Why do so few anglers fish our rivers?!

[Tee-Cee]

Molehill: I'm surprised you need to travel 70/100 miles from mid Wales for river fishing. Having said that I don't know the area too well and perhaps it is more suited to trout fishermen??

Driving though there area many years ago it seemed as though you had running water around every bend!!

 

[Jim Crosskey 2]

Interesting thread this. I have a lovely bit of the thames very close to me on the northern edge of Oxford. Since the weather has been so good, it's been like a swimming/ holiday complex along my local bit ("Medley" to any of you visiting match anglers, quite a famous stretch of river).... I went down there for a picnic with the wife and kids a couple of weekends ago (to which I insisted on taking a couple of rods and pint of maggots to keep the kids busy) and initially I was seething at the general mass of humanity that was shouting, splashing, playing radios, games of football, touch rugby, water volleyball, all sorts... If you've ever seen the "Passion for Angling" episode where Bob James fishes Frensham great pond, it was a bit like that! However, two things worth noticing; first off, the fish were biting just as enthusiastically as they would have been had the banks been empty - we had bleak, chub roach and perch every cast.... secondly, after my initial pique had passed at the lack of peace and quiet, I realised that whilst all these people were out on the river, they were just out there enjoying it. The gang of lads behind us who'd been swimming, drinking and generally having a good time all cleared up after themselves; a number of passers by just stopped for a chat, and of course my kids would always be delighted to show anyone going past anything that they'd caught. I did wonder if actually, having all those people up and down the bank - it might have actually been a bit safer for that?

All of that said, its a relatively easy thing for me to travel a bit further and find a lot more peace and quiet.

I think river fishing for me will always edge it a bit over lakes, but I realise I'm in a minority in thinking that. Commercials have made fishing into something very different. As a kid, learning how to fish - I NEVER EVER had the expectation of sitting in one place for an entire day! I would have to move, to roam, to be opportunistic. Those are traits I can't seem to shift from my fishing, the idea of staying in one place for entire day's fishing session is about as alien as they come (unless I'm only on a very short session to begin with). The angler's expectations must also be taken in to account here... commercials give you the very realistic expectation of catching A LOT of big fish, so much so that anything falling short of that leads to disappointment. Again, going back to my childhood fishing, I was just incredibly grateful to catch anything!! So a halfpound roach or perch, that was a real talking point for your day.... and a 2lb chub!! Catching that might have seen me packing up and going home because its just not going to get any better!!

All of that said, I do fish commercials on some occasions, and the thrill of being connected to something that pulls back so hard is a wonderful thing. But that said, I'd rather take the mystery that comes with a river, over the sure fire knowledge that I can expect to catch.

 

[bracket]

I have always been a River Man. Stillwater fishing is secondary to me. I still trudge up the river bank, to distant pegs, knowing I will fastidiously run a stick float though during the next few hours for moderate returns. Why am I still doing it? That's a question I ask myself on my walks back. The answer is simple: When you spent eight hours down Pit or in a Factory, five days a week, all you wanted was to be out doors in the fresh air, doing something not remotely connected with collar(work). River fishing filled that gap. It represents a way of life and ethos I have experienced all my life but, in the main, is now mostly disappearing. Only the diehards of around my generation are interested in rivers nowadays. All the good reasons for rivers not being used have already been covered in earlier posts, I have nothing new to add, other than to say it is sad. It is a fact that moving water has it's own unique fascination for some of us, me in particular. Now I've gone all melancholy, I will probably start crying in my Ale. Pete.

 

[Keith M]

Some want their fish handed to them on a plate, in nicely manicured swims, with on-site cafes and tackleshops, and with nicely built paths around their lakes, and with lots of company to talk to, and even stocks of tailor made fish which bite well in all weathers; like f1’s; and with foreign fish like different strains of catfish and golden orfe, and even some river fish like barbel to bend into.

Although I don’t think this is wrong; and I can see the draw for a lot of people; I much prefer to spend my fishing time on my own, or with a friend, in totally unspoilt countryside, where the only distractions I get are the sight and sounds of the wildlife or if I hear a friend playing a fish somewhere up or downriver, or a distant peel of church bells ringing, whether it’s on a stillwater or a river or a stream.

The rivers around me all have their own characteristics and all have a decent head of fish, it’s getting to know the rivers and streams and where the most productive areas are likely to be that makes all the diffence between a good or bad days sport. There are lots of Carp and barbel in the rivers around me if you bother to spend time to explore and some very large Roach, perch and Dace in my local rivers and streams too.

So you can keep your manicured swims with everything laid on because I much prefer being amongst the sights and sounds of the countryside well away from the throng.:fish2:

Keith

 

[Jeff Woodhouse]

the Wey canal bit was free but now taken over by a club,

Well, an Association for 6 miles or so of it. Cor and is it expensive. You can join a club for £10 for the season and for that you get 9 other fisheries. What a rip-off eh?

Only joking. Take a look at our website thamesvalleyaa.webs.com Loads of maps on there. Get in!

In fact the Wey Navigation was never "free", I'm told. It belongs to National Trust to whom we pay a licence fee and manage the fishing rights.

 

[Hugh Bailey]

Well, an Association for 6 miles or so of it. Cor and is it expensive. You can join a club for £10 for the season and for that you get 9 other fisheries. What a rip-off eh?

Only joking. Take a look at our website thamesvalleyaa.webs.com Loads of maps on there. Get in!

In fact the Wey Navigation was never "free", I'm told. It belongs to National Trust to whom we pay a licence fee and manage the fishing rights.

It was "free" in the 60's unless the old guy on his bike collared you! It wasn't NT then either - pretty sure they took over in the 80's.

Completely agree with an earlier poster that none of this is fished - we've cycled from Woking to Kingston a few times (Basingstoke, Wey Nav. , Wey, Thames) - have never seen more than 8 anglers in 17 miles - and 5 of them were on the "barbel" swim at Walton Bridge. There are loads of fish in the Thames now (and the Basingstoke) - good roach, bleak, perch, skimmers etc - I don't think anyone goes after them. There are shoals of bream (I know!) just up the road from me on the Basingstoke of maybe 80+ fish very visible - never seen anyone try to catch them.

 

[no-one in particular]

Well, an Association for 6 miles or so of it. Cor and is it expensive. You can join a club for £10 for the season and for that you get 9 other fisheries. What a rip-off eh?

Only joking. Take a look at our website thamesvalleyaa.webs.com Loads of maps on there. Get in!

In fact the Wey Navigation was never "free", I'm told. It belongs to National Trust to whom we pay a licence fee and manage the fishing rights.

It was maybe ten years ago I asked the lock keeper where it ends near the Thames if it was free and he said it was so I fished it a few times up-to the big bridge (caught nought) and wandered onto the Basingstoke canal bit a couple of times, no signs so fished that , lots of fish in there as Hugh pointed out. Above the bridge (is it the Wey river or canal) was all decked out with match pegs and club sign posted.
More the point with my post and thread apart from fishing I walk there whenever I visit Weybridge and never seen an angler on any of it. In about ten years I can only recall seeing one group of blokes with fishing rods walking along and only a couple of times one or two on the Thames and that's no exaggeration. Which is on a par with the rivers where I live so where are all the anglers?-commercials is just my guess.
I remember a few years ago you told me your club had taken it over (the bit from the bridge down to the Thames), I fished down by the boat yards once near the Thames but got turfed off and got an irate bargeman once as I was too near the lock on the Basinstoke bit, and I asked nicely in a pub if I could fish in thier pub garden, I think it was the Crown and told no and looked at me like I was a slug; so what with that and it was now club water I gave up fishing. I would join the club but never sure when I will be there, fewer occasions now, 4 times a year maybe and then its often family commitments. However, I have googled thamesvalleyaa.webs.com and tried to click it open but only get a blank page but I will take a fee from your club to fish it, make it look like there is some fish in there; at least one was fishing it before it was took over dig! -I am available for hire anyone interested. Is the Basingstoke bit where it ends and runs into the Wey your club water as well? I am still not sure what the set up is there.

Just an aside regarding Tomino's post, it is all very confusing, I have lived in this country most of my life and I still struggle to make head an tail of it; so I understand how he feels. And you have to get why commercials do so well, just give them a tenner and you fish all day and no hassle. With rivers no one is sure whats what, to whom-where- how much and for what you pay for - for your average casual angler its an easier option, they just want to have a days fishing, why is it so hard!

 

[108831]

Now I don't live in London,but what is the average day ticket price on commercial fisheries around the capital,so £100 per annum should be a bargain. Rivers do require a higher skill level and beginners will find it very difficult in comparison to commercials,where often you can catch a few decent fish fishing any method.

 

[no-one in particular]

Now I don't live in London,but what is the average day ticket price on commercial fisheries around the capital,so £100 per annum should be a bargain. Rivers do require a higher skill level and beginners will find it very difficult in comparison to commercials,where often you can catch a few decent fish fishing any method.

Or go along to the Thames and save a £100 as its free but why don't they do that? Why do they ignore miles of free fishing? It does baffle me that.

 

[Molehill]

Molehill: I'm surprised you need to travel 70/100 miles from mid Wales for river fishing. Having said that I don't know the area too well and perhaps it is more suited to trout fishermen??

Driving though there area many years ago it seemed as though you had running water around every bend!!

Plenty of running water around, but nearly all game fishing. I tend to fish my club waters on Severn either side of Shrewsbury, which is a long way off from me (Shrewsbury is 85 miles). Lakes I fish are similar distance, I not complaining, much, though I do miss being able to pop out for a couple of hours on a summer evening.
Saying that, I fully appreciate my fishing time.

 

[Mark Wintle]

Interesting thread this. I have a lovely bit of the thames very close to me on the northern edge of Oxford. Since the weather has been so good, it's been like a swimming/ holiday complex along my local bit ("Medley" to any of you visiting match anglers, quite a famous stretch of river).... I went down there for a picnic with the wife and kids a couple of weekends ago (to which I insisted on taking a couple of rods and pint of maggots to keep the kids busy) and initially I was seething at the general mass of humanity that was shouting, splashing, playing radios, games of football, touch rugby, water volleyball, all sorts... If you've ever seen the "Passion for Angling" episode where Bob James fishes Frensham great pond, it was a bit like that! However, two things worth noticing; first off, the fish were biting just as enthusiastically as they would have been had the banks been empty - we had bleak, chub roach and perch every cast.... secondly, after my initial pique had passed at the lack of peace and quiet, I realised that whilst all these people were out on the river, they were just out there enjoying it. The gang of lads behind us who'd been swimming, drinking and generally having a good time all cleared up after themselves; a number of passers by just stopped for a chat, and of course my kids would always be delighted to show anyone going past anything that they'd caught. I did wonder if actually, having all those people up and down the bank - it might have actually been a bit safer for that?

All of that said, its a relatively easy thing for me to travel a bit further and find a lot more peace and quiet.

I think river fishing for me will always edge it a bit over lakes, but I realise I'm in a minority in thinking that. Commercials have made fishing into something very different. As a kid, learning how to fish - I NEVER EVER had the expectation of sitting in one place for an entire day! I would have to move, to roam, to be opportunistic. Those are traits I can't seem to shift from my fishing, the idea of staying in one place for entire day's fishing session is about as alien as they come (unless I'm only on a very short session to begin with). The angler's expectations must also be taken in to account here... commercials give you the very realistic expectation of catching A LOT of big fish, so much so that anything falling short of that leads to disappointment. Again, going back to my childhood fishing, I was just incredibly grateful to catch anything!! So a halfpound roach or perch, that was a real talking point for your day.... and a 2lb chub!! Catching that might have seen me packing up and going home because its just not going to get any better!!

All of that said, I do fish commercials on some occasions, and the thrill of being connected to something that pulls back so hard is a wonderful thing. But that said, I'd rather take the mystery that comes with a river, over the sure fire knowledge that I can expect to catch.

Back in July 1999 I arranged a Barclays Bank AA club match on Medley. I've fished it all my life and knew it would be busy on a hot day but we had just 24 pegs to spread between Godstow lock and The Perch so 50 yard pegs. By 1999 many of our anglers preferred commercials but I wanted a change. despite the heat - it was 26 degrees - swimmers, boats and eight bikini clad German beauties behind my peg who occasionally asked politely if they could launch their canoe just above me, the fish fed well despite the disturbance and I probably had a bite every cast of the five hours on waggler-fished caster. I didn't win but 40 odd silver bream plus plenty of roach, perch, bleak and chublets and a bonus 5lb bream weighed 16lbs and enough for 3rd. But you should have heard the moans from those who'd have preferred fishing the Method on a commercial.

 

[jasonbean1]

Yes, medley, the channel, folly and donnington......arguably the best fishing the Thames has to offer. apart from club matches, summer and winter leagues you will barely see an angler on its whole length as it goes through oxford. those you do see are mainly lure fishing.

I perhaps pleasure fish the sections more than most and have a match at folly this evening. its very rare we struggle but urban fishing is not for the faint hearted! so I can see why anglers nowadays choose commercials.

 

[iain t]

Before commercials came along every freshwater angler was a river/stream angler. So i blame commercials for the decline. The main attractions to these is your guaranteed to catch and you know what species you will have in your net. You can park mostly near your peg and that the pegs may have a flat platform for your gear.
OK, i can see the attractions to some.
That's not for me. I like the exploring nooks, and crannies, walking through the woods and grass to find a nice area to fish from. It's all natural, the fish are not confined. Every day the river is in a different state. Low/high, fast or slow, deep or shallow. Just sitting on the bank with nature all around me. Rivers is where my heart is and i do genuinely miss it in the closed season. There's nothing better than watching your float trotting with the current.
I only join clubs that have river sections. Am not interested in their stillwaters but i am forced to use them in the closed times.
I can go weeks on the river without seeing another angler, only the odd hiker now and then.
Are some anglers scared of river fishing? I've gone for weeks without a tug on the line but i still enjoyed the days by watching the birds and the water going by.

 

[Keith M]

Are some anglers scared of river fishing? I've gone for weeks without a tug on the line but i still enjoyed the days by watching the birds and the water going by

Even I wouldn’t go that far Ian I’m certainly glad I don’t fish your river Ian

I agree with your point though. People these days just want to catch anything that bends their rod, even if it’s wall to wall f1’s or pasties or snotties, and the thought of having to put in a little work to find their fish in a more natural environment is unthinkable :wh

But I can see their side of the story if they only get a few short hours each week on the bank and they are very gregarious.

Keith

 

[sagalout]

Before commercials came along every freshwater angler was a river/stream angler.

So what about those that fished lakes, canals, pits and farm ponds and probably many more types of still waters?

I like still water fishing, I don't go to commercials but I belong to a club with still waters that are well stocked and fish very well. I can go to the club waters on a bank holiday and see no one, so on the still waters I fish I have the solitude and the lack of facilities but I can park and access the waters without major problems.

I have club membership for five miles of the Wye but access is difficult, not just the walks involved to get to a swim but the height and steepness of the banks, and the bl00dy thing is either in flood or dry.

I started fishing on the Thames where I was born, but moved at the age of seven and started still water fishing (canals, lakes, ponds) so I never really learnt to fish the river and now when I go fishing I want to catch fish and relax. Club still waters suit my requirements.

 

[no-one in particular]

I suppose the next question is should we care, it seems everyone is happy, some have their commercials for what they give, some have there rivers ditto, clubs provide rivers and lakes for those that want a bit of exclusivity, some syndicates and free river around, you have to look harder in some places to find what you want but its probably there if you look hard enough. I mean there's a wide choice to suit every angler and pocket, if rivers have lost their popularity along the way, does it matter?
Personally I might just like river fishing over a lake but very little in it and I am as happy on a commercial as I am fishing off a jetty in the sea or some bit of river somewhere; they all offer me something different. Expectations differ from one type to another and how I go about it and think but I enjoy all of it.

 

[sagalout]

Following Markg's comment, why do so many anglers care how, what for, and where other anglers fish?

 

[nottskev]

I suppose the next question is should we care, it seems everyone is happy, some have their commercials for what they give, some have there rivers ditto, clubs provide rivers and lakes for those that want a bit of exclusivity, some syndicates and free river around, you have to look harder in some places to find what you want but its probably there if you look hard enough. I mean there's a wide choice to suit every angler and pocket, if rivers have lost their popularity along the way, does it matter?

People usually ask "Does it matter?" as a way of saying it doesn't, but if it's a real question, I think there are reasons to say it does. Rivers aren't just another option in a market offering consumer choice. They're qualitatively different to, say, commercials: unique environments, far more than just fishing venues, which can't be created with a digger and a bit of investment. Anglers, in my experience, are better informed than most about the health and changing fortunes of their local rivers, and anglers and the associations they belong to and fund, are amongst the very few who are likely to challenge or try to hold to account those who pollute or otherwise damage them. Some river anglers - not all, of course, have a commitment to their rivers that goes a bit deeper than dropping in for a breakfast and a bag of carp (other fish are available). So, I'm inclined to think that it would matter if fewer and fewer anglers took interest in rivers, and I'm thankful that there are plenty of anglers in this area still interested. Who will lobby for their protection, if not anglers?

I was out watching an open match on a local stretch yesterday evening, and as well as being informative, and a pleasure to watch the high-level skills being used, it was heartening that some anglers preferred to fish hard for 3 hours for weights of roach and dace that could be matched with a couple of fish in 10 minutes from any of the many local match pools.

 

[Tee-Cee]

I've tried in vain to discover the numbers of anglers in England (excluding sea and game for now) and the only figure I can find is in the region of 2,9 million and that from a NRA survey dated 1995. Admittedly, I didn't look too hard as I'm almost sure someone on here will have figures that are more accurate?

I only ask having read some of the above post which state, like mine, that rarely do they see anglers on the bank in significant numbers., regardless of time of year (my assumption).

If this be the case, then of the 2,9m souls, how many might be out (say) in high summer when the new season begins? Even of you halved that figure I would find it hard to believe that number might be found on the banks - am I right or wrong?

My other question; Is angling on he increase, steady or in decline (say) based on the last 10 years or so?

Just interested..........................

 

[no-one in particular]

People usually ask "Does it matter?" as a way of saying it doesn't, but if it's a real question, I think there are reasons to say it does. Rivers aren't just another option in a market offering consumer choice. They're qualitatively different to, say, commercials: unique environments, far more than just fishing venues, which can't be created with a digger and a bit of investment. Anglers, in my experience, are better informed than most about the health and changing fortunes of their local rivers, and anglers and the associations they belong to and fund, are amongst the very few who are likely to challenge or try to hold to account those who pollute or otherwise damage them. Some river anglers - not all, of course, have a commitment to their rivers that goes a bit deeper than dropping in for a breakfast and a bag of carp (other fish are available). So, I'm inclined to think that it would matter if fewer and fewer anglers took interest in rivers, and I'm thankful that there are plenty of anglers in this area still interested. Who will lobby for their protection, if not anglers?

I was out watching an open match on a local stretch yesterday evening, and as well as being informative, and a pleasure to watch the high-level skills being used, it was heartening that some anglers preferred to fish hard for 3 hours for weights of roach and dace that could be matched with a couple of fish in 10 minutes from any of the many local match pools.

I agree with you but anglers are not going to change their fishing habits and fish rivers on the basis they should be there to look after them and monitor pollution. Its a good point and something to care about and be nice if they did but if you want them to switch from commercials or lakes then that wouldn't sell it on its own. Foremost on an anglers mind is where he wants to catch fish and where and how he likes to catch them.