stick and Waggler lines

[iain t]

50 years ago i started to learn how to fish. My training grounds or should that waters were the rivers and streams in the South East of England. That's where my passion still lays. I have always used stick floats, Quills, reeds etc, good old tradditional float fishing. I don't own or ever bought a Waggler float.
My question is with stick floats the line which is a floating type is attached top and bottom. With a Waggler the line is attached only at the bottom. This i understand but why a sinking line with a waggler ?. Would the fish not detect the line hanging down under the surface. Wouldnt it be better to use a floating line?. As ive said ive only been fishing for 5 decades so am still learning.

 

[theartist]

50 years ago i started to learn how to fish. My training grounds or should that waters were the rivers and streams in the South East of England. That's where my passion still lays. I have always used stick floats, Quills, reeds etc, good old tradditional float fishing. I don't own or ever bought a Waggler float.
My question is with stick floats the line which is a floating type is attached top and bottom. With a Waggler the line is attached only at the bottom. This i understand but why a sinking line with a waggler ?. Would the fish not detect the line hanging down under the surface. Wouldnt it be better to use a floating line?. As ive said ive only been fishing for 5 decades so am still learning.

There isn't too much difference between sinking and floating lines except the floating stays on the surface film better, the sinking line on a waggler will still be very direct to the locking shot, it shouldn't hang down from the surface much further than the bottom of the waggler unless you've got the rod really low

 

[sam vimes]

On running water, it can be better to use a floating line when fishing a waggler. I suspect the confusion lies in the fact that most people want a sinking line for fishing the waggler on still water. The very last thing I'd want for still water waggler fishing is a genuine floating line.
However, fish detecting a sunken line when fishing a waggler is not a factor that I'd give any real credence to, not unless you are fishing very shallow.

 

[theartist]

A floating line can also be made to sink easily with a quick flick of the rod tip under the water

 

[sam vimes]

A floating line can also be made to sink easily with a quick flick of the rod tip under the water

Not if it's a genuinely bouyant floating line. Try it with a proper floating braid and that just doesn't work.

 

[iain t]

Try it with a proper floating braid and that just doesn't work.

Didn't know there was a floating braid. Learn something new every day

 

[theartist]

Not if it's a genuinely bouyant floating line. Try it with a proper floating braid and that just doesn't work.

I didn't know there was a floating braid, I'm guessing that's not used for much waggler work lol

 

[sam vimes]

Didn't know there was a floating braid. Learn something new every day

Trying to find a mainline braid that actually sinks is actually a bit of a problem. Most of them float very well.

I didn't know there was a floating braid, I'm guessing that's not used for much waggler work lol

I've never heard of anyone trying it for waggler fishing. I have used braid for trotting. The best of it is that it floats like a top and gives very direct control and feel. The downside is that in less than perfect wind conditions, it has a nasty habit of being picked up off the surface and blowing about. The lack of stretch can also force a change in playing and striking styles or a change to the type/action of the rods used.

 

[tigger]

I've heard other people mention braid being picked up off the surface by the wind but personally i've never had it happen to me. If it did happen i'd lower the tip of my rod to counteract it.
I've never really been a fan of braid for trotting but i've no doubt that I will uuse it again in future.
When using it for ledgering i'm sure I could sink it ok, once it was pulled below the waters surface it slowly decended. I used powerpro and fireline crystal for trotting and ledgering.

 

[Keith M]

50 years ago i started to learn how to fish. My training grounds or should that waters were the rivers and streams in the South East of England. That's where my passion still lays. I have always used stick floats, Quills, reeds etc, good old tradditional float fishing. I don't own or ever bought a Waggler float.
My question is with stick floats the line which is a floating type is attached top and bottom. With a Waggler the line is attached only at the bottom. This i understand but why a sinking line with a waggler ?. Would the fish not detect the line hanging down under the surface. Wouldnt it be better to use a floating line?. As ive said ive only been fishing for 5 decades so am still learning.

When you are fishing the waggler on still waters most of the time you need your float to stay fairly still, or as still as you can keep it, so sinking your line below the surface is usually the best way to do this ; unless you are fishing under the rod tip or fishing on a virtually windless day.

This is because there are very few stillwaters that don’t move at all, and the undercurrent below the surface is almost always moving in the opposite direction to the surface drift, so sinking your line into this undertow will tend to stop the line between your float and rodtip from being blown into a large downwind bow, and will slow down, or even stop, any float drift caused by the surface tow. You can even get your float to move upwind against the surface tow at times if you shot your float to suit; with your bulk shot set deeper to catch in the undertow and with a long stemmed bodied float.

Keith

 

[108831]

To add to Keith's above post using a float long enough to get below the surface skim and a bulk shot just below two thirds depth at least(this bulk depends on depth,float size and amount of wind blowing),this done correctly should catch any undertow available,you'll please forgive me,but this is a real speciality for me and most of my angling friends would acknowledge this.

 

[peter crabtree]

Is there a line that sinks without ducking the rod tip and lifting or winding in a bit? A line that once cast out just sinks of its own accord?
Some say Maxima but I've found it floats, I've also tried method line which is supposed to sink, but doesn't?

 

[sam vimes]

Is there a line that sinks without ducking the rod tip and lifting or winding in a bit? A line that once cast out just sinks of its own accord?
Some say Maxima but I've found it floats, I've also tried method line which is supposed to sink, but doesn't?

It's perfectly true that the vast majority of lines will fail to break the surface tension of water and sink of their own accord. However, that doesn't make them floating lines. This is the reason for some folks seeming to being quite happy using lines for trotting that are usually considered to be sinkers. It's also why a neutrally bouyant line can make for a good alrounder. They can be persuaded sub surface without much problem, or left to float on the surface tension showing little sign of breaking through.

Maxima being a genuine sinker can be seen in the way that it will keep falling through the water column after it breaks the surface tension. Some folks actually complain about Maxima sinking and dragging the float back towards them when using light floats.

 

[108831]

Wash your line in washing up liquid and water,a strongish mix,most lines hold a greasy layer,this needs doing before every session to get the best out of your line as it picks up floatant from the surface every trip.

 

[wetthrough]

I've found Shimano Aero Super Match sinks very easily but not of its own accord, you still need to sink it. I've found Maxima to be very heavy in the water once it gets well saturated but not so easy when it's new IME.

 

[108831]

It's perfectly true that the vast majority of lines will fail to break the surface tension of water and sink of their own accord. However, that doesn't make them floating lines. This is the reason for some folks seeming to being quite happy using lines for trotting that are usually considered to be sinkers. It's also why a neutrally bouyant line can make for a good alrounder. They can be persuaded sub surface without much problem, or left to float on the surface tension showing little sign of breaking through.

Maxima being a genuine sinker can be seen in the way that it will keep falling through the water column after it breaks the surface tension. Some folks actually complain about Maxima sinking and dragging the float back towards them when using light floats.

I was going to add that to my post,you saved me the trouble.

 

[108831]

Is there a line that sinks without ducking the rod tip and lifting or winding in a bit? A line that once cast out just sinks of its own accord?
Some say Maxima but I've found it floats, I've also tried method line which is supposed to sink, but doesn't?

It's quite a plus on the cut at times Simon,especially when your up the far shelf.

 

[Philip]

I think it was Tom Pickering who wrote about how he used a floating mono treated to sink...the idea being that it would hang just below the surface.

As a kid we used to use Maxima allot and had the problem of it sinking and pulling our floats in.

Drennan sell a Method line that is supposed to sink, I have a spool on one reel but it does not sink as well as I hoped (I need to look at it some more however).

Not so relevant to waggler fishing I guess but Nash I think it was that made a sinking braid. ..there may be some others.

 

[fishcatcher60]

I have never had a sinking line that does not need help to sink.

 

[Mark Wintle]

I've never had a problem with Maxima ( usually 2lb, occasionally 1.5lb or 2.5lb) causing a float to drift towards me because the line is has continued sinking. The densities of so-called floating lines (standard monofilaments like Bayer Perlon) and Maxima are exactly the same i.e. about 1.05. Maxima's difference to the floating lines is the matt finish that doesn't hold up in the surface tension as well as the 'polished' (shiny) surface of the likes of Bayer. The few times I've wanted a line to sink immediately I've treated it with detergent but this doesn't do the line much good so only if absolutely essential.

I use Maxima for river and stillwater waggler fishing and Daiwa Harrier (obsolete) or Dave Harrell line for when I need a floating line.