What was it about Hornsea Mere.......

[Tee-Cee]

Thumbing through a copy of John Baileys's book 'ROACH - The gentle Giants' I came across a chapter entitled Yorkshire Roaching, Past and Present. In this chapter, written by Kevin Clifford, he talks about the amazing catches of big roach, specifically around the 1915/ 20 period and then what the water period produces at the time the book was written (around 1987).
Some of the catches made during the earlier period are simply staggering with people such as Wilf Cutting; Eight fish with an average weight of 2lb 5oz, eighteen fish for 43lbs and then J H R Bazley; three fish over 3lbs, fifty fish over 2lbs in a single month, then Mr Kempsey; nineteen fish for 44lbs 8ozsand his friend Mr Tether; 63 fish for 126lbs and on and on and on....
Also in the book is a postcard of the catch made by MR Field/Mr Tether of the 63 fish for 126lbs caught and all retained.

The water eventually went down hill until in the 1960's a Mr Merritt fished it for 6 years in search of big fish yet never managed to catch one over 10ozs.

He talks of other Yorkshire waters such as the Ure where Steve Hall had 80lbs of big roach with eleven over 2lbs with the biggest at 2lbs 9ozs in a sitting in 1979..............

But it is the mere which 'rings my bell' and that catch of 63 roach.....Why did such a massive amount of roach breed in that particular water? Yes, it's big at 470 acres but the numbers of roach caught, and kept, is still staggering...

Does anyone fish it now or over the last 10 years or so, or can anyone throw any light on these massive catches, or have any idea if the water itself was chemically different in some way??

Obviously not the water it once was but are big roach still caught??

 

[sam vimes]

Obviously not the water it once was but are big roach still caught??

I would suspect that you might struggle for good information. There's very little in the public domain. I suspect that is partly due to the hardy few that fish it being a little secret squirrel and simply not that many actually fishing it. Those that do tend to be carp or predator anglers. An awful lot are put off by the restrictive hours of 9am to 5pm only, others are daunted by the sheer size, weediness and depth (remarkably shallow) of the lake. Even when I lived relatively close by, I never did more than have a look. In addition, it's a bit of a chew on to get to, even from the places close by that are slightly more populous. Many of the good angling burghers of Hull have alternate venues with more promise that are easier to get to. I've not heard of anything exceptional, carp, pike or roach, coming from it for years. I've heard of the odd cracking perch though.

 

[mick b]

In the early 50s I fished Wilstone Reservoir with my father and uncle, it was the practice then to take fish home for food because England was still under food rationing.
Almost all the fish we caught were big Roach, many between 1lb & 1.5lbs and it was these big ones that were always taken for food.

Removal of big fish severely damages a fishery because science has proven that big fish produce more and larger eggs than smaller fish, those eggs hatch quicker and the resultant fry grow faster and achieve maturity quicker.

Thus the taking of big Roach from the Hornsea Mere would result in a lowering of the average size and might even cause a population crash.
Interestingly I don't think Wilstone has ever produced such big Roach as we caught in the 50s.

Sam's post about the big Perch perfectly reflects the Wilstone of today.

Interesting post BTW.
.

 

[Merv Harrison]

Sam is right in all that he says, most of the access points are not conducive to angling.

And at a size of approx 2 miles by 1 mile that's a lot of water.

A 'gentleman' who has fished it, and successfully if I remember correctly, was a Mr Ron Clay. If you go onto the DVSG website, you can contact him from there re more information.

---------- Post added at 19:23 ---------- Previous post was at 19:20 ----------

One further point, and I don't know if Sam would agree, but when you look at the Mere, it always appears very daunting to me.

Apologies, re-reading Sams reply, he'd already stated being daunted mg:

 

[sam vimes]

Merv,
at a guess you live somewhere in or around Hull. That could mean Hornsea being as little as twenty miles from you (I doubt anywhere in East Yorkshire is much further than 45 miles from Hornsea). Might I ask how many times you've fished Hornsea Mere in the last ten years?

 

[Merv Harrison]

Sam, i've never fished Hornsea Mere, but i've looked at it many times when visiting over the years.

I'm 41 mile away from Hornsea, live on the outskirts of a little village near Howden (East Yorks).

 

[sam vimes]

Sam, i've never fished Hornsea Mere, but i've looked at it many times when visiting over the years.

I'm 41 mile away from Hornsea, live on the outskirts of a little village near Howden (East Yorks).

About as far away as you can get without straying out of the East Riding then. Still, I'll bet that the majority that live closer would say similar.

 

[Merv Harrison]

Before the Boundary changes, we were on the 'doorstep' of being out of the East Riding, an iron bridge over the River Ouse being the limit.

 

[Tee-Cee]

I've had a quick look at the map and I can see why reaching it is a major problem and why the size suggests fishing it is termed as 'daunting'. Having said that, we are in 2013 and these massive catches were made more or less 100 years ago so planning to fish it, let alone reaching the place must have been a nightmare for anglers. Transport must have been non existent at that time so how did these hardy souls drag gear for a days fishing?
The place is 470 acres for a start so regardless of the large quantities of big roach available and spread over that area, locating them must have been a challenge to say the least.
As Merv says, the size equates to something like 2 x 1 miles so even walking the place would take ages, never mind trying to work out where the fish might be. It all sounds so fraught with problems I have to wonder how they worked out that it was worth spending time on it. Even by todays standards you would have to think hard before attempting such a project so it's hat's off to those who had success at the place all those years ago.

My wife has just looked on Wiki (whilst I'm typing this) and apparently it was purchased for £15 (?) back in the 16th century by a local family and forms part of a local estate(?)...It is also a SSSI so probably home to thousands of birds - not easy to fish with the water generally 5' deep with some areas down to 12' AND birds diving for your bait......

On that basis I shall not be travelling north any time soon!!

Still, one has to admire those anglers of yesteryear who did make the effort...................

 

[binka]

It's an intriguing subject Tee-Cee with many more intriguing questions within it.

I've only ever heard of the place in association with, in the main, long forgotten big pike reports and can't remember who wrote about it (or gave it a mention) in relation to pike... Nev Fickling maybe?

I've had a Google Earth of the place and it does appear very large, the fact that it is so close to the coast just adds further intrigue for me.

 

[keora]

The late Barrie Rickards wrote about pike fishing in Hornsea mere back in the 60s and 70s. See his book Fishing for Big Pike written jointly with Ray Webb in 1971, with a second edition 5 years later.

He also mentions it frequently in a later book, Big Pike, 1986.

 

[Merv Harrison]

Apologies, should have thought about this earlier..........

Hornsea Mere - Hornsea

 

[chub_on_the_block]

Our Mark Wintle in his book Big Roach also discusses Hornsea Mere. He contends that it was declining by the late 1920s, following removal of large Perch and eels by anglers thus reducing predation and increasing the numbers of smaller roach.

In the Norfolk broads i think the loss of big roach followed the habitat changes there, which included loss of weedbeds and associated food much of this happening as late as the 1950s or 1960s in some cases (although broads like Hickling affected by saline incursions).

Generally, to get big roach you need a small population size and abundant food. Perhaps waters impacted by cormorants may throw up some?

 

[Tee-Cee]

Quoting from the Bailey book again; Kevin Clifford states the Mere (probably) started to decline in the 30's although catches were still decent made including one of 24 fish for 60lbs in 1934. The decline, apparently accelerated after the 2nd Great War.
It was opened in '62 to the public with Clifford fishing it for the first time in '59. He talks of concentrations of roach around the boat jetties, where the roach in tens of thousands gathered in 3' of water. He caught many on bare hooks but none were over a 1lb in weight...
He also states roach are making a comeback (this around 1979!!) with fish up to 2lb 10ozs but many around the 2lb mark.

From Merv 's attachment it seems the place is now mainly for birdwatchers with café, toilets etc etc with much watercraft and the like.... Not ideal for catching extra large roach!!

Clifford also mentions toward the end of his chapter that other Yorkshire waters, mainly rivers such as the Ure and the Wharfe also produced magical roach catches including one during an Angling Times winter league match when he landed five roach over 2lbs including one of 2lbs 12ozs. This in 1977 by a John Layfield.........

Anyway, it seems I've missed yet another roach bonanza by 100 years so i'll have to keep looking................

Thanks for the interest shown though........

 

[flightliner]

My friend used to fish it back in the mid sixties-- he was in a well known speci group at the time. They had big pike and witnessed massive shoals of small roach but never evidence of the fabled big ones that had been reported in earlier years.
To be honest I dont ever recall seeing any pictures of those "big" roach -- do any exist as I would like to see them.
If non are existant then I would be a little sceptical of them ever being had in such propotions/numbers, are there any ?.
I fished it myself back in the very early eighties but not with any deal of success.
Nice place tho but being an angler who tends to "fly solo" its a bit pricey on the fual front these days.

Back in the mid to late nineties there was a big yorkshire water doing loads of twos. They were dead easy. They were in the angling press almost every week with them being mentioned in almost every case as "fish from nottinghamshire" . It was a lot of "secret sid " stuff but the clues were there for anyone interested.It was soon attended by guys from as far away as london and all points on the compass.
It all ended in tears however which was very dissapointing.

 

[laguna]

Been there not done it (too big for my liking) wonderful scenery and wildlife and certainly not geared towards anglers these days. Despite its vastness there's only bank side room for a few and you will be descended upon by literally hundreds of ****y bird enthusiasts.
Biggest roach ever caught by yours truly was on the river Calder near Huddersfield circa '72, never seen one that big before nor since, my brothers Corona pop bottle was used to measure it.

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w309/huggie74/corona.jpg

 

[nicepix]

Hornsea is unusual for a large lake in that it is predominantly shallow. A lot of the larger lakes are dammed valleys and have steep sides leading to great depths that for most of the year are dead zones. Hornsea like some of the Broads also benefits from a salinity and it is my belief that some fish, roach and pike in particular, that we associate with freshwater actually thrive in saline environments.

 

[flightliner]

Hornsea mere was once shown on yorkshire tv, apparently it was scoured out in the ice age.
Maybe that has something to do with its uniqueness ?

 

[Tee-Cee]

flightliner......If you would like to see a picture of some of the roach taken around 1920 then The Bailey book mentioned in my initial post shows the 63 roach for 126lbs on page 121. These caught by Messrs Field and Tether in July of that year.

Page 120 shows six roach in a glass case, smallest 2lb 4ozs and the biggest 2lbs 12ozs and although black and white a wonderful picture.....

I have to say again that this book is very, very good as a specimen roach book and generally based on the Bailey crews attempt to catch big roach (in the Norfolk area) it also has excellent chapters by others including Wilson, Miles and Clifford....
Over the years it has served as a fine reference book for locations, baits and tactics and is well worth a read even if it is well over 30 years old. Good reading for those contemplating a big roach attempt or interested in some general history of how it might be done!!

For me, reading such books fires me up and I shall be out again this week making the effort.................hopefully 'my ship will come in' one of these days..

 

[keora]

I've been looking at Barrie Rickards' book "Big Pike" (1986) about the decline in pike fishing at Hornsea. He said the Mere is 1.5 miles long, yet there was only one hotspot discovered in spite of heavy fishing. "Hornsea Mere was hammered unlike any other water I have ever seen and it just lasted three years. Ray and I were responsible for letting the cat out of the bag, a thing we regret.....".