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  1. #71
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Bonney View Post
    All very sensible mate, but this has gone on for too long.

    I've offered many a time... if they leave me alone I'll leave them alone, one or two have taken that offer up, going by the fact they no longer join in when the shoal gather.

    For others I'm afraid it doesn't work, they have age old problems/ulterior motives I'm afraid.


    Oh by the way ,my nets go in after they break cover,I don't go looking for them.
    Interestingly enough the first incident of name calling on this thread was Mark Brailsford2 and his "gob shites" jibe.
    The second was by Fred Bonney with the "nitpix" snipe, which he kept going at.

    So what all the waffle quoted above is all about, god only knows.

    Laters.

  2. #72
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Colin, you conveniently missed out post 38, by nitpix!

    And as Mark's "Gob shites" it wasn't aimed at anybody in particular, they exist everywhere and you know it.
    You took it up as a personal jibe against you I think...if the cap fits I suppose!

  3. #73
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Bonney View Post
    Colin, you conveniently missed out post 38, by nitpix!

    And as Mark's "Gob shites" it wasn't aimed at anybody in particular, they exist everywhere and you know it.
    You took it up as a personal jibe against you I think...if the cap fits I suppose!
    No convenient missing of posts, in post #38 nicepix mentioned your "belligerence"; well you are 'belligerent' - By your own admission you'll fight/argue with anyone/everyone that goes against you!
    I recall you telling me that you'd disagree with everything I write/say - If that's not belligerence what is; as I must obviously don't know the meaning of the word.

    As for Mark's "Gob Shites" jibe; please stop trying to play puerile games and be genuine for once, or does your duplicitousness know no bounds? We all know it was aimed at everyone that openly admits to not being an ATr member, myself included!

    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Bonney View Post
    Oh by the way ,my nets go in after they break cover,I don't go looking for them.
    Fred you stated early yesterday that you threw a little bait in knowing that it'd draw the shoalies into open water, then you say; "I don't go looking for them."
    I'll be polite and say the two statements are wholly contradictory!


    This pathetic state of affairs will just keep on surfacing until such time as you stop being so disingenuous with your posts.

  4. #74
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Glad you study my posts so well, so bloody what,God help us, nitpic2.
    Belligerence is quite acceptable to me,and hardly a personal insult.As for taking on anybody who goes against me I'm afraid that only applies to those who are looking for trouble.I'm sure you could find that from my posts in your little file!
    I will not let those who think they have all the answers, when they obviously haven't,get away with it.asp and elbows comes to mind
    Last edited by Fred Bonney; 13-10-2013 at 13:33.

  5. #75
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Bonney View Post
    Glad you study my posts so well, so bloody what,God help us, nitpic2.
    Belligerence is quite acceptable to me,and hardly a personal insult.
    I will not let those who think they have all the answers, when they obviously haven't,get away with it.asp and elbows comes to mind
    Thank you Fred, you've answered more than you realise with that post.

  6. #76
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Really?

    I must have deleted part of my response, because I meant to add, what I consider to be the personal insult came within that nitpix post.
    Last edited by Fred Bonney; 13-10-2013 at 13:45.

  7. #77

    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    For months I've been grabbing snatch glimpses at FM and see some great articles, I relish a chance to add anything that may be of any use in what start out to be really sensible debates...only to get to the same old trite.
    Here's one, why doesn't FM have any young posters?

    Seriously, enough is enough. I've been watching this unfold for long enough to have formed an opinion and I'm sorry but Fred, if you love the ATr so much (as i do) then FFS stop banging on the way you are, i'm not convinced you're that bothered, it's just something you can use as an excuse to wind the others up, taunting until they bite and then claiming total ignorance as to why they are getting back.

    It really is embarrassing and has now ended with people who I meet on the bank that ask if I'm an FM member commenting on such ridiculousness.

    Just let it go man...or maybe you like being the one that ruins it all.

    Now, I just wanted to chip in with some of my own observations, being that I'm only a young to middling fart and have ears to the ground with participation.

    There are some brilliant organisations out there that that offer some form of angling activity, usually these are charity based that obtain funding to deliver certain things by tapping into the needs of schools (usually non mainstream) and charitable organisations, or indeed public sector funded groups like young offenders institutes.
    Even with various projects I've worked with, I've had the pleasure of introducing over 1000 kids and their families to fishing, much of that through Reading and District, that's just me and a small group of wonderful coaches so expect the national annual number of kids sampling fishing to be in the region of 5-8000
    One of my current projects at Thames Waters Walthamstow reservoirs has surpassed my expectations, the numbers wanting to come and fish are amazing and that's 5 minutes from central London, sessions here often incorporate learning about the natural environment and learning about water itself so the wider message about angling is getting out there.

    BUT....
    That's where it stops.
    We're really quite good in the uk now at providing these introductory days but it's the step afterward that I'm stumped on but I'll keep going till I find a solution.

    Now, it seems that coming to try fishing is to be logged with a day at the zoo or the beach and maybe a return will occur next year.
    It's the next steps, the continual engagement that needs to be created.

    I guess I'm not unique in my first outings as a 9 year old fisher, the whole day was spent in the wilderness with pals, within the light of that long summers day, my life changed, I doubt it would've had it only been a 4 hour snapshot.

    What more can we do then?
    I've investigated the barriers in my region and here are the top 5, these are from the kids and the parents themselves

    1. Mum/dad don't want to get up early on saturday morning in order to drop child off.

    2. Mum/dad won't let child cycle or walk to the venue because the daily mail reckons there's a perv behind every bush big enough to hide a perv

    3. Mum/dad don't want their child out, at least if they are in their room, they know where they are

    4. Dad used to take child fishing with him but now leaves him at home so he can enjoy what little free time he gets nowadays (WTF!!)

    5. Child used to go fishing (on club waters) but felt a bit uncomfortable when older members used to tell him to move swims, sneer etc.

    Some in recent times have chided the fact that we have such stringent health and safety laws now, crb checks etc but there is a reason for this.

    For angling to have had a chance in recent years to be even looked at with anything other than a lazy fat mans sport, the ATr and the then Angling development board had to do a few things to bring angling in to line with other mainstream recognized sports, in doing so they had to show complete parity with safeguarding, professional development and of course promoting participation. Like it or not, we have to conform to safeguarding checks and risk assessments and the like, it's as much to keep the coaching individuals safe as it is for the participants

    Anyway, the ADB did well and now we have a great number of level one and level two coaches out there who now help to deliver the yearly request from Sport England, which, in my opinion is a good thing, though challenging.

    This year for example, sport England want to see more continual participation from anglers aged 25 to 50 (or there abouts) They have obviously looked at recent participation stats and see that in conjunction with what the EA support at a local council and club level (internal funding for that drops year on year) and what the ATr do, the figures for juniors TRYING angling are really quite good, obviously it's easy to see from licence sales that the 50 and over age bracket covers angling very well, so, Sport England are pushing for us to get the 25+ out angling on a regular basis, hopefully just in time for them to really get into it before having kids and champing at the bit to get them going out with them when old enough.

    Again though, doing all this usually relies on volunteers and I suppose, I ask, how far can we push the boundaries of what we can physically do?
    Hire mini buses and collect and drop off?
    One to one (buddy system) full days out?

    Quite correctly, a few on here have asked about what the industry is doing about this....not much, apart from the contributors who help support national fishing month through the angling trades association which is minimal...not much at all though some do supply a few groups with the odd bit of tackle.
    It amazes me that they are the ones who will feel the decline the greatest but refuse or fail to look at the possible long term solutions to what will ultimately be their end.
    As for tackle shops, as far as I'm aware, the only big player doing anything of note is Glasgow Angling center in conjunction with Get Hooked on fishing which is great, we can't expect the smaller shops to do too much in all honesty but most round here will give a bit of dead stock or some maggots to the cause.
    Quite telling, recently, at RDAA, we had a break in to the container that holds...or rather held about 2-3k of fishing gear for the juniors, individually, none of it was of any particular worth. Anyway, they took the lot and I announced it on twitter, now, we are followed by a number of big companies and retailers....not one took the opportunity to offer anything in order to keep our sessions going, not even to make a big public cynical gesture in front of thousands of twitter users.
    I did however get some private messages from kind hearted individuals, some sponsored anglers who offered some bits of kit.

    I think I may have lost the plot at some points through this....it's the cracking roast (and subsequent steam treacle sponge) cooked by Mrs B that's done something to my metabolism.

    Anyone interested in helping out in their region but don't know who to ask or how, please feel free to drop me a pm and I'll willingly help.

  8. #78
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    So is the first bit an official request Will, or a personal suggestion ?

    If there is any nagging doubt, my thoughts are only for the Angling Trust, I just wonder though if you have really read whose doing the taunting!

    Whilst I'm on,and as a paid up member, when are the Angling Trust going to save all the hassle we've had lately, and think before they put out a press releases and pontifications?

    The latest being the direct debit fiasco!
    Prior to that fracking, and prior to that the suggestion of the killing of a seal!

    So firstly, are the Trust expecting members and potential new members to pay 10 monthly or 12 monthly payments of £2.50, because it isn't at all clear? So £25 a year or £30 a year?

    And talking of seals, what has been done about the seal, it's still there! No idea what it may be doing to fish stocks, if anything, so what's happening?
    Last edited by Fred Bonney; 13-10-2013 at 23:05.

  9. #79
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    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Hell of a post Will! Shame it'll be lost to posterity when this thread evaporates into the ether like the other one about the Angling Trust.

  10. #80

    Default Re: A Million Voices for Angling

    Thanks Jack.
    When I pressed send on the post, I promised myself not to get drawn into anything other than the issues raised by Rons great article.
    I have to answer Fred though, it's officially personal request Fred. I have no beef with you but I am looking at the whole thing objectively. We can all feel like the one being harmed when we're being disagreed with = existentialism.

    For the sake of this thread, and the potential new members to FM (I have no vested interest other than enjoying the forums) please just stop, and please, the same request to those that need to place a comment that'll kick it all off again.

    The ATr thread has been and gone, the same things are hashed out, you speak the loudest Fred and I'm afraid that I am slightly annoyed at you managing to imply that ATr members are all sanctimonious and sneering, equal only to white middle class twin set and pearl wearing, church going bigots.

    Thats it, PM me for further Fred, I'll only be replying to any matters arising from my last post.

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