How close are we

  • Thread starter Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)
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BAZ (Angel of the North) aka Fester

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I agree with you Ron.
Now then where are these armchair biologists and botanists that keep repeating "everyone to their own"?
Very short sighted of them if you ask me.
 
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Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)

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Good old Baz, at least someone agrees with me.

I bring you back to angling's roots.

We as anglers are in persuit of a wild animal. When we succeed, we want that success because we have outwitted a wild animal in its natural environment using a method that gives the fish a choice, whether to take your bait, or whether not to take your bait.

Certainly not because the poor bloody fish is starving and has to rely on our baits and groundbaits to exist.

I was in my local tackle shop the other day and an "angler" came in complaining that he had not had a bite in two visits to a local canal.

"Bloody shame!" I thought. When I was a kid there were times when I didn't have a bite in weeks on my own local canal. But it didn't matter to me. In time I learned how to fish, and when I did, I started catching the fish I was after.

For crying out loud, let's return to the time when you had to possess a certain degree of skill to get a bite, let alone a keepnet full of pastie carp which have been taken because your hook bait is the only thing that will feed them, to keep them alive.

Such angling concepts are totally unethical. Not only that, they are obscene.
 
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EC

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I agree with Ron too, in fact I am not sure that there is anyone at all on this thread who doesn't actually agree with what Ron is saying!

Paul "Consumer demand does not drive this leisure activity, it is a 'construct' of the industry that feeds upon it."

Consumers are certainly creating a demand Paul as the numbers of commercial fisheries that are (still) appearing show! The fisheries would not appear if there was not the consumer demand.

I take your point though that many anglers are almost 'forced' down the commercial route with promotional articles(adverts) etc.

edit

forgot to say, each to thei.....
 
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Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)

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But Eddie, these waters are still obscene!
 
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EC

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I know Ron, some are vile, 'The future of fishing' one such water used to have on its gates!

Scabby brown carp, grey mud banks and anglers every 5 metres, yet the place was full to the brim of match anglers and day ticket anglers, I dont get it either!
 
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EC

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I recall speaking to an employee at another fishery whom told me that one of his jobs was to scoop out the dead fish, very early in the morning, often in prep for another truckload to be delievered later that day!

Put and kill fisheries!
 

Mark Wintle

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There is only one BIG problem in all of this - The EA. Time after time they make a few noises or sit on the fence on serious issues.

They could sort out and enforce stocking levels at sensible levels.

They could sort out predation by the black death.

They could sort out byelaws re taking fish.

They could sort out the illegal stockings.

They could sort out proper byelaws that would cover a multitude of other angling issues.

But don't hold your breath....
 
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EC

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Am thinking the EA will claim that legislation such as the above can only come from government Mark!
 
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BAZ (Angel of the North) aka Fester

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I was told that the E.A. could only "advise" on stocking levels but not enforce it. If a fishery then loses any amount of fish it is just tough luck if the owner did not take the Agencys advice in the first place.
 
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EC

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I think you're right Baz, the bits on their web site I believe are a 'guideline' only.

I wonder sometimes just how owners and the EA can both justify and sanction stocking levels above a certain limit, knowing full well what can happen in times of low oxygen?

Hypothetically a commercial owner seeks section 30 permission

EA grants section 30 permission, knowing full well that stock levels are high enough as is, then, months later responds to call out when fish start going belly up?

I know a few EA officials look in, maybe I'm miles behind and this is never the case!Seems a bit mad to me, almost like the fire brigade allowing a fire to start just so they can try and put it out!
 

Mark Wintle

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Eddie and Baz,

You are correct in that the EA only advise; that's the point - if they got off the fence and started doing somethong about it we'd get sensible laws not stupid ones. We haven't even got consistent byelaws yet across the country despite the EA being in existence for several years.

As Eddie says the EA grant section 30 permission - it can't be rocket science to know what's already in there, the acreage, the stock level, and the consequences?

I forgot to mention -

Sorting out the Water companies
 

Peter Bishop

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Gents, I am afraid commercial fisheries are a fact of life, and will not go away or vanish whatever the views expressed on this site by those fundamentally opposed to their concept. Even if thousands of fish die due to disease and low oxygen levels it would be naive to believe that will signal the end of them or some sort of regulation by the EA. Owners look at fish losses as a unfortunate biproduct of their business, and would simply restock with pastie sized fish after a respectable period of closure. They believe they are giving the fishing public what they want and in commercial world, like prostitution, there will always be someone prepared to cater for the need of instant angling gratification. Indeed, many fisheries are now choosing to breed their own fish so getting around the concern of buying already diseased fish. The next stage will be supplying returnable landing nets to all anglers as part of the entrance fee.
Like it or not Ron, I am afraid your views on commercials-and I am neither for or against them-now represent those of the minority of pleasure and match anglers in this country.
 

Tom (Bream Machine)

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I was a Match Angler, i always enjoyed my fishing, and i did quite well. I joined club which had 4 lakes...two which were used as match waters. One was stocked with small carp, the other with silver fish, and good Bream. The club "policy" was that as the carp grew on to about 7 pounds, they would be netted and stocked into another adjacant lake as potential specimen fish for dedicated carp anglers....this never happened, so now, the match lake is stuffed with carp in excess of 15 pounds, it is a dirty muddy hole, and it has frequent fish mortalities, of which i am sure disease is the cause. The Bream lake is no more, they decided to fill it in with voracious F1's...therfore the Bream could not compete for food, the silvers had virtually disappeared. The commitee, in it's wisdom, having now realised F1's have a limited lifespan as non spawning fish have now stocked Commons and Mirrors to create yet another muddy pool. Already, the Bream have floated to the surface.......without doubt, this poor management of water will lead to disease, if they lose all the fish it will be their own doing for such narrow vision. This situation has led me to virtually abandon match angling on commercial type waters.
 

Steve Spiller

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Same as you Tom, I turned my back on it many years ago.
I have little sympathy for commercials that are stocked to levels where you can walk on water, due to the level of fish.
It was/is a timebomb waiting to go off!

And yes, netting dead fish before the crowds arrive is a fact!

Keeeerching, ?????????'s, is what it is all about!
 
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Tony Rocca

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Thats the whole of the problem Steve.

Money, bait sales, tackle, sponsership, etc has ruined angling.

Was a low cost hobby for the majority, now a cash cow for too many.

Not in my world though.
 
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Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)

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"Like prostitution, there will always be someone to cater for the needs of instant angling gratification."

Peter that is a most profound statement.

Commercial "fisheries" are no more than the angling equivalent of brothels!
 
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The Monk

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money talks unfortunately and yes commercialism has without doubt ruined the sports. Its funny really how angling is now a multimillion pound business yet the bodies which protect angling are still struggling financially. Plenty being taken out of the sport but very little being put back.
 

Peter Bishop

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"Commercials the angling equivilant of brothels!"

But a lot cheaper Ron (I believe-honest)though you still have to get your tackle out and your hands smell the same at the end of the day!
 
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EC

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"your hands smell the same at the end of the day"

Depends what you catch!





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