fish are strange.

[john step]

This got me thinking and wondering today.

As per HDYGO thread I caught. Silvers and carp. The water in the pond (I can't be generous enough to call it a lake) is obviously freezing cold this time of year. The bites needed fishing for. Because of the constant danger of a carp you just cannot risk fishing for silvers with silver tackle. I fished 4lb straight through to a 16 Animal. I should not have got roach bites on that shark tackle!

The other two waters next to it just will not give up a bite. They are shallower so I am sure that makes a difference.

Here is the puzzle for me. Another club lake down the road is about the same depth as my pond but you are lucky to get a sniff at the moment.

Now there are shallow waters that seem to fish all winter. For instance take a look at Peter Crabtrees posts on the GUC. with his nets of silvers.
That canal is shallow and often gin clear.

You can sit on a flowing river where fish surely need to replace energy of fighting the current by eating and struggle yet this pond I refer to fishes well with no current!

As per my heading. Fish are strange. Any thoughts??

 

[tigger]

Sounds like the pool may be highly stocked and whatever food there is has a lot of competition for it.

 

[peter crabtree]

On the canal the fish are usually shoaled up in one place at this time of the year. They don't seem to move much either. I'm certain rivers and lakes are similar.
If you land on them happy days ..You can't catch them if they're not in front of you.

 

[sam vimes]

Whatever the reasons, some waters simply have zero winter form. The reasons for that can be utterly inexplicable at times. There are a couple of factors that are regularly cited as being a good bet when it comes to winter fishing. The first is a high stocking density, the second is decent depth. Sadly I've fished more than the odd highly stocked, or reasonably deep, waters that are absolutely hopeless in the winter. All you can really do is fish waters that do have form in winter, or fish for species that are more reliable when it's cold.

 

[barbelboi]

The best winter tench fishing I ever had came from an estate lake that was nowhere more than about five feet deep and most of the tench were caught from depths of less than three feet. This water did have the benefit though from being surrounded by trees and the shallow waters also responded to the conditions much quicker than deeper ones. In the winter a warm sunny day would almost guarantee at least a tench, or two, on sweetcorn or worm in the margins.

 

[john step]

Whatever the reasons, some waters simply have zero winter form. The reasons for that can be utterly inexplicable at times. There are a couple of factors that are regularly cited as being a good bet when it comes to winter fishing. The first is a high stocking density, the second is decent depth. Sadly I've fished more than the odd highly stocked, or reasonably deep, waters that are absolutely hopeless in the winter. All you can really do is fish waters that do have form in winter, or fish for species that are more reliable when it's cold.

Yes thats what I was trying to get at. All three waters are heavy stocked but just one fishes in the cold.

 

[no-one in particular]

It can be odd, the rivers I fish only chub and roach in the winter but often just chub. One rural canal which is very shallow in the winter dies a death. Some shallow marsh waters die a death as well. Some commercials fish well but then like you, one lake can fish well and the others dont. One I used to fish a lot with 8 lakes my mate and I would often sit on different lakes and change lakes until we found one that was giving bites. The composition of the lakes was very similar.
In the words of the Who "I cant explain" and if they cant who can.

I wonder if the fact that Peter's canals are often urban have anything to do with it, what do you think Peter?

 

[peter crabtree]

One thing I've noticed that really causes areas with no fish is where there's a cold wind rippling the surface.
This can be in any depth of water.
Urban areas are usually where silvers will congregate, often due to duckfeeders bread going in. To a lesser extent but probably important is the escape from airial predation. Again these area are often unaffected by cold winds.

 

[Tee-Cee]

I fish the same set of waters year in, year out, and not only do they vary in catches from year to year, they vary wildly from week to week....
Recently, I have checked my very rough fishing diaries for the last four years for one particular lake, and found that for Jan/Feb ( even with somewhat similar weather conditions) I have caught roach (up to a dozen up to 12ozs or so) on a particular day with hemp, to be followed, in the same swim, by consecutive blanks on the following two days! Totally biteless, in fact.
In 2016 I had some lovely fishing days from mid to end Feb on red maggots and this following some reasonable bags in Jan on hemp. For some reason I cannot fathom they just stopped taking hemp almost from one day to the next. (ALL of these catches were broken up by inexplicable biteless days!!)

This year, from the middle of Jan it has been atrocious to say the least, with the roach absent apart from the odd fish between hooking carp on a single red maggot. I have carried out my normal method of breaking the swim(s) into zones giving (sometimes) hugely differing depths of water and searched for fish at all levels without any response whatsoever, apart from the carp, that is!
I have even catapulted a regular few maggots into the adjacent swim (without moving from the one I'm fishing) over the course of an hour or two and then quietly moved along if I'm not catching, but this year it hasn't worked....

It would be wrong to generalise as all waters differ(even within the same complex of waters as noted by others above), but it is also my opinion (agreeing with Simon) that roach shoal up in winter and if you drop on them great, but if not (and only fishing one swim away) the only thing you will get is a blank, 'possibly' followed by others IF you don't get off your butt and go look for them. Sitting in one swim for some hours without a bite and then coming to the conclusion that 'they are not feeding' and worse, not going out again for some weeks on that basis, is not the way to go...............Only my thoughts, though.

At this time of year, when most waters are devoid of anglers (mine anyway!) and bitterly cold, it takes a bit of effort to completely move swims, or take a rod and seat to try another swim 50m along the bank for an hour or so, but to give yourself every chance I believe it's worth the effort (and you're not disturbing anyone), if only to prove a point one way or the other!

One things for sure, though; I don't have any form of magic formula and everything I try is, to some degree, speculation or trying to out think the fish, if you will. What I don't want to do is come home thinking I haven't given the session my best shot with maximum effort............................ and I do pretty well on that basis.

 

[peterjg]

John Step, thanks for starting this thread. It's not just me then that struggles in winter with roach. They are just so unpredictable!

A few (hardly original!) thoughts:

The amount of light (or lack of it) is more important than water temperature.
Coloured water good, gin clear bad.
WT less than 42F usually hopeless, 45F plus is good.
As already said, roach definitely shoal up in winter.
In winter best baits (for me anyway?) are either bread or dead maggots - some days they want bread some days only dead maggots will do.

Ideally what I hope for is coloured water, WT of 45F, no frost, overcast, light SW wind, no full moon, no other anglers, no boats, no otters, no cormorants and a swim full of dopey hungry roach - no wonder I struggle!

PS: probably the best answer is to fish on after dark (in the right conditions) legering a lump of bread on a size 10 hook.

 

[nottskev]

I definitely agree that some waters fish well in winter and others, apparently similar, simply don't. And some conditions, like those Peter describes, are great when they occur. When conditions are so-so, neither good nor particularly bad, is the time you find out how fickle roach can be. One of my local lakes fished very well for roach on corn all last winter. It won't get you a bite this year. Chopped worm is a great method here. Except when it fall flat. Bites can come only hard on the bottom - or some particular distance, say 15" from it. After a couple of disappointing sessions on the usual baits, I tried that great summer bait, tares, the other day - and caught from the off. And so on. I used to set up just one rig at this lake, thinking I knew how to catch . Now I start off by setting up two, and might well have to use a third option.

 

[silvers]

On rivers - Its a surprise to me how far fish migrate. I notice this particularly with the Wye (Hereford) and Severn (Shrewsbury) where the town stretches are devoid until October. These fish come from summer haunts that are miles out of town,
Equally March on the Old Nene is renowned as a winter venue due to shoals of roach congregating from the local drains.