Fly Line for 6-7 weight Sonik

[Aussie Bob]

I currently have an Sonik XTRT4 fly rod rated 6-7 weight . I currently have a WF7 floating Airflo on it.
I am looking for another floating and an intermediate line and after reading up some suggest that you use an overweight line in particular for a new fly fisher so you can feel the rod load up.
My question is really that with the rod being rated 6-7 should i be looking at a 7 or 8 weight ?
Is there any potential issues that can arise if i do go to the 8 weight or would it be within tolerance for the rod ?
Also if anyone has any line recommendations (not top of the line price wise bit skint at the moment) i have been looking at Barrios lines which at around 25-30 pound each which have some decent reviews...
Thanks in advance for any tips or suggestions.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

I would be a little careful Bob especially on rods that have a range of weighting recommendations.

If going one weight over then that could result in using, say, a #8 line of a rod that is closer to a #6 than a #7 even though listed as a 6-7# - if you follow that . . . . .

I use Sage rods myself and they are listed to a given weight, so a Z-Axis #7 can be easily used with an #8 line and safely too

That said, as for a recommendation, then for about £9 more than your range why not look at the offers on Snowbee lines? (£39)

I have 4 or 5 of them on my reels and spare spools and they perform every bit as good as a Hardy line at an awful lot more cash. thye last very well too.

Also, take a look at the Grey's lines as well, for the same money you cna get a Grey's Platinum line and those are very good as well.

 

[ken more]

I would be a little careful Bob especially on rods that have a range of weighting recommendations.

If going one weight over then that could result in using, say, a #8 line of a rod that is closer to a #6 than a #7 even though listed as a 6-7# - if you follow that . . . . .

I use Sage rods myself and they are listed to a given weight, so a Z-Axis #7 can be easily used with an #8 line and safely too

That said, as for a recommendation, then for about £9 more than your range why not look at the offers on Snowbee lines? (£39)

I have 4 or 5 of them on my reels and spare spools and they perform every bit as good as a Hardy line at an awful lot more cash. thye last very well too.

Also, take a look at the Grey's lines as well, for the same money you cna get a Grey's Platinum line and those are very good as well.

Just as a matter of interest, what would happen if you used an 8 line with a rod nearer 6?

Thanks

 

[Aussie Bob]

Thanks Peter i was a bit dubious about going to an 8 weight so thought i would ask first. I will have a look around for the Snowbee and Greys Platinum lines. Unfortunately if i see them locally they will be probably 50% on UK prices , if i import from UK depending on what shop i get them from then i get stung for overseas post costs which will probably put 10-15 pounds on the cost. I will have a look around anyway see whats out there.
I would also be interested in what would happen if you used a 8 on a 6 weight. I am presuming some sort of catastrophic failure.....

 

[Peter Jacobs]

Just as a matter of interest, what would happen if you used an 8 line with a rod nearer 6?

Thanks

Ken and Bob,

If you overload a fly rod with a line heavier than the manufacturer recommends, they cause the rod to flex more deeply, which creates larger loops on longer casts. Overloading the rod wastes casting energy by not directing it at the target . . . . . .

Or that is what the experts seem to say.

A rod is designed to achieve perfect "flex" when a given weight of line is outside the top ring, hence the recommended line number for a rod. Anything less or greater that the designed weight will affect the cast and may even stress the rod as well losing efficiency.

 

[greenie62]

The rating mentioned is for a WF line, where the 'casting weight' of the line is based on the weight of the first 10m and accomodates most of the weight of the WF tapered line. This will be about the same as the first 10m of a DT8 - double-tapered 8 - so should allow the rod to flex correctly for shorter casting with the heavier line which can be useful when fishing 'tight' swims and brooks. If you try casting more line than this - e.g. on open water - you'll soon find out how quickly the 'loop' of line collapses and ends up hitting you in the back of the head! - if you don't feel the strain on the rod first.
The manufacturers ratings are there as a guide to the buyer and the exact specifications of how they're calculated varies between manufacturers of lines and rods - there's no substitute for feel and personal experience of a given combination.
I sometimes use my 6/7 with a DT5 when I want to cast distance with a light line - it can take some getting going because the lower weight of line outside the rodtip doesn't make the rod flex correctly until there is already a good load of line out.

Find a mate who has another line and try it out on your rod - experiment a little - and see how you go! It's the only way to get a definitive answer for you, your rod, line and casting style.
Tight Lines!

 

[S-Kippy]

Pretty much agree with what's been said. Using a "line up" is useful in tight situations or where you are only casting short distances. It loads the rod quicker and you dont need to false cast as much. I use an 8 weight on my 7 weight rods when sea trouting for precisely that reason. It works fine....I can lift off,one fc and shoot.

I wouldn't want to do that if I was casting any distance as with more of a heavier line out the rod will start to collapse as you're asking too much of it. I wouldn't personally contemplate anything other than 1 weight difference...ie an 8 on a 7 wt rod,7 on a 6 weight etc. This assumes the rod is accurately rated and you can't always be certain it is but [generally] the better the rod/manufacturer the more likely it is to be accurately rated. I use Hardy's and they [in my experience] are spot on....I'm not convinced this is true of all rods especially down the budget end when they are being made to a price point and not to AFTM spec. Less of an issue if you are under-loading ie using a line a size down. I have a couple of 7 wt rods that are perfectly happy with a 6 weight line.

As a generall rule of thumb I think up or down 1 line size and you should be OK.

I'm very wary of any rod rated [say] 6-8. It cannot be both.

 

[Aussie Bob]

Skippy , Greenie , Peter

Great to get all this expert information very much appreciated and makes a lot of sense. I obviously only had a limited understanding of how fly /rods lines work !!
I don't really have a need for any short range work or in tight situations as i fish open (more than often windy) lakes.Not convinced that any really long casting is required either when i have caught its normally within 15-20 metres of shore.

Plenty to think about now....

 

[andygrey]

The first thing to consider is how you get on with the rod with the 7wt line. If you are happy with how it cast then I'd stick with another 7wt.
Dual rated rods where traditionally designed to cast a WF in the higher rating and a DT in the lower though as actual line weights can vary so much within the actual tolerances of the AFTM scale this can become a bit of a minefield. For instance the Rio Grand line is actually almost a full line weight higher than it's stated weight (I.E. if you where to weigh the first 30' of a 7wt line it would be nearer the standard weight of an 8wt, so if you where to overlain a 7wt rod with an 8wt Rio Grand then you would effectively be putting something more like a 9wt on it... it can all get very complicated!)
Without actually casting the outfit concerned it's difficult to advise but I would suggest sticking with a 7wt and not overlining, especially as you are fishing at a reasonable distance and not looking to load the rod at short distances (which is where overlining can help).
The Barrio GT90 is a very good line and is pretty true to the line weight, it has a very long head and favours a casting style of 'carrying' a lot of line in the air rather than shooting.
My advice for what it's worth would be to stick with a 7wt on a rod rated 7/6. Good advice from other posters about seeing if you can borrow some other 7wt lines to have a play with and see if they work for you.

Cheers

Andy

---------- Post added at 08:04 ---------- Previous post was at 08:02 ----------

Just as a matter of interest, what would happen if you used an 8 line with a rod nearer 6?

Thanks

Put very simply, the rod would feel 'sloppy' and 'slow'.

Cheers

Andy

 

[S-Kippy]

Absolutely agree about line weights varying.....so do line tapers, casting styles etc .the art is finding the right mix including a rod that suits you too. Ive tried but I do not get on with Sage rods and I just cannot cast a Cortland line........dunno why I just cant. As the nearest I get to a sinking line is a midge tip its Snowbee every time for me. I tried a Barrio...didn't really get on with it but its a good line and a lot of people swear by them.

I've just bought a Guideline 8 weight for me sea trouting having had a borrow of a mates and being mightily impressed.

 

[Graham Elliott 1]

Im learning s lot here as a just past novice fly fisher.

Had some great days at farmoor with occasionally double figure number of fish caught on the catch and release reservoir.

Most enjoyable is working out what fly to use. Last week in the day blue flash damsels half depth later red cheek buzzers.

Trouble is now and again you hook a real biggun. Now when they are taking small flies, say on size 14 hook, what an earth leader do you use thats strong enough yet can go through the hook eye?

I have been using 7lb fulling mill but need to go down to 5 for smaller flies. Last week an unstoppable fish took me down to the end of backing twice on a filled big arbour (80-90yds)

Im using a ( no snob me) a 7/8 weight Leeda 2xl..... that I prefer to my orvis clearwater 7.!!

Help please.

 

[S-Kippy]

Graham

I fish Farmoor 1 almost exclusively for my trouting now. The fish are superb and as you say they fight like hell.

All I ever use leader wise is Kryston Incognito in 5lb bs. That will go through the eye of a 14 and it is utterly brilliant stuff......it won't stop one of those nutfish that just run and run but I've played around with various leader materials and this is the best I've found.. I used to use 7lb bs but tbh I found the 5 lb perfectly adequate.

And I'm fishing nymphs exclusively....buzzers and diawl bachs typically in 12/14....sometimes smaller,rarely bigger. I don't do lures.

Skippy

 

[Graham Elliott 1]

Thanks Skippy. I will order some.

Probably due to my lack of skill and hard hands I found I was losing some fish simply on the take on the 5lb Fulling Mill.

Been about 6 times this year. Incredible hard fighting fish in superb condition.

Looking forward to tomorrow despite the returns looking below average at moment.

Im still into catch on whatever they will take. One of the fun days was stckleback fly ripped across surface and watching the follow and snatch. No purist I'm afraid.

Maybe when I'm more adept.

Cheers. Graham.

See you on itchen if not farmoor sometime.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

All I ever use leader wise is Kryston Incognito in 5lb bs.

Same as me then, but I will often up that to 7lb B/S for some venues.

Incognito is an excellent material . . . . . . . . .

 

[S-Kippy]

Same as me then, but I will often up that to 7lb B/S for some venues.

Incognito is an excellent material . . . . . . . . .

It is indeed. The best fluoro on the market IMO and the only one I trust. Knot strength is particularly good but the Farmoor fish hit you so hard sometimes that they can ping you off occasionally. Oddly enough its not particularly fine in diameter terms but I've never found that it wont go through the hook eye.

---------- Post added at 11:39 ---------- Previous post was at 11:24 ----------

Thanks Skippy. I will order some.

Probably due to my lack of skill and hard hands I found I was losing some fish simply on the take on the 5lb Fulling Mill.

Been about 6 times this year. Incredible hard fighting fish in superb condition.

Looking forward to tomorrow despite the returns looking below average at moment.

Im still into catch on whatever they will take. One of the fun days was stckleback fly ripped across surface and watching the follow and snatch. No purist I'm afraid.

Maybe when I'm more adept.

Cheers. Graham.

See you on itchen if not farmoor sometime.

Graham

You will always lose a fish or two on F1 because they often hit you very hard. This is why I like Incognito because its much better at coping with the shock. My mate Big Phil uses Fulling Mill [higher bs] and he loses more than me on smash takes....but he is a cack handed stubborn sod at the best of times. He likes Fulling Mill...I dont. We rarely agree but on this one I am RIGHT and he knows it. He is just too tight to buy Incognito.

He was up at Farmoor last Friday. It was hard work apparently but most people had a few fish on the dry daddy. Only a few though...he had 3 on daiwl bachs as he'd left his daddy box behind.

Have you tried "the bung" yet ? Fantastic on its day. Heavy buzzer on the point, cruncher/red holo daiwl bach on the middle/top dropper [or two daiwl bachs] on a 12-15 ft leader. Swing it across the wind and hold on tight. You cant fish it too slowly. If the wind permits static or virtually static can be deadly....and quite exciting too !

They can be very close in some days...just over the weed line where the water darkens.

 

[Graham Elliott 1]

If you and Peter recommend it, it'll be the one I get.

Despite my newness I'm very happy at catch rates. Couple times managed well into double figures.

Last week 6 but on a boat. I guess I just want to start adding a bit more finesse now casting not too bad.

Hate getting done as well but happy to hear happens to others.

I have tried "washing line" if that's what you mean with 15ft leader and done well but strangely very few on red /orange /green daiwl bach but only had one....my mate does far better with them.

Black red cheek halo. Small black goldhead and the damsel works best so far.
And yes last two months about 2-3 rod lengths from bank.

Let me know if you go nxt few weeks and are prepared to teach for an hour...swop for sherpa help!

Cheers

Graham

 

[S-Kippy]

I won't be up there for a week or two but yes....next time I feel the urge I'll drop you a pm and we'll meet up. When they are close they are very close indeed.....almost chewing your boots but Phil said they were a bit further out last week and well spread out too. Well it is September after all.

If they are clearly high in the water I'll shorten my leader to about 8/9 ft and just fish 2 Daiwl Bach's. Always with a bit of red somewhere....cheeks,head or rib. They love em.

This time of year is really Daddy time so I'd be giving them a go. Dry,wet or with a goldhead. Sometimes that's all they want.

 

[Graham Elliott 1]

Well as predicted it was tough.

Managed two and two lost. Both on blue flash damsel.

No joy on daiwl or buzzers that I fished half the day.

Also had a pike about 6/7 on the damsel. Wonderful colouration.

No flies or fish showing on surface until half hour before off time then large hatch black fings and fish showing in numbers.. Too late for me.

Enjoyed the challenge.

 

[Aussie Bob]

Got my Barrio GT90 line floating WF6 yesterday , being impatient and not wanting to wait until the weekend set it up and got up early this morning to have an hour on the lake before work. The difference compared to the 7 weight is very noticeable , i just seem to have more time on both the back cast and forward cast and the line unfurls much better. The rod seems to be in control of the line rather than fighting the line with the Airflo 7 weight i had before.
I did have a go with someone's 6 weight Rio last week and that was was an improvement but it was some top of the range line and was near enough $100 retail so i took a chance on the Barrio. Only had one go so far but very impressed so far.
Even better caught a brownie of about a pound on a nymph which has broken my (very) extensive run of blanks...!!!

 

[Alan Tyler]

Haven't chucked fluff in earnest for nearly a decade now, but I seem to recall that the "6-7" rating meant #6 Double taper, #7 Weight-forward.
Sometimes you'll see three figures; the third is the optimum for a shooting head.

As already said, going up a size improves control at short range; going down a size can give a longer reach, especially with a DT.

If on a budget, get a few mill-ends and play around. And bear in mind that a level line will go further than a double taper, and is (or was) a lot cheaper, but the tip tends to slap down a bit, so it's not good for short leader work.

All this may be obsolete, of course.