I'm betting he got £2000.

What I would say is this.


Be patient and don't sell them all at once. ( unless it's to me of course:wh )


You will only flood the market and drop the prices achieved.


What you want is good, honest advice as to what to sell and where and how often, so I can only concurr with Peter's advice about the Traditional Fishermans Forum because if anyone tried to pull a fast one the site owner, Mark, would be on him in a flash.


Whatever you do, ignore the private messages you have surely already recieved after your first post.


If you hadn't already realised.....in our circles your grandfather is a demi-god!

 

[carpman1945]

Hi Felicity
You really should get in touch with your Fathers best man and best friend for many years. Between us we have sold several "Bob" rods and are concerned you may be misled. To check our validity phone dad and tell him Peter (Best man at Mum and Dads wedding) and Robin have been in touch.Please send my best regards to David.
Robin.

 

[carpman1945]

Well gentlemen all attempts to contact Felicity have failed which is odd but should anybody hear of any of the rods turning up would be interested to hear about. You all have a great 2014 and Tight Lines. Robin Ottaway.

 

[the indifferent crucian]

Yes indeed, and none of Bob's rods seem to have appeared on the market.

Not that I could have afforded one anyway........

 

[carpman1945]

Here is a question i cannot find an answer to why was Mr Southwell called "BOB".Here is another has anybody ever seen the "cooking device" supposedly used to bake the rods. A friend spent many hours in the Captain (the shop in West Croydon) and although he saw many rods being flamed he never saw any other process. He also confirms that the colour of Bobs rods were varied and could be light or dark and all shades inbetween (he has 5 and all are different.)

 

[fsouthwell]

Hello gentlemen, apologies for the delay... (a few years) I totally forgot I had done this post for my dad and then lost the login details, I do appear to have some pm's aswell, i'll reply to them shortly. Dad moved a few times so put off the sale of the rods, he has now gifted me the task of restarting the process! Delights of being a daughter I shall start the research into the very helpful advice you have left me.

On a separate note, we always called granddad bob as I was always told his name was Robert Southwell.

---------- Post added at 09:21 ---------- Previous post was at 09:17 ----------

Ps. Peter and dad are now in contact... thanks to his lovely daughter.

 

[the indifferent crucian]

I've had a bit more information come my way in the interim. Bob's shop was apparently called J W Southwell because he had taken over his father's firm. This CW name causing some of us to think maybe Bob was a nickname rather than just the usual diminutive of Robert.

As to the heating device, I too was told it didn't exist, but later I learned that it did!

John Ollif-Cooper wrote of it but I was told there was no such thing, only to learn that in later life there was. How did I finally learn the truth? Paul Cook told me that Clive Young, shortly before his death, wrote to him saying how he had bought it, along with a 'cane straightening device' when Bob retired. Bob and Clive had worked together at Clive's father shop in Harrow.

Now I have no idea where either device is now, but I do have an idea that Clive just might have mistaken what that 'cane straightening device ' was . It just might be the thing about which Richard Walker conversed with Bob about.....an invention of Bob's which excited the great man very much indeed!

I have a shot here of Bob with carp fishing historian Chris Ball taken in 1991, but can't remember how to upload to this forum.

You can always contact me through my vintage tackle blog on the 'about' page:

https://nobbystackle.wordpress.com/

There's a fair bit about Bob on there.......

 

[greenie62]

Hi Nobby,
Thanks for the link to your blog. A really good read and summary of Tackle-making history. Highly reccommended to anyone who's interested in what happened the day before yesterday!
Tight Lines :thumbs:

 

[the indifferent crucian]

Thank-you, that's most kind of you. Thought I'd jot some of it down before I forget it all.....:wh

 

[Classic Angling]

I'm trying to put together a profile of Bob for the next edition of Classic Angling and would be hugely grateful for any info about him, particularly dates, and especially photos. A key figure in rod-making whose contribution needs to be recognised, I reckon. Some of you take Classic Angling, I know, but you can phone me on 01480 4941242 if you want to chat about him.