Anti Angling

[thecrow]

And that's why Alan Edwards and the Anglers Cooperative Association were so indispensable. And then they got dispensed. They did more than the EA ever have done and with only voluntary funding.

I was an ACA member as was the specimen group I was secretary of.

 

[peter crabtree]

Guy's

What would any of you think generally of a big rise in the fishing licence, if we could get better support, and most of the extra money went to support angling and its future?
To protect our future it's not the old farts like me, but the young who should have easy access to the hobby. Maybe schools could help and local angling clubs having a visit to schools, to see if any kids would like a days fishing in the school holidays. I know all the red tape, but apart from carp puddle fishing, our sport seems in decline.

Kids love being outside, camping and eating out. I give a fair amount of my old tackle to my local club in a thought it might help. But I don't think it always goes to the kids.:
****y.

As there seems to be little or no threat to angling by antis in the UK why would a big rise in the licence fees be needed? The young do have easy access to the hobby, if they want to fish nobody is stopping them. Local angling clubs do visit schools and organise days where kids can try fishing, often with the support of pro-angling organisations...
Lots of sports are in decline but nobody is stopping anyone who wants to take one up.

 

[Philip]

Its not kids they should be targeting...they get bored, have other things to do and have no cash to spend. Its the 40 somethings with some of money in thier pockets who are getting a bit old for their usual pastimes like football, rugby and so on and are looking for a new hobby to fill the gap. Given reasonable health you have a potential new angler for 30 plus years.

Anglings problem is always the same, we are too disjointed. We should be a powerful group but we are apathetic and will never all pull in the same direction. There have ben plenty of well meaning people who have come in and tried to do thier best but human nature means everyone gets shot down eventually. I would like to do something for angling but you already know whatever you do someone will complain and undermine you so i can see why so many people now just dont care until something impacts them directly.

 

[binka]

As a general observation and whether right or wrong, I'm of the view that the anti-angling fraternity were at their height during the eighties when the numbers of angers were at their height too and I rarely encounter any anti-angling views these days.

That's certainly not to say they aren't out there but I wonder if there's some correlation in the highs and lows of the respective numbers?

 

[Alan Tyler]

I am intrigued Alan, what does it say?

The Beggars appear to have moved it; it was a specific intention not to encourage angling and to hope it withered and died. It now appears to have been submerged into general anti-fieldsport mood music; but I only had a quick Google so there may be more.


A great shame; I always found angling a fine portal into ecology.

 

[Tee-Cee]

From speaking to people who now about such matters, I understand that some NT properties are closed to fishing, not because they are anti angling, but because the original owner of the property had some form of caveat inserted in the agreement when the property was handed over to the Trust. I know of two Trust properties where I have sought permission to fish them, only to be given this as the reason for refusal, and not because they are anti in any way.

I am a member of the NT for the same reason as the OP (to save money) but regardless of that I think they do a good job in preserving and saving properties, and as such many are well worth a visit. That they have possibly become 'corporate monsters.' may well be true, but as far as I'm concerned I'm able to enjoy some beautiful properties, gardens and yes, walks around/along waters that I cannot fish.

Very close to me I have Cliveden the original home of the Astor family which is spread over countless acres and contains a lovely stretch of the Thames. This is, or was, fishable via joining a club.............Others close by contain lovely lakes, but because the family still live on the property fishing is not allowed.
My wife and I travel all over the country and the first thing we check out are NT properties in the area and this because we enjoy what they have to offer and a pretty good lunch or afternoon tea!! In addition, I love to chat to the staff about the history of these places and from this I learn much.

No, whatever you think about the NT they do have much to offer, although not necessarily for everyone.................

Horses for courses, I suggest..................................

 

[no-one in particular]

As a general observation and whether right or wrong, I'm of the view that the anti-angling fraternity were at their height during the eighties when the numbers of angers were at their height too and I rarely encounter any anti-angling views these days.

That's certainly not to say they aren't out there but I wonder if there's some correlation in the highs and lows of the respective numbers?

I think it was my brother told me a story about an angler who drove through that Greenham Common thing in the 80's and got attacked by anti anglers. Similar stories went the rounds back then but you don't hear of it these days. The anti's have got the badgers for the moment, moved on from fox hunting I guess but angling will get its turn one day; these people have to have a mission in life. I know one badger enthusiast, a mate and a nice bloke; he travels all round the country protesting; he loves the the hide and seek games with the police, tells some rum stories thereof, he just sort of pulls a face when I mention angling but I bet when the badger thing is done with he and his mates could turn to angling, they will get bored and look for a new mission.

Regarding the NT, the one I fished was I am pretty sure was a policy of their own, I was a long way from their attraction and a few picnickers would come down by the river, that's all, probably enjoyed seeing an angler; no harm to anyone at all. My experience of the British mentality is they love to ban things, the default position is "no you cant do that here" whatever it may be. Punishment and fines being the meat and veg of society. It always amuses me how often our politicians talk about freedoms and then make sure we are not free to do anything. there must be thousands of laws taking our freedoms away, ever seen a free fishing sign, cant say I have ever seen one even when it is free!, a million telling me I cannot fish and what hell to pay if I do! No wonder fishing is losing popularity; it never gives off a good vibe.
Sorry, went off course but it is an anti fishing world we live in one way or another.

---------- Post added at 07:44 ---------- Previous post was at 05:47 ----------

Its not kids they should be targeting...they get bored, have other things to do and have no cash to spend. Its the 40 somethings with some of money in thier pockets who are getting a bit old for their usual pastimes like football, rugby and so on and are looking for a new hobby to fill the gap. Given reasonable health you have a potential new angler for 30 plus years.

.

Here's a thought-A couple of friends and me are thinking about having a go at green bowling. I quickly found out we can go along to the local green, no traveling, get an hour’s free tuition, lent some bowls and pay about £3. If we don't like it we have had a laugh and lost £3. If we accidently break the rules, we will probably get told off, no special police watching. All we need are some flat shoes and a white top; we all have that, no problem.
Now if I decided to have a go at fishing, first I have to apply and pay for a license £30. Then I have to find somewhere to fish, for many could be paying £100 to join a club because that's all that's around. Could involve travel costs as well. then fork out for all the gear I need to get started. Then if I accidently break the rules and the special police catch me (a special police for anglers, just love that one), could face punitive fines and all sorts of recriminations, might even make the name and shame list.
It’s just not an amenable hobby. To be honest I am thinking of packing it in for my old age and finding easier, more amenable, available, less fraught and cheaper things to do with my time. There's plenty of great stuff to do, fishing doesn't compete. I am already getting my countryside fix from walking and photography, a bit of sketching. I don't need a licence, do it anywhere almost, no rules as such and everyone loves me!!
I am just wising up and wondering what do I get for all that time, expense and effort; is it really worth it and I am 40+..

I am just trying to point out; angling needs a lot of work done to make it popular again. Angling has digressed in so many ways, often under the guise of progress and participant numbers have digressed pro rata.

 

[john step]

As a general observation and whether right or wrong, I'm of the view that the anti-angling fraternity were at their height during the eighties when the numbers of angers were at their height too and I rarely encounter any anti-angling views these days.

That's certainly not to say they aren't out there but I wonder if there's some correlation in the highs and lows of the respective numbers?

I wonder if that correlation is more to do with anglers being less visible nowadays. I know the rivers and canals are still fished but I think that the majority of angling is done on commies and club waters away from the public eye?

 

[thecrow]

The Beggars appear to have moved it; it was a specific intention not to encourage angling and to hope it withered and died. It now appears to have been submerged into general anti-fieldsport mood music; but I only had a quick Google so there may be more.


A great shame; I always found angling a fine portal into ecology.

Only goes to show how narrow and blinkered their view of "green" is.

---------- Post added at 20:37 ---------- Previous post was at 20:34 ----------

As a general observation and whether right or wrong, I'm of the view that the anti-angling fraternity were at their height during the eighties when the numbers of angers were at their height too and I rarely encounter any anti-angling views these days.

Having failed with us they have probably moved on to object and interfere to/with some other poor devils enjoyment, or they joined the otter trust to get at us through the back door

 

[Philip]

Here's a thought-A couple of friends and me are thinking about having a go at green bowling. I quickly found out we can go along to the local green, no traveling, get an hour’s free tuition, lent some bowls and pay about £3. If we don't like it we have had a laugh and lost £3. If we accidently break the rules, we will probably get told off, no special police watching. All we need are some flat shoes and a white top; we all have that, no problem.
Now if I decided to have a go at fishing, first I have to apply and pay for a license £30. Then I have to find somewhere to fish, for many could be paying £100 to join a club because that's all that's around. Could involve travel costs as well. then fork out for all the gear I need to get started. Then if I accidently break the rules and the special police catch me (a special police for anglers, just love that one), could face punitive fines and all sorts of recriminations, might even make the name and shame list.
It’s just not an amenable hobby. To be honest I am thinking of packing it in for my old age and finding easier, more amenable, available, less fraught and cheaper things to do with my time. There's plenty of great stuff to do, fishing doesn't compete. I am already getting my countryside fix from walking and photography, a bit of sketching. I don't need a licence, do it anywhere almost, no rules as such and everyone loves me!!
I am just wising up and wondering what do I get for all that time, expense and effort; is it really worth it and I am 40+..

I am just trying to point out; angling needs a lot of work done to make it popular again. Angling has digressed in so many ways, often under the guise of progress and participant numbers have digressed pro rata.

Unfortunately I have to agree with you. Going fishing has become complicated and expensive. I bet non anglers think of it like Huckleberry fin, you just need a bamboo pole a bit of line, a hook and a worm. How wrong can they be !

Nowadays I bet if I tied a bit of line to my toe while I had a nap someone would report me under some bylaw for set lining.

 

[108831]

How many of us support anti angling organisations but not the Angling Trust. By anti angling I mean the RSPB, RSPCA, National Trust, local nature groups etc.
Should we support and give money to them while not supporting the AT?
What are your feelings and why do we do it?
I am not a member of the AT but am a member of the National Trust. The only reason I joined the National Trust was to save money on visits.

I support none,in my view they're all anti angling in one way or another,even the AT,who just cannot achieve enough to protect angling.

 

[no-one in particular]

Unfortunately I have to agree with you. Going fishing has become complicated and expensive. I bet non anglers think of it like Huckleberry fin, you just need a bamboo pole a bit of line, a hook and a worm. How wrong can they be !

Nowadays I bet if I tied a bit of line to my toe while I had a nap someone would report me under some bylaw for set lining.

If it was down to me I would have both your feet chopped off and flogged for good measure.

grin

 

[Aussie Bob]

"Here's a thought-A couple of friends and me are thinking about having a go at green bowling. I quickly found out we can go along to the local green, no traveling, get an hour’s free tuition, lent some bowls and pay about £3. If we don't like it we have had a laugh and lost £3. If we accidently break the rules, we will probably get told off, no special police watching. All we need are some flat shoes and a white top; we all have that, no problem"

But if you suddenly do decide that you like bowls ...then you will want your own bowls , proper shoes , measure , spray chalk , uniform , waterproofs and a bag to put all that lot in then your annual subscriptions , tournament entry fees etc etc ...and for petty rules and regulations bowls would have to top the list especially if you get a few jobsworths at your club who think your socks aren't long enough or your hat is tilted at the wrong angle....the rules of the game are complicated enough (flat green) i love bowls play it to quite high level and it is a great game for beginers as most people normally pick up the basics pretty quick....cant see why fishing can be made more simpler to attract new people...trouble is fishers are their own worst enemy if you need a barrowful of equipment every time you are out its hard to convince a newby that they dont need all that stuff and associated cost down the track....

As to the anti angling brigade the very hard core Animal Liberation types a lot actually ended up with criminal records and even did jail time so i think think a lot of that generation of protesters have faded out of sight. I dont think there was a lot of gain for them attacking fishing compared to the hunts and medical experiments on animals etc . PETA seems to have dropped off the radar as well they were all over the media a decade or so ago ...stupidity like protesters letting mink free into the wild also didn't do their cause any good....

 

[Jim Crosskey 2]

Here's a thought-A couple of friends and me are thinking about having a go at green bowling. I quickly found out we can go along to the local green, no traveling, get an hour’s free tuition, lent some bowls and pay about £3. If we don't like it we have had a laugh and lost £3. If we accidently break the rules, we will probably get told off, no special police watching. All we need are some flat shoes and a white top; we all have that, no problem.
Now if I decided to have a go at fishing, first I have to apply and pay for a license £30. Then I have to find somewhere to fish, for many could be paying £100 to join a club because that's all that's around. Could involve travel costs as well. then fork out for all the gear I need to get started. Then if I accidently break the rules and the special police catch me (a special police for anglers, just love that one), could face punitive fines and all sorts of recriminations, might even make the name and shame list.
It’s just not an amenable hobby. To be honest I am thinking of packing it in for my old age and finding easier, more amenable, available, less fraught and cheaper things to do with my time. There's plenty of great stuff to do, fishing doesn't compete. I am already getting my countryside fix from walking and photography, a bit of sketching. I don't need a licence, do it anywhere almost, no rules as such and everyone loves me!!
I am just wising up and wondering what do I get for all that time, expense and effort; is it really worth it and I am 40+..

I am just trying to point out; angling needs a lot of work done to make it popular again. Angling has digressed in so many ways, often under the guise of progress and participant numbers have digressed pro rata.

Sorry, going to take this to task. Throughout my fishing life I have taken a variety of friends to the bank with me, always ensuring that a one-day rod licence was purchased in advance (not sure what that is now, a fiver?) Generally though, as a matter of courtesy - if I was going to invite a non-angler to come and have a go, I'd sort out all the kit, bait and tickets - maybe in return for them driving or bringing the lunch? Anyway, my efforts have had varying degrees of success - in some cases, mates have come along for a day and gone home still completely clueless as to why I go... in other cases, I hear something like - "let me know when I can come again..." i.e. they're happy to come out for the day as long as the tackle, bait and a little expertise is offered along the way. However, at least one of the people i took many years back is now a "proper" angler, he's bought some kit, we now argue about things like bait choice and hook size and swim selection.... perhaps most importantly, like me, he's now getting his kids involved too, and taking them along and spending more of his day untangling lines and baiting hooks (just like me the first time i took him....) Sorry if this is a little bit off-subject, but if we want more people to go fishing, then it's up to us, not the EA, the AT or anyone else you care to name to get people to go. I think fishing is fantastic, i never stop going on about it to my mates, my family, my work colleagues - and I'd take anyone of them along to see what the fuss is about.

Back on the subject, the only one of those organisations i belong to is the NT. I love visiting the properties they own and i also love parking in their carparks when I'm at the seaside. I don't see why looking after angling should be part of their agenda (and indeed, i know there's a number of waters open on NT property). I'm not sure that the category of "anti-angling" can be levelled at those others either, it's more a case of "couldn't give a flying-whatsit" about angling. Not really sure why they should either?

 

[no-one in particular]

Firstly I was pointing out how much easier it is to get going in many other sports. Although I am sure Aussie is right having been and done it and if I took up green bowling as a full time hobby, it would become more costly and rule binding. However, as it stands a couple of mates and I want to try it out, it could not be easier or cheaper than say taking up angling for the first time. It’s about £3, down the road; I don’t have to buy a license, need any gear or join a club (the latter I realize might not be necessary). The same with if I wanted to play chess, just walk into my local club and play, take up football, cricket, go down the park and have a go; not anything to stop me or almost any other hobby.
My reply was in respect of Phillips post about attracting over 40's to angling to which I said angling does not compete with other hobbies for that age group or indeed other age groups to a degree..
I appreciate Jim that there are many people as yourself and club members who would help a first time angler who was your friend but you have to look at this in a general way, not as an individual - I want to take up a new hobby, what about fishing, where do I start, what do I have to do; I think it would look pretty daunting to most compared with other possible hobbies. And then there are the rules, not rules of the sport but rules of law which is a bit different. I would be a bit nervous of taking up fishing for the first time, cant do this or that, facing maximum fines etc. Most of all of the above I would probably glean from the internet and would not be encourage by some of what I read. Certainly, I think there is more to discourage than encourage in my opinion.
Angling is a difficult hobby, complicated and never straight forward as just getting hold of a rod and heading for the nearest bit of water but it is straight forward if I want to try green bowling for instance. Or, at least in my recent local search for possibilities and its the same for many other hobbies.
Most of us don't see it, we have grown up with it and into it, made changes, adapted, learned the rules and the laws involved thereof; try standing way back and look in, what do you see? I stand back and I see laws, rules, excessive punishment and fines, special angling police, not many places to fish, no fishing signs everywhere and its got worse over the years. I am not saying its hard to learn, obey and adapt but it must make potential first timers shudder a bit; its a hobby!! I rhink I would give it a miss if I was just looking for something to do in my retirement
Regarding the NT, fair comment, based on just one experience of mine, could have been a one off. I would not expect them to have helping anglers or angling as a policy, just that when they have lots of waters, and where it does no harm; does not get in the way; as was the case in my instance - why not allow it; just anti angling! I didnt know they allowed it in some places, I am sure the bloke said it was policy but maybe it was just for that particular place, but there was no obvious reason for it- it was a bit of river way out of the way.

 

[Jim Crosskey 2]

Mark, I take on board every point you've made, I certainly agree with everything you've said about how daunting it seems looking in. However, that being the case - is likely to make me all the more evangelical about spreading the word and keep trying to get new anglers on to the bank.

I do also wonder if the days of the "hobby" angler are numbered... maybe there are fewer anglers around now but they're spending more on bait and tackle? No hard and fast evidence for that, other than the occasional wander around somewhere like linear lakes where there must literally be hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of fishing tackle on the complex sometimes.

 

[no-one in particular]

Mark, I take on board every point you've made, I certainly agree with everything you've said about how daunting it seems looking in. However, that being the case - is likely to make me all the more evangelical about spreading the word and keep trying to get new anglers on to the bank.

I do also wonder if the days of the "hobby" angler are numbered... maybe there are fewer anglers around now but they're spending more on bait and tackle? No hard and fast evidence for that, other than the occasional wander around somewhere like linear lakes where there must literally be hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of fishing tackle on the complex sometimes.

I think you could be right Jim, but it sort of emphasizes what I said maybe. Back in the day the river Thames on a nice Sunday would be full of dads and family's fishing. We used to walk from Staines to Runnymede, a good half mile and the bank would be packed with hobbyist anglers. I doubt it is today but I haven’t been that way for some time. Same with my local rivers, never see a soul even on a nice sunny Sunday. There's a reservoir near me in a park, 20 years ago it was full of kids fishing, and it’s virtually empty these days.
The complexes like you mentioned are doing well, or some are and I imagine all the gear is better than the battered old stuff we used to use but does it make up for the numbers! Its not a casual easy hobbyist type of pastime anymore, I think your right. That's why people don't take it up much these days as a hobby because its not in the sense of easy come, easy do like other hobbys unless your dead keen in the first place. If you have a friend to help you through all the hoops as well but if your just looking at it from scratch, it must be a daunting.
I do tell non angling friends why I do it and why I enjoy it but equally they are aghast at some of the tales I tell them.

 

[peter crabtree]

The main problem for anglers around Staines is lack of access and parking near the Thames. Runneymede has 2 car parks, one is the National trust section (£7 per day) or the council administered Pleasure ground car park (£6 per day).
The fishing is free.
Despite these extortionate charges both are very popular with anglers of all ages and the fishing is excellent.
I dare say the problem is the same in many other urban areas around the country.

 

[no-one in particular]

The main problem for anglers around Staines is lack of access and parking near the Thames. Runneymede has 2 car parks, one is the National trust section (£7 per day) or the council administered Pleasure ground car park (£6 per day).
The fishing is free.
Despite these extortionate charges both are very popular with anglers of all ages and the fishing is excellent.
I dare say the problem is the same in many other urban areas around the country.

Glad to hear it Peter, the fishing that is not the car parking. we used to get the bus to Staines and walk, you know I think I would still do that, I still do-get the bus, take light gear, camping chair etc. I have been to Twickenham and Richmond more recently and don't see the anglers I used to there, Richmond would be full once, actually I cant rember seeing anyone and Walton on Thames, sometimes, walk from Weybridge up towards Walton, and to be honest hardly see an angler there either, often not one. Same with the bit of the Weybridge canal and the Birmingham canal a bit further up, cant say I see anyone fishing that either. Of course they do but it doesn't give me the impression of the rising popularity of the sport.
You know from Staines right through to Runnymede that used to be lined with anglers all along the stretch on a nice sunny Sunday, I know Runnymede is still popular, I often read the reports of those that do but is it like as many. fishings just to much of a hassle these days. Look at how many on the name and shame lists, ok they have broken the law but who wants all that hanging over a hobby, special police cant fish here-there, silly close seasons, club fees etc, it all adds up you know. Pain in the proverbial, I am sorry but thats how a lot see it, I don't blame them for not taking it up to be honest...Is it killing itself from within !? Are anglers anti angling! You need to step back and look in sometimes and weigh up what you see.

 

[peter crabtree]

There are still plenty of anglers on the lower and tidal Thames Mark but most of them fish at night for barbel and carp...

Have a look on Facebook in the Thames angling section and most photos are taken after dark.
Huge fish too...