Knots?

[dicky123]

Guys.

I watched for the first time yesterday an old video by Dave Harrell, wagger and stick float fishing, very good and still current. What interested me was he recommended a two turn water knot for the mainline to hook link. He said not only is it strong and small, you never get line twist like a loop to loop! This same knot I've seen use for shock leaders to main line, it such a small double loop it crazy good.

Now I've often used the four turn water knot when fly fishing, but never just two turns, a simple figure of eight knot. Has anyone else been using this knot for a long time and can feedback results? Rich.

 

[nottskev]

I've used it for everything bar barbelling - where there's usually a swivel on a leger rig, and on float I still loop-to-loop - and I've found it fine. I'm a bit of a knot paranoiac, using only a few tried and tested ones for everything, and I used to loop/loop even for light to medium floatfishing. But I kept meeting recommendations from really successful anglers for this two-turn knot, tried it, and found it no more likely to break than loop to loop; in fact, I can't remember ever having this knot fail. It makes light rigs in particular really neat and streamlined.

Here's one world champion demonstrating it (19.30) as it was shown to him by another world champion.

YouTube

 

[rayner]

I have knots that I stick to for most applications. The one I use most is the figure 8 for loop to loop and joining lines. There's no reason for me to change. The main reason I stick to the figure 8 is that I find it easy to tie
Anyone can tie any knot, chose the ones you like and stick with them until you have a reason to change.

 

[mikench]

I have just passed an enjoyable half hour trying the 2 turn water knot but without success. I must be doing something wrong.

 

[108831]

I am at a loss as James Robbins does the same I believe,my big issue is this,when I tie a loop on the end of my main line,if I tie a new hooklength on it goes on said loop,depth remains spot on to my tell tale shot,which is always on the line just above said loop,by using the two turn water knot everything has to be altered,depth,shot,all have to be re-set,if you reel in a little slower you wouldnt get line twist....

 

[Richox12]

It's a nice neat knot. But use Loop to loop unless you want to be changing hooklengths and adjusting your rig length to work out where you are all of the time. Big/long loops seem to spin less than small loops.

 

[markcw]

It's a nice neat knot. But use Loop to loop unless you want to be changing hooklengths and adjusting your rig length to work out where you are all of the time. Big/long loops seem to spin less than small loops.

I read somewhere that big long loops also seem to give a slower fall of hookbait.

 

[bracket]

I'm conversant with several types of knot, but in reality I tend to use only three. I use a figure of eight knot for loop to loop hook attachment on all my pole rigs, there being little chance of line twist. On running water I attach the hook by tying a uni knot on the main line, then attach the hook length to that with a tucked half blood knot drawing them both tight together for a nice neat connection. I appreciate that to change a hook requires resetting the depth and rearranging the shotting, but as I am well familiar with the rigs I use, plus the depth is visually marked off against the rod rings I don't find this a problem. Pete.

 

[seth49]

The ones I use most are the loop knot you get with one of the loop knot tying tools, for attaching hooks either a knot less if I need a hair, or a palomar knot for eyed hooks, and for spade end hooks, one of the drennan hook tiers.

If I’m using a shock leader then a double grinner knot is the best I’ve used, also use this to attach braid to nylon.
Used to use the tucked half blood knot a lot, but it doesn’t seem to work as well with modern lines, stopped using it now.

 

[mikench]

Stupid question of the day. Is the loop knot created by a loop tyer whether the sensas type or the Ringer variant, the same as a figure of eight knot.

 

[dicky123]

Playing devils advocate now, the loop to loop does twist up, and it's two knots? I cannot see why cutting a bit of line off each end and re-tying the 2 turn water knot is a problem. You just push the float up the equal amount of line cut off?

I have to also say I rarely change the hook-link diameter during a session without changing the main line, two rods. You can change the hook size without changing the diameter if you want. I like it and will try it, if it's good enough for James Robbins and Dave Harrell I don't need further evidence.

I concede the loop system is easiest, but this has more advantages for me. I like a mini swivel on all but my lightest rigs however only because of line twist, if this negates twist, its one less knot in the system. Richard.

 

[rayner]

I do use the loop to loop but only on pole rigs or bomb fishing. Waggler fishing I only use a figure-eight knot. I can easily tie this knot to my rod with one hand. I tie a length of .17 to my reel line with a figure eight then the hook length to the .17 with another figure eight.
The .17 is to protect my weaker 3lb reel line from the harsh non-toxic split shot. So from my reel line to my hook, there are two knots. Three if you count tying of the hook. I've never had any issues, not even when I put shot on my hook link which I regularly do.

 

[108831]

I'm interested ****y,how are you getting line twist,ie,are you using 0.10mm hooklinks and below regularly,what make of hooklink material and are you winding like a madman,no insult intended,I ask because I do not use a micro swivel,or retrieve
too fast,I rarely if ever however these days use 0.10 or below,I do however use double maggot a lot,on rivers with good flows and dont get line twist very often,if at all.

 

[rayner]

My choice of hook lengths for roach and skimmers is .10 when it's cold I'll even go down to .08. I never get line twist.
I think the better presentation from lighter hook lengths far outweighs the risk of breakages from the odd rascal carp.
The .17 that I include in my set up doesn't prevent spin but a slow to medium retrieve does.

 

[108831]

I agree with the above,light hooklinks and higher rates of retrieve is a prime mover in line twist on hooklengths I find,also some makes of line are so supple that this can help worsen it.
Just to add,i wouldn't hesitate to use light lines,if I thought they were necessary in my fishing,but knowing often big fish take maggots like big perch and tenc,even large bream,chub,I want those so a happy medium is struck.

 

[rayner]

With maggot hooking two the same way can cause line twist, hooking one normally then the other one in the tip can prevent spin, not if you still retrieve too fast.
It must be over 30 yrs that the cause of line twist was pointed out to me, had forums such as this been around 50 yrs ago I would probably have picked up the cause then. New to angling chaps have knowledge at their fingertips now.

 

[John Keane]

Stupid question of the day. Is the loop knot created by a loop tyer whether the sensas type or the Ringer variant, the same as a figure of eight knot.

I don’t think so. When I’m tying loops for salmon fishing I use the Figure of Eight knot but when it’s for coarse or pole rigs I use the Seymo Loop Tyer which basically ties a Double Overhand Knot but enables you to get the same size loop every time. I don’t like the Sensas swan-neck type at all.