Who owns a river?

[108831]

So by asking the permission and it being granted by the land owner you believe I shouldnt be allowed to fish a river that neither you or I or the owner created or maintains.
Who will you owe for your life and body? Was they owed to you?
Only using your own reasoning..

I think your user name is apt,I cannot have any sympathy for your views at all,I buy my house,so that myself and my family can live in it,not you,or anyone else,if a landowner has fish if rights on his deeds,they are his,not yours,whether you or me like it or not by law we have to have a rod licence to fish.personally you are either a troll,a fool,or someone who lives in a caravan,I think the former so am blocking your
posts....

 

[Weirdoh]

I think your user name is apt,I cannot have any sympathy for your views at all,I buy my house,so that myself and my family can live in it,not you,or anyone else,if a landowner has fish if rights on his deeds,they are his,not yours,whether you or me like it or not by law we have to have a rod licence to fish.personally you are either a troll,a fool,or someone who lives in a caravan,I think the former so am blocking your
posts....

Nay bother pal, Sorry that your under your own false pretense of knowing me using stereo typical name dropping, which simply confirms your cognitive dissonance is mighty high, albeit self limiting. Either that or your insecure regarding your argument, anyway no need to be all negative and sad, you gave me a good laugh and cheers bro. Thank you for being whitty without trying and can I also just say if you honestly believe you need a government permit to fish then your most likely a bigger mug than the one I am holding right now containing white zingy zinfandel! Chin chin.

 

[Weirdoh]

Has the Crow risen from the Dead?

Is he a copper?

 

[no-one in particular]

But Mark,the issues of our waterways is that nobody maintains free water and freeloading thieves who want something for nothing are taking advantage of a club's efforts,however this links to the shooting ban thread inasmuch as if no clubs owned our rural waters in particular,who the hell would bailiff/police riverbanks to stop angling taking place,certainly not police officers,not farm workers as in the main it's only the farm owner themselves that can be bothered...

Not all club waters get maintained. Its not a given but most probably do, its not as if I know them all however, a few round me dont get any attention from thier clubs. If anything happens its usually from grant money not club money.

Just out of interest, as most rivers have a public right of way path alongside them, who is responsible for maintaining that?

 

[no-one in particular]

Is he a copper?

More like gold plated iron
He was a bit of a rogue I suppose, he was anti-establishment or "anti-established" I guess like you, just a guess, I don't think he played devil's advocate, he believed in what he said. He often made sense in his arguments if you took the time to think about them, whether he was agreed with was another matter but he could be humourous and charming as well when he wanted to be. He was a regular on here, many posts but he passed away not long ago and missed by many. Just filling you in as your a new member.

 

[108831]

Not all club waters get maintained. Its not a given but most probably do, its not as if I know them all however, a few round me dont get any attention from thier clubs. If anything happens its usually from grant money not club money.

Just out of interest, as most rivers have a public right of way path alongside them, who is responsible for maintaining that?

Not all club waters are maintained as we'd like,or as much as clubs would either,as many land owners do not allow backside flora and fauna to be disturbed,rightly in many cases because we humans tend to get chain saw crazy and cut everything g down,but just by a club fishing occasionally keeps swims clear-ish,is this for someone who doesn't pay for the right to fish to steal,I think the OP operates on the theory of 'all property is theft'.

 

[mikench]

Nay bother pal, Sorry that your under your own false pretense of knowing me using stereo typical name dropping, which simply confirms your cognitive dissonance is mighty high, albeit self limiting. Either that or your insecure regarding your argument, anyway no need to be all negative and sad, you gave me a good laugh and cheers bro. Thank you for being whitty without trying and can I also just say if you honestly believe you need a government permit to fish then your most likely a bigger mug than the one I am holding right now containing white zingy zinfandel! Chin chin.

I wouldn't normally respond to any more of the posts in this thread and am only doing so now because it's very dull here and , as is my fate, I am waiting for my wife to get ready and to issue the order to go.

If you are a genuine law abiding angler seeking to obtain guidance and information on all aspects of the sport, then you are most welcome. Indeed within the Baitbox there are many interesting threads which have nothing whatsoever to do with Angling where members discuss films, music, food, places to visit and a myriad of other topics. They can also seek advice from members who are able and willing to give it on technical matters such as the law!
I digress! Your username is unusual, a little perjorative for some and one which creates a feeling of unease! Couple that with your use of language and the topics raised,and that unease begins to mount until one suspects you are disingenuous.

I remain mildly intrigued, not that it matters one jot, as to your place of origin. Take the post I have quoted, you start with a Scots expression oft stated by Jazzer in the Archers( a radio show I would commend to you) then adopt the vernacular of parts of the US and then refer to drinking a White Zinfandel from a mug. Zinfandel is a black grape originally from Croatia( are you familiar with that part of the world) and produces a red wine or a rosé but not a white! Mugs are for tea and hot chocolate and not wine.

I am concerned that many of your comments suggest, to me at any rate, that you do not possess a fishing licence! That is breaking the law and cannot be condoned particularly if you are British.

If you are not which I suspect then your command of English is excellent but revealing. You try too hard to produce prose introducing the odd expression here and there which are incongruous and which , to me, indicate that you are foreign! I pride myself on my french language skills but know I am not and never will be fluent! People I write or speak to know instantly that I am not french and it will forever be thus.

May I suggest then that you take on board my comments and,if you are genuine, enjoy the camaraderie of the FM members. If you are not and are a troll then as the Italians would say " Basta Vada via"

Aah I have now received my marching orders from er indoors and doffing my cap I must bid you adieu!

 

[Weirdoh]

Not all club waters get maintained. Its not a given but most probably do, its not as if I know them all however, a few round me dont get any attention from thier clubs. If anything happens its usually from grant money not club money.

Just out of interest, as most rivers have a public right of way path alongside them, who is responsible for maintaining that?

Not sure, good question ....probably paid for by the people who live close by (a guess) but alot of river paths are maintained by nature and trodden purely by the amount of people aiming for a particular movement accross or alongside some kind of river feature.
Hard pill to swallow it seems but 100% of All land is taken by conquest originally.

 

[Weirdoh]

I wouldn't normally respond to any more of the posts in this thread and am only doing so now because it's very dull here and , as is my fate, I am waiting for my wife to get ready and to issue the order to go.

If you are a genuine law abiding angler seeking to obtain guidance and information on all aspects of the sport, then you are most welcome. Indeed within the Baitbox there are many interesting threads which have nothing whatsoever to do with Angling where members discuss films, music, food, places to visit and a myriad of other topics. They can also seek advice from members who are able and willing to give it on technical matters such as the law!
I digress! Your username is unusual, a little perjorative for some and one which creates a feeling of unease! Couple that with your use of language and the topics raised,and that unease begins to mount until one suspects you are disingenuous.

I remain mildly intrigued, not that it matters one jot, as to your place of origin. Take the post I have quoted, you start with a Scots expression oft stated by Jazzer in the Archers( a radio show I would commend to you) then adopt the vernacular of parts of the US and then refer to drinking a White Zinfandel from a mug. Zinfandel is a black grape originally from Croatia( are you familiar with that part of the world) and produces a red wine or a rosé but not a white! Mugs are for tea and hot chocolate and not wine.

I am concerned that many of your comments suggest, to me at any rate, that you do not possess a fishing licence! That is breaking the law and cannot be condoned particularly if you are British.

If you are not which I suspect then your command of English is excellent but revealing. You try to hard to produce prose introducing the odd expression here and there which are incongruous and which , to me, indicate that you are foreign! I pride myself on my french language skills but know I am not and never will be fluent! People I write or speak to know instantly that I am not french and it will forever be thus.

May I suggest then that you take on board my comments and,if you are genuine, enjoy the camaraderie of the FM members. If you are not and are a troll then as the italiens would say " Basta Vada via"

Aah I have now received my marching orders from er indoors and doffing my cap I must bid you adieu!

Do you know what....you are bang on! I looked at the bottle and it was not a Zinfandel at all!! (I stand corrected and thanks for pointing that out too!) I dont really know my wines or beers or my tap water chloramines from chlorines....my taste buds are weird too...so your suspiciousness was vindicated.
Here is a couple of pointers for new posters with perhaps different views joining this forum:
If someone is going to A: put words in my mouth (which is quite frankly dangerous in certain situations) and B: judge me before getting to know me and with full support of the moderators then yes I can and will naturally get a little prickly ...yes. Problem I have observed already is people DO NOT read what you write (I originally stated it was hypothetical and made it very clear I NEVER fish on someones land without permission or go where I am NOT WANTED. Only ever been asked to reel in once and that situation I handled on my OWN quite well, no Police involved and dealt with swiftly.
I do however reserve the right to have a differing opinion on malevolent entities like government (which anyone with half a brain cell will come to thesame conclusion is pure force and immunizes theft on a grand scale) and I have no friends because I simply do not "fit in" to this bizaare world.
I am not a nasty person for nasty sake but consider someone has theability given to them to still engage in the topic discourse, continue to make judgements about me personally (mychoiceof username) or continue on a rant of judging my outlook while hiding behind the forum version of ignorance...to be fair people dont like me because I see through all the monotenous often repeated speil about who should be doing what and when and how... I can accept when I am wrong and can even enjoy a good laugh at my own expense anytime of the day....seems being able to be humbled about my own errors just isnt as acceptable as plain ignorance.
Anyway I wont bother posting here any longer if you genuinely believe I am a criminal, you might all be made to learn how sinful, full of error and why your country will be shortly plundered for the very last time and why its is what you actually paid for, but I will dust off my sandals off and move on to somewhere else.
Nice chatting to you though. Respect deserves respect.
Ps...my name was meant to mean weir (as in a river feature) and dough as in bread paste....thus being a play on words but my spelling isnt brilliant and ended up looking more weird come homer simpson error "doh" I confess my username mistake to you all also (see how easy that was!!) naughty man smacky botty.

Pss Markg sorry to hear about the loss of your friend and I would probably of liked and enjoyed having a conversation with him:
"Consider the ravens"
Cheerio.

 

[nottskev]

100% of All land is taken by conquest originally.

So true! I got my garden by defeating my neighbour in battle. But the people on the other side are building strength and the drumming's getting louder...

This is what they call a whirlwind debut, and if you hadn't posted, I wouldn't have believed there was a future in surreal angling stand-up.

Just getting off the all-property-is-theft theme, where do you fish and what kind of fishing do you like?

 

[flightliner]

If a guy fishing from canoe helps maintain his position by an anchor is he guilty of trespassing on the riparian owners part of the riverbed?

 

[108831]

Yes,I believe that is the case Mick.

 

[mikench]

Believe it or not Weirdho I was trying to be polite, positive and to try and help you! I invited you to leave if your were a troll ie an agent provocateur whose only desire is to antagonise the members of any Internet forum without contributing to it!

Listen and learn and you will become a valued member but to protest too much and leave tends to suggest I may be right and you wrong. Nobody will ever be welcome if they join an Angling forum and deliberately fails to obtain a licence. I deplore the politics in this country but I cannot think of a country which has better. I deplore many rules and regulations but have to abide by them. I also have to familiarise myself with the rules and regulations, taxes and quirks of France but c'est la vie!

There is as much German, Italian( Roman) Scandinavian, french and Celtic blood in me as any other. If you must leave may I suggest you read Viking Britain by Thomas Williams; an interesting read and one which demonstrates the significant and beneficial influences by " foreigners" on British language, literature, place names and folklore, its echoes in later history and its implications for the present.

 

[steve2]

Following on from 'Who owns the river' who in this country owns the water in that river or come to that the rain that falls from the sky?
I never realised until yesterday when visiting an RHS garden and talking to one of the gardeners that they have to have a licence to use the water in their irrigation reservoirs. This water all comes from rain water not rivers.
So does that mean even the landowner doesn’t own the water that flows through his land?

 

[mikench]

If you want to take water from a surface or groundwater source, you will normally need to hold an abstraction licence. In some cases you do not need a licence, such as: abstraction for any purpose of less than 20 cubic metres a day; no idea why and I doubt it is or can be enforced within a domestic context!

 

[108831]

All water,either in our waterways or reservoirs,ponds,lakes etc,are for want of a better term owned by the EA or river authorities,the former I believe,the only different scenario is the canals ,which I believe are owned by the BWB....

 

[rich66]

Following on from 'Who owns the river' who in this country owns the water in that river or come to that the rain that falls from the sky?
I never realised until yesterday when visiting an RHS garden and talking to one of the gardeners that they have to have a licence to use the water in their irrigation reservoirs. This water all comes from rain water not rivers.
So does that mean even the landowner doesn’t own the water that flows through his land?

I actually own land that water runs through, I’ve been told I own the land to the centre of the watercourse and am responsible for the up keep of the banks etc. But the waters not mine, as far as I’m aware it belongs in my case to Severn Trent water.

Before anyone gets too excited about fishing in it. It was a brook but for some strange reason I’ve been told it’s now classed as a river, probably to put my house insurance up!

 

[Weirdoh]

I said I wouldnt post again but I will take the bait... (add that to trolling etc...)

"Nobody will ever be welcome if they join an Angling forum and deliberately fails to obtain a licence."


I do not (including all my brothers and sisters) owe any man for use of what was always mine to use from the very begining, given to me by my father.

Thanks for the book recommendation! I am familiar with it, it borrows heavily from Dans migrations north and west of Palestine (just before thepen ultimate captivity).

Take care.
Tight lines.

 

[Weirdoh]

So true! .....

Just getting off the all-property-is-theft theme, where do you fish and what kind of fishing do you like?

"Love thy neighbor"

Erm....I fish all over the world. Based in the UK ENG (treasure Island) and enjoy fishing without unholy interference the most, trotting, ledgering, free-lining, I cook fish most fridays too.
I am just getting back into river fishing after a long spell of ill health, your river Trent is excellent for a number of species I must say, lots of free stretches holding large Chub, Barbel and old dark Carp .

 

[Weirdoh]

Funny how anything that is free, abundant and gives or maintaines life is somehow "coverted" by a group of men using force to prove it is theirs so they can aquire the whole world for themselves....
Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. Murder, theft and extortion is perfectly legal...as long as you carry your mark of allegiance on you at all times.

" Breaking News just in...The Apple trees that once bore fruit naturally by design are now demanding equal rights and royal assent has now been given to passing men of the moment to introduce a license for fair usage, they are now free to grow and look at but to use for eating (as defined as "fair" ) requires a permit ....some experts are saying it is only a matter of time that the "air" will demand equality and therfore the lung society is drawing up its plans to introduce air comodity strategy which it plans to roll out by 2020"...
Advertisement: Ooh aar me apple pies be better than theirs...ooh aars...making pies out of love for your tummy....

Only having a laugh.