Stocking Levels

[no-one in particular]

There have always been day ticket fisheries Mark, not classed as out and out commercials, they do offer some anglers the opportunity to fish in relative comfort, lots of country parks and leisure venues like holiday parks. The full blown commie is a different animal, some guys do graduate to harder venues, most do not and these people sometimes kid themselves that all Carp fishing is easy. Alot of guys that fish for carp have also extensively fished for other species and still do. The trick is to get a balanced view of what angling is about, once youngsters have hauled the endless stream of hungry carp from a commy, you have little chance of taking him float fishing on a river or having a pleasure day on the canal.The expectation is raised that only carp have any value and all the skill sets that would have made him a better angler will never be taught. I never look down on other anglers but i shake my head in despair at some venues, the guys most likely to belittle other anglers are either commy carpers themselves that noddify anyone who doesnt fish for them, or the ultra cult brigade that have graduated from the commies and now feel superior, if they have done the apprenticeship this wouldnt happen. There are a lot of commies where i live and i have seen major fish kills over the years on quite a few, mostly down to overstocking, bad handling and bait pollution.

I used to fish a lot of day ticket waters but I have found most of them have been taken over by clubs who do not issue day tickets.
I agree with your point about youngsters but better that they fish than not at all which might be the case for a lot of them without commercials.
I understand your view but I always think your bit too down about commercials.
I think our experiences must differ quite a bit.
I never understand this "the fishing is easy". I have often struggled on commercials and blanked.
And I can never relate to the carp puddle descriptions. I fish one that has a tench and bream lake only, plus a mixed fisheries of carp and just about everything else. Another has a silver fish only although I have not fished there for some time. Another has a Rudd and green tench only lake with no carp.
I think there's a fair variety out there at least in my neck of woods if you look for them.
As for the anglers, well there must be the carp obsessed among them and pretty disdainful of everyone and everything else but I have met plenty of good anglers, average or pleasure who are just enjoying a day out. I think you paint a different picture to me but is it that bad?

 

[wanderer]

Carp puddles, usually under 5 ares , sometimes much smaller, all weed eradicated, 3 foot average depth, stuffed to the gunwales with carp that have no option other than eat whats thrown in. Drayton reservoir at 30 acres has over 6000 stocked fish on top of its original inhabitants, go on you tube and watch carp headbangers Erics carp championships at Drayton, one bloke caught 118 pound in 15 minutes, it used to be a cracking Tench venue, and its not even the most prolific around here, Alders farm is far easier, go watch and come back and tell me i am wrong.

 

[snooozer]

I wonder how many of use have blanked more than once on a lake that is stuffed with carp ?

It seems to me a fishery starts off with a modest head of healthy carp with plenty of room to breathe but know one is catching due to low stock levels.

Fishery owner ups the stock levels to attract anglers and try to squash rumours.

Now everyone is happy catching nice carp. Word spreads and the fishery is battered 24/7/364 (Crimbo day off)

Fish now stop chomping boilies as there fed up with a visit to the bank.

Anglers moan and stop fishing, all but the odd particle warrior has fled to the next fishery on the list.

Fishery is now back where it started but has excessive stock.

We can only blame ourselves mg:

 

[Chefster]

Carp puddles, usually under 5 ares , sometimes much smaller, all weed eradicated, 3 foot average depth, stuffed to the gunwales with carp that have no option other than eat whats thrown in. Drayton reservoir at 30 acres has over 6000 stocked fish on top of its original inhabitants, go on you tube and watch carp headbangers Erics carp championships at Drayton, one bloke caught 118 pound in 15 minutes, it used to be a cracking Tench venue, and its not even the most prolific around here, Alders farm is far easier, go watch and come back and tell me i am wrong.

I dont see what your point is??,,,If anglers want to go fishing and get plenty of bites,and hopefully have a good days fishing,then thats up to them,if you dont like it,so what??who really cares??..I fish matches on commies all year round,even if i dont frame/win etc,i can still have a good days fishing,at any time of the year,with plenty of bites...something else to think about,is your view on the anglers that fish these waters,most of them would catch more than you on any venue....Gazza

 

[sam vimes]

The EA did in fact stock barbel into the Roding near to me, but following a pollution refused to stock them again because it had no history of barbel.
They then stocked them into sections of Suffolk Stour that had no barbel until till they stocked them.
The only other stockings of barbel in Essex appear to random ones. I know I did some back in the 60’s/70’s along with other fish. It happened all the time back then, fish appeared to grow wings.

EA policy has changed significantly over the years. The EA have definitely been involved in stocking barbel into rivers where they aren't indigenous in the past. Current policy doesn't allow for it, but that doesn't mean it won't change again in the future. Policies on all kinds of species has changed several times in my lifetime. What's acceptable and permissible one year may not be the next.

There have also been many instances of all kinds of fish walking between venues. Bucket biologists have been responsible for the spread of quite a few species.

 

[wanderer]

Thats the point where the supplementary feeding kicks in Kev, the owners will pour in maize or trout pellets, some do switch off but only on a temporary basis, the fish have no alternative but to eat what is thrown in, there are no naturals. These places always get hammered match boys and the day ticket guys keep the fish busy

 

[wanderer]

I dont see what your point is??,,,If anglers want to go fishing and get plenty of bites,and hopefully have a good days fishing,then thats up to them,if you dont like it,so what??who really cares??..I fish matches on commies all year round,even if i dont frame/win etc,i can still have a good days fishing,at any time of the year,with plenty of bites...something else to think about,is your view on the anglers that fish these waters,most of them would catch more than you on any venue....Gazza

HEE, HEE, dream on mate, i have done some time kicking and screaming on these venues, one i can think off in particular , the only one my elderly match buddies would go near, i bettered the match record by 170 pounds, i wasnt match fishing, the record holder is an old aquantaince Steve Ringer.

 

[Chefster]

HEE, HEE, dream on mate, i have done some time kicking and screaming on these venues, one i can think off in particular , the only one my elderly match buddies would go near, i bettered the match record by 170 pounds, i wasnt match fishing, the record holder is an old aquantaince Steve Ringer.

Ha!,not that difficult to beat a match weight,when pleasure fishing,lol,probably been done hundreds and hundreds of times..totally different kettle of fish in a match scenario..A very good friend of mine Pete Rice,one of the finest river anglers of his time-virtually impossible to beat on commies,John Allerton,again a brilliant river angler,again can be unbeatable on commies,Des Shipp,Alan Scotthorne,Callum ****s,Hadrian Whittle,all brilliant river anglers,all brilliant on commies.....they are just a few household names,there are many ,many more all over the country....just because anglers choose to fish commercial venues,doesnt mean they havent learnt watercraft

 

[wanderer]

They do it for money, your average Joe does it because its easy, dont see many match anglers on the Big fjiords outside Cambridge or many commy boys either.

 

[bennygesserit]

They do it for money, your average Joe does it because its easy, dont see many match anglers on the Big fjiords outside Cambridge or many commy boys either.

Some fish commercials for money
Some because its safe
Some because its accessible
Some because not all commercials are overstocked muddy holes and they like a challenge
Some to try new techniques or because they are learning
Some because thats the level of angling they are happy with

I cant really see anything wrong with any of those reasons and even if I did there isn't much I could or want to do about it generally a lot of things are easier in this country look at meccano in the sixties compared to today for instance. It doesn't stop some people trying to challenge themselves.


Besides I am not sure fish actually feel pain in the conventional sense.

 

[Chefster]

I agree,they do it for money,and prestige as well,if your average joe does it for whatever reason they have,what does it matter?to some people going fishing is about catching fish,and these venues offer that.Personally for me ,the venues i choose to fish offer good sport,not always easy,a chance to compete against higher level anglers,good facilities,not too much walking,and comfortable surroundings,im under no illusion, that im any better than my actual ability,just because i might have a few good results...i enjoy my fishing,and i think thats the main thing,i wouldnt dream of coming on here and starting a thread about "Understocked Waters",and criticising those that choose to fish them..Gazza

 

[thecrow]

match anglers on the Big fjiords outside Cambridge

And here was me thinking that they were in Norway.

Please stop putting others down, everyone has the right to fish where, when and how they wish as long as it is within the law. it gets monotonous.

By the way I view most syndicates as "commies" most are for profit, what is done with that profit is what separates them.

 

[binka]

I agree,they do it for money,and prestige as well,if your average joe does it for whatever reason they have,what does it matter?to some people going fishing is about catching fish,and these venues offer that.Personally for me ,the venues i choose to fish offer good sport,not always easy,a chance to compete against higher level anglers,good facilities,not too much walking,and comfortable surroundings,im under no illusion, that im any better than my actual ability,just because i might have a few good results...i enjoy my fishing,and i think thats the main thing,i wouldnt dream of coming on here and starting a thread about "Understocked Waters",and criticising those that choose to fish them..Gazza

Hey up Gazza good to see you around, how goes it fella?

Any of those commies down your way throwing any big perch up, I've heard numerous reports of a few giants closer to home?

That is of course if they're not starving due to stocking density? :wh

 

[wanderer]

we will have to agree to disagree lads, but next time you lift out your keepnets and the poor crushed fish at the bottom float away for the seagulls, think of what i have said and remember the specialist Bream and Tench boys that have lost their venues so you could crush half a dozen carp to death. Perfect material for the anti angling brigade and in some respects , i agree with them, no values as to animal welfare, battery chickens subsurface.

---------- Post added at 01:02 ---------- Previous post was at 00:04 ----------

And here was me thinking that they were in Norway.

Please stop putting others down, everyone has the right to fish where, when and how they wish as long as it is within the law. it gets monotonous. The Cambridgeshire venues are regular haunts of Dave Lane and Jim Shelley , you stick to what you know if it makes you happy, some of us do not like the way its going and we aint keeping quite.

By the way I view most syndicates as "commies" most are for profit, what is done with that profit is what separates them.

I wasnt going to qoute you our sensitive flying friend with the impressive CV for fear of offending you, fox hunting was within the law some years ago, i suggest some aspects of angling are pushing the boundaries a bit, dont be so comfortable, abuse is on some peoples radar, and even as a lifelong angler mine.

 

[no-one in particular]

Carp puddles, usually under 5 ares , sometimes much smaller, all weed eradicated, 3 foot average depth, stuffed to the gunwales with carp that have no option other than eat whats thrown in. Drayton reservoir at 30 acres has over 6000 stocked fish on top of its original inhabitants, go on you tube and watch carp headbangers Erics carp championships at Drayton, one bloke caught 118 pound in 15 minutes, it used to be a cracking Tench venue, and its not even the most prolific around here, Alders farm is far easier, go watch and come back and tell me i am wrong.

I think our experiences must be different Wanderer. I have not found many as you described, maybe one or two. One coomie has a snake lake that's a bit as you describe used for matches, stuffed with carp of one size but it has about 5 other lakes of varying species. I did google the two waters you mentioned and they looked fairly pleasant to fish; from an aesthetic point of view and if they are selling tickets then they must suit plenty of anglers although 6000 stocked fish is excessive and fish dying in keep nets should not be allowed. I think there maybe room for some sort of legislation in this..I agree catching fish like that (118 pound in 15 minutes) is not my cup of tea but I understand why some would enjoy it. You had some of this and moved on, fair enough but something must have made you want to fish them in the first place! Maybe those fishing them today are just the same as you were once.
I understand you would rather have a proper tench lake, so would I and its a shame that some of these good waters get ruined for the sake of commercialism but there are others, one commie I know has a tench and bream only lake and the fish are all big. Still not my ideal, something artificial about it but its there if you want it and I have enjoyed fishing it myself.
However, I would still say these kind of over stocked lakes are the exceptions to the rule though, there are some very good commies about. I fished many over a 5 year period in the SE.
They were as diverse as the anglers who fished them and is that not the way it should be

 

[wanderer]

It is what you regard as a commy Mark, i did my original carp fishing as a kid, caught my first from a park lake where the big black shapes used to suck bread thrown in for the ducks used get sucked in by big black fish that used to hang around the island. Graduated on to the wildies that used to inhabit the power station stretches of the Nene, and then Billing Aquadrome, the river and the lakes, my main target was the big tench, but we kept getting busted up, we stepped up the gear and gradually became more proficient at landing these impossiblle fish. Ditchford lakes at Wellingboro was a top Tench venue and home to me as was the Ecton complex, weedy pits with big Tench and a few cap, we caught both on stepped up tackle to combat the Canadian. Then came the commys, Castle Ashby, an old Tench mecca got franchised and stuffed with them, a syndicate was opened on the private Estate for specimen carp of which i still hold a ticket. Drayton used to be a water owned by my company, but franchised from British waterways, cracking Bream and Tench, reclaimed British waterways canals and hammered full of carp. The only commy fishing that i have done came courtesy of my old mates, who were match anglers, i used to fish with them Fridays at Cannons Ashby, a club lake massively overstocked and easy, i have fished Drayton many times and Alders and quite a few others, but seriously mate, its ruddy boring, i can handle blanks where there is a challenge, but chuck anything in and your rods bouncing with fish of a similar size aint my cup of tea.

 

[steve2]

I agree with much of what as been said with regards to commercials, I gave up match fishing on these, it got boring. The stocked specimen lakes are no different.
We have to face facts, fishing as changed forever. Those of us that prefer the natural fishing venues are a dying breed, even on my club lakes carp anglers talk about wanting “nuisance” fish removed.
A fishery based on non carp would soon have to be stocked with more and more carp.
Money talks, profits have be maintained, unfortunately for us that means even more carp in ponds, lakes and rivers.

 

[no-one in particular]

The last two posts, have to see the point. Its sounds all a bit of a post fallout nightmare landscape out there. And I would get bored very quickly with waters like that for sure. I have come across one or two, just a hole in the ground basically with some carp stuffed in them.
Still, I must be a bit lucky with some fair commercial waters around me, they are not syndicates, never belonged to one or a club come to that. You have to search out your fishing that you want
I have river tench as well, not easy to find and one river has gone off a lot but still lovely fish, a hard fighting 6lb river tench is something a bit special.. I nice park lake near me too with carp but some nice tench and bream, roach etc as well. Some fair marsh waters near me, remote, bleak and hard but totally natural.
I think its a case of just knowing what you like and go and look for it. Its still there somewhere.

 

[thecrow]

we will have to agree to disagree lads, but next time you lift out your keepnets and the poor crushed fish at the bottom float away for the seagulls, think of what i have said and remember the specialist Bream and Tench boys that have lost their venues so you could crush half a dozen carp to death. Perfect material for the anti angling brigade and in some respects , i agree with them, no values as to animal welfare, battery chickens subsurface.

---------- Post added at 01:02 ---------- Previous post was at 00:04 ----------


I wasnt going to qoute you our sensitive flying friend with the impressive CV for fear of offending you, fox hunting was within the law some years ago, i suggest some aspects of angling are pushing the boundaries a bit, dont be so comfortable, abuse is on some peoples radar, and even as a lifelong angler mine.

Oh dear what a terribly sad person you must be if you have to constantly put others down to maintain what you see as others views of yourself. Face it others fish differently to you others fish differently to me there is no right or wrong way only whatever way an angler chooses on any particular day. Your constant put downs of these anglers are at the least boring but can also be viewed as insulting.

I don't use a keepnet and haven't for many years unless catching baits and on this point I agree with you in that for an angler not fishing in a match there is no need for one to be used, match organisers though have made advances in this for matches in size and amount of fish allowed to be contained in one.

When you tell me " dont be so comfortable, abuse is on some peoples radar, and even as a lifelong angler mine" is that a threat that you are prepared to take action on anglers that fish in a different way to yourself?

If you are so caring for animal welfare perhaps you should stop having double standards in that you are happy to stick a hook into a fish and drag it from its natural habitat in order to satisfy whatever you get from angling while complaining about the type of fishery others choose to fish and the way they fish.

Why you think an angler should have a C.V. I have no idea, I have caught some good fish along the way most I have kept to myself, I don't claim or feel the need to publicise what I have caught. during this time I have had the pleasure to meet and fish with some very good anglers, some known others not, those that are not have chosen to be that way, all have caught fish that any angler would have been pleased with some of which I had the privledge to witness being captured, some are ones that you have mentioned on here, its surprising who knows who within angling and knowing what their thoughts on others are, one thing common to all of them apart from being good people has been a willingness to accept that angling is a very varied pass time with lots of different branches to it.

As for me being sensitive, if only you knew how far wide of the mark you are with that comment that its verging on the ridiculous, I just find your constant put downs of other anglers in very poor taste.

---------- Post added at 10:11 ---------- Previous post was at 10:05 ----------

home to me as was the Ecton complex

Strange that this water being the sort that you liked to fish had a massive fish kill, so large in fact that the club eventually gave it up.

---------- Post added at 10:13 ---------- Previous post was at 10:11 ----------

my main target was the big tench, but we kept getting busted up, we stepped up the gear and gradually became more proficient at landing these impossiblle fish

Wasn't this the reason that ledgering was at one time banned in Sywell because of the damage being done to fish being dragged through the heavy weed.

 

[steve2]

When fish welfare is mentioned with regards to stocking levels, tackle, etc. we all have to admit none of us go fishing for the welfare of the fish we go because we enjoy fishing.
You can slap on as much fish care products onto the fish as you like after you have caught it, but all you are doing is repairing the damage you caused by catching it.
The care given is not for the fishes benefit it to make us feel better.