Dorset Stour on the road to recovery

[jasonbean1]

Not the story I hear!
We shall see.
I must admit I always look at the positive side of life, anything is better than nothing, and certainly better than a moan and doing nothing!

It's the only way to think if we're going to get anywhere at all....doom mongers and blame layers will always have the biggest voice and when projects like this get underway they rise to the surface and spew out the I told you so and it's not going to work....that's there strange world they live in though. Best of luck to the work on the Stour and the lads that are involved will be enjoying doing something positive

Me and a few others are trying on my little patch of river...which beleive me as seen one of the worst collapses of fish stocks for no single reason...there's plenty of things to blame it on but dwelling on them doesnt get you anywhere. All you can do is have a go...work with who will ever listern to you and give you the cash and help...then there's alot of hope and faith that your doing the right thing.

In just a couple of years i've seen the benefits of small scale work and stocking and it's that time now when you move up a gear and ensure the work keeps happening on a larger scale and underlying causes of decline are better understood and if possible dealt with......at the end of the day you've got to try.

P.S.....nice to see CG and Bootey's love affair never wains

Cheers
Jason

 

[Fred Bonney]

Indeed so Jason, as I hinted, even a little is better than nothing, because little things with a bit of encouragement, grow into something bigger.(Yeh,yeh alright!!mg

There's no implication in my point Colin that acceptance of a little is good enough !

 

[Paul Boote]

Paul, I think it is you that has the otter obsession, if you care to reread my post you'll see no mention of otters by me. As for me coming "so badly unstuck" last night, only in your deluded eyes old boy.


Note: Paul Boote, a once respected author and angler, now sadly a laughing stock on many an angling forum (not just my opinion). Once they laughed with him, now they laugh at him!

Carry on, Colin, carry on; my reputation as angler, writer and all-round well-grounded person on and off the riverbank is rock solid, and will live on - unlike those of some.

 

[Mark Wintle]

I wish there was truly something positive happening on the Stour!

The restoration of a weir that already had spawning gravels below will make no difference whatsoever to the decline of the Stour. The 100 metres (why are they so insistent on metric?) apparently restored is less than a tenth of 1% of the Stour, never mind the watershed. Spinning this as an 'improvement' is a joke, and to say the Stour is one of the top ten improved rivers in the UK is so laughable that I can only wonder how it is measured, certainly not on fish stocks. The decline in the last 2 or 3 years has been frightening yet it is not down to pollution but predation.

If the EA were serious about improving rivers they would instigate a culling program on avian predators far in excess of that currently allowed, and stop artificial holts and any reintroductions of otters under any circumstances - the recent announcement of otters in Kent was, I believe, only due to transferring ones from Norfolk, where it was recognised that their impact was detrimental to wildlife

The water demands from Corfe Mullen and Bournemouth/Poole long exceeded the capacity of the Stour hence the water transfer scheme from the Avon to Corfe Mullen and Longham where there are two new reservoirs, and begs the question of just how any increase in population in the SE can be sustained, certainly not without compulsory water metering.

 

[Fred Bonney]

So Mark,if you've seen all this happening over "the last 2 or 3 years".

Let us know what you have done about it? ( apart from perhaps not increasing population levels)

 

[jasonbean1]

I wish there was truly something positive happening on the Stour!

Mark, it's taken years to **** these rivers up and chances are things will get worste before they get better...you can sit back and get bitter about it, but it don't feel good. few years back that's how I was, shouting and screaming at anyone that would listern particularly the local EA officer, good job he was a patient man...i've since learnt it get's you knowhere.

Understanding the problems of a river and how to repair the damage is very complex...the EA fisheries teams have an unenviable job and to be honest most anglers seem to want to slag them off rather than help them....at the end of the day they're pretty much all we've got.

So Mark you think that if all the cormorants we're shot along with half the population of the south east the river would be OK...thing is you would never know because that will never happen...same as otter numbers declining. All these problems are here to stay...so either do something positive for your own good or accept it's going to be **** and wollow in your own doom.

choice is yours Mark

Cheers
Jason

 

[Mark Wintle]

Jason,
Two questions:

How much knowledge do you have of the problems with cormorants on Dorset rivers? I pointed out the problems in 1980 and the WWA, and its successor the EA, have sat on the fence ever since the two species were mistakenly accorded protection (only the pigmy cormorant was meant to be protected) as part of the Countryside and wildlife act of 1981. There has been a catastrophic impact on dace, roach, salmon, chub, grayling, flounders (especially Poole Harbour where cormorant numbers have gone from about 5 to 300-400+ (variable) in 30 years)

What justification is there for the Dorset Stour being one of the top 10 most improved rivers in the UK? Pure spin is what I'm seeing. Maybe it's just the presence of otters?

I tried phoning my 'local' EA office the other day - nothing to do with fisheries - and everything is through national helplines and emails. Eventually it will get local as it's a local problem but a lot of barriers in the way.

Maybe I'll ask their national press office to justify the 'most 'improved' status on a river going downhill so fast it beggars belief. The anglers have already deserted 80% of it, how many will bother to fish it in another 5 years? Yet who else apart from anglers pay to use it?

 

[jasonbean1]

Mark
I have no knowledge of the dorset stour, however I fish in a region where the problems have now had there worste effects on the fisheries, i can't see them getting any worste because on the small thames tributaries there's very little left......the only one that really could finish them off is abstraction.

regarding classification of the river, my local river the cherwell is classified by the EA as a "good" status regarding fish stocks, now I know that's not right, the local EA fisheries know that's not right...but the way they are classified through chemical status and fish stocks can be very subjective. the majority of the cherwell round my way is devoid of fish but on one of there annual survey points it show's up a good head of fish including a few barbel. the problem now comes with the water framework directive being implimented, the current classification of the cherwell means little cash will be forthcoming, so hopefully regarding fish stocks we can change the good classification and this what the EA fisheries are trying to do.

Are you a member of your local consultative? if not your knowledge and passion for improving the river would be best served there where you can sit face to face with the EA on a regular basis. You can then ask the question of where this classifiaction comes from and question it's accuracy

You will tend to find that most anglers will drift away from the river if the fishings that bad and if anglers concerns are not voiced to the EA very little will be done as the benefits of fish in the river to angling clubs as to be quantifyable ie are the local clubs memberships dropping, are the matches dissapearing off the river, are the EA's own reports from electro fishing and alike saying there's less fish in the river? If the clubs are suffering from less fish then the clubs need to be saying this and the EA have to start to do something...which it looks like they are.

Mark there is a structure in how best to deal/work with the EA and that starts with representing your local club at the consultative.

Cheers
Jason

 

[cg74]

Carry on, Colin, carry on; my reputation as angler, writer and all-round well-grounded person on and off the riverbank is rock solid, and will live on - unlike those of some.

Well Paul, if you're happy in that belief, all's good for your mental equilibrium, I guess.

---------- Post added at 07:00 ---------- Previous post was at 06:44 ----------

Indeed so Jason, as I hinted, even a little is better than nothing, because little things with a bit of encouragement, grow into something bigger.(Yeh,yeh alright!!mg

There's no implication in my point Colin that acceptance of a little is good enough !

Sorry Fred but I read; "I must admit I always look at the positive side of life, anything is better than nothing, and certainly better than a moan and doing nothing!"
As showing a typically British acceptance of 'our little lot' and 'anything is better than nothing' Like somehow we should be grateful for small mercies.

If I misread your point, I apologize.

 

[Fred Bonney]

Apology accepted Colin.

 

[alan whittington]

Nothing to do with a comparatively few recently re-appeared otters, everything to do with ever-here, ever-blind, someone or something else is to blame, millions of us.

Sorry Paul,but if this was in answer to my post,i meant it as poke at the EA,in so much as the amount of work to ensure the success of the furry otter,but little effort to ensure the survival of their prey,nationwide.Without doubt 70,000,000 peeing,drinking and washing humans totally blow our rivers apart and Jason,try and get a committee to do something about them.

 

[Paul Boote]

The default-setting paranoia of the Internet and Modern "Angling", eh...?

 

[Fred Bonney]

Just a little more from Pete Reading's Diary on the BS website

Stour works completed
12th August 2011

The Barbel Society has just contributed towards an EA-led project to improve the habitat in the Dorset Stour, and 2K from the Stour Barbel Project funding has been used to provide materials for croys which form part of a reconstruction of a washed -out weir at Throop. The EA used hundreds of tonnes of stone to reshape the weir, and re-profiled the gravels above and below, creating habitat for many species, but especially potential spawning shallows for barbel. The BS has worked in partnership with both the EA and local clubs to try and repair the damage caused by the brutal dredging of the river in the Eighties. I provided them with 30 year-old pictures of the dragline piling up gravel from Barbel Bend, a fantastic barbel area at that time, where we used to wade across the river on the fast gravel shallows, The same spot is now fifteen feet deep and full of Canadian pondweed. The extensive dredging removed gravels throughout the river, and at least eight of these cobbled stone weirs were put in to try and retain water levels after this almost criminal exercise. Salmon fishing was almost immediately destroyed, with Stour salmon virtually extinct these days. Barbel have taken longer to decline, but loss of spawning gravels has undoubtedly been a massive contribution to their decline in the Stour.
With some careful support stocking, and associated habitat improvement to help the river repair more quickly, we could see the barbel recovering soon. The local EA Officer with responsibility for the Stour is working tremendously hard to put together more projects to restore the river, and the BS will try and help as much as we can with our limited resources. The stone croys above and below the reconstructed weir will help to create current diversity, scouring the new gravel riffles, and also provide habitat for fry just downstream.

 

[richiekelly]

were a funny lot us anglers, this seems to have been a genuine attempt to put right some of the damage done by the old river authority, its a start and yes there are many other things wrong with our rivers and the EA know this and do nothing about a lot of them, i am not a great supporter of the EA but on this occasion they along with the BS [i am not a member] should be congratulated for at least trying to do something positive to improve habitat on the river.

 

[alan whittington]

were a funny lot us anglers, this seems to have been a genuine attempt to put right some of the damage done by the old river authority, its a start and yes there are many other things wrong with our rivers and the EA know this and do nothing about a lot of them, i am not a great supporter of the EA but on this occasion they along with the BS [i am not a member] should be congratulated for at least trying to do something positive to improve habitat on the river.

I agree with you,lets hope it does some good,ive been listening to 'fishermans blues' on talksport this morning,which made me ring in and ask Keith Arthur,why as a member of the angling trust,arent they doing more for the declining rivers in southern England,he didnt answer the point as he was supposed to after the news,but,his comment before the news,was basically that these rivers are a lost cause and are at present beyond help.

 

[Neil Maidment]

The BS deserve tremendous credit for their contribution to this and other Stour projects.

But for the EA to spin such projects citing Salmon is just that, spin for public consumption. I guess the public at large don't have a clue what a Barbel looks like, or indeed most other coarse fish, so the Salmon is used for effect. Pure fiction in the name of public justification.

That general area of the Dorset Stour has been raped in the name of flood protection for decades. The stretches above Throop: Parley, Muscliffe and Redhill saw massive straightening exercises in the 1970's, followed by the dredging highlighted by Pete Reading. But that is just one part of the very depressing story surrounding a once prolific river.

 

[alan whittington]

Neil a question for,during my two week stay(and before,as i was warned),the ribbon weed on the tidal section was mega,if this continues to worsen year on year it will be unfishable,i take it,this is down to low water levels during spring,with warmer temps than normal and if spring flush throughs took place,which should lower temps and colour the river,less weed would result,is the river from Throop up as bad?

 

[Neil Maidment]

Early season and Summer can be really hard work down there. Parts of Throop and above can be a daunting prospect particularly for those with an aversion to weed! But there is still some stunning fishing to be had (but nowhere near as prolific as it used to be). Mobility is the key for me.

I rarely fish it nowadays unless and until there's been a good flush through. The recent very heavy local rain did some good but I couldn't get down there. It also didn't last too long as the torrential downpours were very localised. It's once the first proper floods resulting from rain higher up the Stour have happened that usually sees me get the rods out.

I very much favour the late Autumn and Winter for my trips down there. Even when I was local, I preferred the Avon (at least those parts that were available early season) to the Stour.

Luxuriant weed goes hand in hand with the Stour but the amount of all that green slimy stuff seems to get more and more prevalent every year.

 

[alan whittington]

Early season and Summer can be really hard work down there. Parts of Throop and above can be a daunting prospect particularly for those with an aversion to weed! But there is still some stunning fishing to be had (but nowhere near as prolific as it used to be). Mobility is the key for me.

I rarely fish it nowadays unless and until there's been a good flush through. The recent very heavy local rain did some good but I couldn't get down there. It also didn't last too long as the torrential downpours were very localised. It's once the first proper floods resulting from rain higher up the Stour have happened that usually sees me get the rods out.

I very much favour the late Autumn and Winter for my trips down there. Even when I was local, I preferred the Avon (at least those parts that were available early season) to the Stour.

Luxuriant weed goes hand in hand with the Stour but the amount of all that green slimy stuff seems to get more and more prevalent every year.

I caught fairly well on evening sessions,the first week was when the Bournemouth flash floods occured,very limited swims in comparison to last year though.

 

[Mark Wintle]

On the lovely roach stretches it's virtually impossible to fish until late November due to weed but the roach are vanishing fast. Catches at Wimborne dropped by 99.9% between 2009/10 and 2010/11 - the EA are investigating!

I'd challenge Jim Allen for evidence of the salmon. As Neil say the 60s were the last of the salmon fishing; the best years were 1955, 56 and 65 all with about 102 rod-caught salmon per year. In the early 70s when the big dredge was done those figures dropped to 5-7, then by the early 80s to 0-2, and they've never recovered.

I fear what we may have left is the odd 'flyer' and not a lot in between. Whether the BS's efforts to restock barbel will succeed I don't know; I think there are a few small barbel in a quiet gulley near where I live but other than that not aware of continued sightings. In the Avon things may be brighter?

The EA surveys were mentioned; I have those from the 90s but after 2000 these became impossible to obtain despite my best efforts.