peter crabtree
AKA Simon, 1953 - 2022 (RIP)
Many fisheries and club waters ban this practice these days.
Can't say I've tried it myself but why do they ban it?
Can't say I've tried it myself but why do they ban it?
Floating baits banned...
- Thread starter peter crabtree
- Start date
sagalout
Well-known member
I wonder if it may be because of the 100kg of dog biscuit put in every 5 minutes, or possibly the fact that the floating freebies drift into every other bvggers swim bringing the fish up when matey boy has been trying to keep them on the bottom.
Sinking feed/freebies tends to stay in the freeby givers swim.
Sinking feed/freebies tends to stay in the freeby givers swim.
thecrow
Well-known member
Possibly because of the chance of waterfowl being hooked by inattentive anglers, or it could be just another daft rule with no reason for it.
Lord Paul of Sheffield
Well-known member
On its day floating bread or dog biscuits can be deadly but you have to watch how much you feed and what takes your hook bait
Chefster
Well-known member
floating baits ruin a match,take all the skill away,from fishing..they ruin venues as well!!!
This.
When using bread the remaining bread gets thrown in as full slices and the plastic bag is inevitably left on the bank.
If anyone's familiar with Woodend in Huthwaite, you may the remember the owner's dog died after eating the bread left behind by all the carp anglers. It caused it's stomach to swell so much it killed it.
theartist
Well-known member
Dry bread does this as it expands with the body fluids, the fish have no such problem as the bread is wet when they eat it. There's no health issue compared to sinking baits as it all gets eaten whether by fish or birdlife, the latter having just as much chance being hooked fishing shallow/on the drop as on the surface. Anyone who leaves a plastic bag on the bank is an idiot and should be banned anyway.
I can't understand why people fish on the bottom when everything is on the top on hot days during the day. The only carp fishing I do is on the top probably because it is so easy although there's more skill involved than some other ways of carp fishing. It's probably banned because it's so successful on days when others aren't catching so they go back to the fishery owner all grumpy.
I can't understand why people fish on the bottom when everything is on the top on hot days during the day. The only carp fishing I do is on the top probably because it is so easy although there's more skill involved than some other ways of carp fishing. It's probably banned because it's so successful on days when others aren't catching so they go back to the fishery owner all grumpy.
thecrow
Well-known member
Nothing wrong with throwing in unused slices if there was all the wild fowl on a local lake would be dead.
Please don't tar all anglers with the same brush when it comes to litter, I have seen "duck feeders" leave bread bags at waters often tying them to a fence railing.
---------- Post added at 09:23 ---------- Previous post was at 09:22 ----------
How do you know it was "all" the Carp anglers?
A local fishery owner has just introduced a ban on floating bread on his fishery - for a number of reasons - protecting the water-fowl, stops the scattering of bread on the surface spoiling other anglers swims and stops the 'snatching' of bites of partially hooked fish damaging mouths - as has happened.
Over the years - the owner has noted that some anglers 'get the fish up in the water' by scattering copious quantities of bread over the surface - inducing a feeding frenzy. When the Carp show-up a hooked piece of bread is cast to the target fish. When it swirls near the bait the inexperienced angler strikes over-enthusiastically mistaking this for a bite - often resulting in a foul-hooked/partially hooked fish but can with the force of the strike cause damage - usually to the mouth area. That's what I meant by 'snatching'.
With hair-rigged dog-biccies this doesn't seem to happen too often - since the hook stays with the bait and doesn't fly free to catch-into any bit of adjacent fish - as it does when using bread!
If people could watch the line for the take rather than the bread - it would probably prevent at least half these problems - but that might just be the fly-fisherman in me!
I agree that it's unusual to ban floating bread - but ok other floating baits - although I can undestand why he has brought the rule in rather than have a wholesale ban on ALL floating baits as in some other waters! He's thought about the problem and ways of addressing it that don't unduly impinge on the angler's means of fishing - as with most of his few rules on the fishery! Many fisheries have rules that are based on no obvious thought - just making it difficult for the angler or following the flock!
Nobody wants to see fish with damaged mouths and there is plenty of debate on FB, FM and other Angling fora on what the causes are: Barbed v. Barbless hooks, braid hooklinks, over-powered rods, poor handling, etc - if the banning of floating bread helps reduce the amount of disfigurement then that seems a positive step to me
It's caused a bit of dissent on behalf of regular anglers - but just as many are happy to go along with it and support the bold experiment. When the reasons have been explained to anglers it has made many of them have a re-think about their methods and effects - can't be a bad thing in itself!
Over the years - the owner has noted that some anglers 'get the fish up in the water' by scattering copious quantities of bread over the surface - inducing a feeding frenzy. When the Carp show-up a hooked piece of bread is cast to the target fish. When it swirls near the bait the inexperienced angler strikes over-enthusiastically mistaking this for a bite - often resulting in a foul-hooked/partially hooked fish but can with the force of the strike cause damage - usually to the mouth area. That's what I meant by 'snatching'.
With hair-rigged dog-biccies this doesn't seem to happen too often - since the hook stays with the bait and doesn't fly free to catch-into any bit of adjacent fish - as it does when using bread!
If people could watch the line for the take rather than the bread - it would probably prevent at least half these problems - but that might just be the fly-fisherman in me!
I agree that it's unusual to ban floating bread - but ok other floating baits - although I can undestand why he has brought the rule in rather than have a wholesale ban on ALL floating baits as in some other waters! He's thought about the problem and ways of addressing it that don't unduly impinge on the angler's means of fishing - as with most of his few rules on the fishery! Many fisheries have rules that are based on no obvious thought - just making it difficult for the angler or following the flock!
Nobody wants to see fish with damaged mouths and there is plenty of debate on FB, FM and other Angling fora on what the causes are: Barbed v. Barbless hooks, braid hooklinks, over-powered rods, poor handling, etc - if the banning of floating bread helps reduce the amount of disfigurement then that seems a positive step to me
It's caused a bit of dissent on behalf of regular anglers - but just as many are happy to go along with it and support the bold experiment. When the reasons have been explained to anglers it has made many of them have a re-think about their methods and effects - can't be a bad thing in itself!
rayner
Well-known member
One of the clubs I fished with had an issue with floating baits, namely bread.
Fishing at Lindholme about 10yrs ago one chap who always fished floating bread got in deep do do that day. He had trouble catching and thought he would feed a load of bread. He fed so much it looked like a bred van had crashed in Willows.
His exploits virtually caused the club to place ban on using floating baits.
At that time a number of members who also used floating baits were unfortunately banned with him.
One pilchard spoilt the club for some, it seems a bit drastic but when a bloke works all week to only fish at weekends, if some shirt ruins their day steps have to be taken.
Fishing at Lindholme about 10yrs ago one chap who always fished floating bread got in deep do do that day. He had trouble catching and thought he would feed a load of bread. He fed so much it looked like a bred van had crashed in Willows.
His exploits virtually caused the club to place ban on using floating baits.
At that time a number of members who also used floating baits were unfortunately banned with him.
One pilchard spoilt the club for some, it seems a bit drastic but when a bloke works all week to only fish at weekends, if some shirt ruins their day steps have to be taken.
Jim Crosskey 2
Well-known member
I'm guessing this all comes down to how much common sense is (or isn't) applied, particularly when it comes to loose feed. If someone's going to fill it in - either in a competitive match or a "specimen" style, then it's going to cause issues to the other anglers around them, and it won't take much in the way of disgruntlement being aired towards the owner before they decide to take action.
Seems silly to me because if carp really want a bait on the surface then a scattering of dog biscuits is all it takes to get them feeding confidently. And then there's other times where no amount of feeding will induce a decent confident feeding pattern.
I seem to see this ban in effect more on busy day ticket waters than I do on club lakes. Could it be that members of a club generally feel a little bit more ownership or investment in their waters and therefore manage to avoid the "catch at any cost" mentality that makes someone dump a 5kg sack of dog biscuits in one go (seen that recommended as the way to get them going in an article in AT a while back!)?
Seems silly to me because if carp really want a bait on the surface then a scattering of dog biscuits is all it takes to get them feeding confidently. And then there's other times where no amount of feeding will induce a decent confident feeding pattern.
I seem to see this ban in effect more on busy day ticket waters than I do on club lakes. Could it be that members of a club generally feel a little bit more ownership or investment in their waters and therefore manage to avoid the "catch at any cost" mentality that makes someone dump a 5kg sack of dog biscuits in one go (seen that recommended as the way to get them going in an article in AT a while back!)?
Lord Paul of Sheffield
Well-known member
Personally I think there is some skill in surface fishing
Neil Maidment
Moderator
Had a veritable shed load of sporty carp off the top yesterday. Only had 8 crusty rolls so no "loose feed" at all except what was left floating after the missed takes. When the rolls ran out I had a couple on mini sausage rolls mg:
A very enjoyable, productive and arm aching afternoon with fish to 14lbs+
mg:A very enjoyable, productive and arm aching afternoon with fish to 14lbs+
Ray Daywalker Clarke
Well-known member
I find it comes down to a couple of things.
Most of those that ban floating baits, don't know how to fish floating baits.
OR,
Floating baits catch more fish than they want you to catch. I won a match once with floating crust, they banned that the next season. When i asked why, they said, its not in the rules. I know i said, so its not breaking any rule. Ledgering isn't in the rules, but you haven't banned that.
Bloody stupid rule, banning floating baits.
Most of those that ban floating baits, don't know how to fish floating baits.
OR,
Floating baits catch more fish than they want you to catch. I won a match once with floating crust, they banned that the next season. When i asked why, they said, its not in the rules. I know i said, so its not breaking any rule. Ledgering isn't in the rules, but you haven't banned that.
Bloody stupid rule, banning floating baits.
sam vimes
Well-known member
I don't particularly agree with banning floating baits, but I can understand why fisheries might do so. I'd be less than impressed if, on still or flowing water, a skip load of bread/mixers passed me by on the wind or flow, especially if it took fish I had feeding well out of my peg. If it happened in a match, I'd be rather miffed. I have heard the odd tale of people pulling this stunt deliberately, not to actually catch fish themselves, just to screw the rest of the field up.
Unfortunately, it's another case of pandering to the lowest common denominator. As ever, it's not the method (or piece of tackle) that needs banning, it's the people that use them improperly/irresponsibly or with no consideration for others.
Unfortunately, it's another case of pandering to the lowest common denominator. As ever, it's not the method (or piece of tackle) that needs banning, it's the people that use them improperly/irresponsibly or with no consideration for others.
ciprinus
Well-known member
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really!!
why would you be fishing on the bottom for fish that were so obviously on the top?
that would be a tactic of someone who was stuck on one style of fishing.
who the hell in their right mind would be shoveling freebies in at that rate as it would totally invalidate the method?
i buy a 2 kilo bag that will last me all season and beyond and i do a LOT of surface fishing.
I hadn't realised I was, and it wasn't meant as a tarring all anglers, just those for whom the cap fits.
'All', as in all those responsible, as opposed to every person fishing for carp.
I should have spelled it out clearly that I was thinking of specific incidents of which I have first hand knowledge and commenting accordingly, rather than the sweeping generalisations which you appear to think I was making, though it doesn't appear as though I'm unique in either my experiences or observations.
My apologies for my lack of crystal clarity.
sagalout
Well-known member
This is a space filler, stooopid system.really!!
why would you be fishing on the bottom for fish that were so obviously on the top? I dunno people do.
that would be a tactic of someone who was stuck on one style of fishing.
who the hell in their right mind would be shoveling freebies in at that rate as it would totally invalidate the method? The 100kg every 5 minutes was a bit tongue in cheek
i buy a 2 kilo bag that will last me all season and beyond and i do a LOT of surface fishing.
---------- Post added at 07:08 ---------- Previous post was at 07:06 ----------
I hate everyone that generalises!
Tee-Cee
Senior Member
As with all things in life, and certainly in fishing, it will always come down to consideration for others around you....Unfortunately, some don't and never will understand this even if it was writ large on a board in every swim.
I do and have surfaced fished for many years with never a problem from fellow anglers and this, at times, on pretty busy waters. This may well be because I try to cast to fish surfacing under trees and bushes where I can place a very small number of freebies that are unlikely to float into open water simply because the fish have taken them !
Generally speaking I fish floating crust in 2" plus chunks, either with floating line or if needs be anchored to a specific spot by weight where the bait has been allowed to float back up to the surface after casting ( say ) under or close to trees or even pads. I also fish this way with the bait held some inches below the surface...
All methods produce fish and IMHO it takes a considerable amount of skill and effort to make them work. Some might think that attaching a large lump of crust to a hook is a simple matter and on the face of it that may well be the case, but I can assure those who deride it that it is just as delicate and finicky as fishing hemp on a 20 hook for roach !!
As for excitement ; Well, I can only speak from my own experiences, but I know of no other method that will cause breath to be held and mouth to become dry for such long periods of time as you wait for a good fish to take a bait. Yes, other methods have exciting moments.. rod tip pulling round, float sliding across the surface etc all have the ' moment ' to savour, but none compare to a huge carp ( or other species ) circling a bait for up to an hour before it sinks away, only to come up under the bait and suck it under without a sound.
Similarly, having a large mirror rush across the surface with its head out of the water to crash into a large crust takes some beating and is a heart stopping moment bettered by few experiences in a fishermans life !
I fully understand the frustration of those who suffer the stupidity of those who engage in covering the surface with floating bait and any time, let alone in a match, but then these idiots don't come under the heading of ' caring anglers ' in my book....
A place exists for all methods to be enjoyed providing folk think of others around them and it would be a great pity if the actions of a few means this method being banned on some waters, but then I still see morons fishing fixed leads and casting across the swims of others who put up with it because they don't want hassle, so fishery owners have no choice to ban where they see fit or if wild life is put at risk...
Don't dismiss floating baits out of hand, but instead give it a try in a quiet corner of a lake or over the gravel of a fast flowing swim for chub and then tell me it doesn't have its place in angling in the hands of those who, as I've said, give due consideration to others around them............I don't think you'll be disappointed !!
I do and have surfaced fished for many years with never a problem from fellow anglers and this, at times, on pretty busy waters. This may well be because I try to cast to fish surfacing under trees and bushes where I can place a very small number of freebies that are unlikely to float into open water simply because the fish have taken them !
Generally speaking I fish floating crust in 2" plus chunks, either with floating line or if needs be anchored to a specific spot by weight where the bait has been allowed to float back up to the surface after casting ( say ) under or close to trees or even pads. I also fish this way with the bait held some inches below the surface...
All methods produce fish and IMHO it takes a considerable amount of skill and effort to make them work. Some might think that attaching a large lump of crust to a hook is a simple matter and on the face of it that may well be the case, but I can assure those who deride it that it is just as delicate and finicky as fishing hemp on a 20 hook for roach !!
As for excitement ; Well, I can only speak from my own experiences, but I know of no other method that will cause breath to be held and mouth to become dry for such long periods of time as you wait for a good fish to take a bait. Yes, other methods have exciting moments.. rod tip pulling round, float sliding across the surface etc all have the ' moment ' to savour, but none compare to a huge carp ( or other species ) circling a bait for up to an hour before it sinks away, only to come up under the bait and suck it under without a sound.
Similarly, having a large mirror rush across the surface with its head out of the water to crash into a large crust takes some beating and is a heart stopping moment bettered by few experiences in a fishermans life !
I fully understand the frustration of those who suffer the stupidity of those who engage in covering the surface with floating bait and any time, let alone in a match, but then these idiots don't come under the heading of ' caring anglers ' in my book....
A place exists for all methods to be enjoyed providing folk think of others around them and it would be a great pity if the actions of a few means this method being banned on some waters, but then I still see morons fishing fixed leads and casting across the swims of others who put up with it because they don't want hassle, so fishery owners have no choice to ban where they see fit or if wild life is put at risk...
Don't dismiss floating baits out of hand, but instead give it a try in a quiet corner of a lake or over the gravel of a fast flowing swim for chub and then tell me it doesn't have its place in angling in the hands of those who, as I've said, give due consideration to others around them............I don't think you'll be disappointed !!
robertroach
Well-known member
I probably fish a couple of times a year for carp and only with floating baits, dog biscuits or bread and there's no doubt it is really exciting and completely engrossing.
A couple of days ago I was fishing for roach with sweet corn and finding sport really slow with only a few fish although every one a decent size. While I was waiting for the next bite I threw in half a dozen dog biscuits because it's always interesting watching the carp guzzle them up. As they drifted away in the wind they were being eaten enthusiastically but not by carp. I tackled up the pole with a free line with just a pellet banded hook and put a dog biscuit on. For the next 2 or 3 hours it was nail biting stuff, with good size roach coming to the net, maybe 12 or 15 altogether. A fish hooked for every 6 swirls at the bait, so not easy. Waiting for the line to move before striking was the way.
After about 55 years of angling, a new way of catching roach for me!
Please don't ban floating baits!
A couple of days ago I was fishing for roach with sweet corn and finding sport really slow with only a few fish although every one a decent size. While I was waiting for the next bite I threw in half a dozen dog biscuits because it's always interesting watching the carp guzzle them up. As they drifted away in the wind they were being eaten enthusiastically but not by carp. I tackled up the pole with a free line with just a pellet banded hook and put a dog biscuit on. For the next 2 or 3 hours it was nail biting stuff, with good size roach coming to the net, maybe 12 or 15 altogether. A fish hooked for every 6 swirls at the bait, so not easy. Waiting for the line to move before striking was the way.
After about 55 years of angling, a new way of catching roach for me!
Please don't ban floating baits!