The red stuff.

[iannate]

Is this stuff good for colouring maggots?

As they state for hook baits only, I would imagine that there's something in it which is now on the prohibited list for its effect on the environment.

I've never heard of anyone trying it; which would suggest no. It would be an expensive way of doing it even if it did work. Part of the problem is getting powder to stick to the maggots for the colour to take, if wet the maggots can end up escaping.

If you are asking about the new improved (environmentally friendly) version, then I think that it was the colouring which meant that it had to be re-formulated; that would also suggest a no.

Maggots are difficult to dye without them eating the colour in their food, although chrysodine did a reasonable job, it also found itself on the naughty list.

I've always sprinkled maggots with something in the hope that it enhances the bait, I have no evidence to support it, but I have confidence in doing it: tumeric, 5 spice, chilli powder, fennel, star anise, clove etc.. IMO the powders do make the texture of the maggots better and clean them in the process, maize flour seems to soften them. Freezing them I believe draws something into the maggots from the spices (no evidence), but can make them claggy when they thaw out, I prefer liquid for freezing, I cool them down before covering in liquids and then freeze - as stated above, they can crawl up anything!

I don't think that anything has been found as effective as feed dying them. There used to be a liquid available for red maggots, but the results weren't very good, and they need to have a good eye kept on them.

 

[rayner]

As they state for hook baits only, I would imagine that there's something in it which is now on the prohibited list for its effect on the environment.

An interesting thought.
I'm thinking now, is it worth the bother for a few fish.
A little more investigation I think.

 

[iannate]

They also advertise robin green, orange and gold, I can't find anything specific on the gold version.

I don't know how effective they are as I've never used them.

Your cupboard, I'm sure, will have plenty of things to try if you want to play :beer:

If you're into red, chilli powder can be bought in bulk cheaply, I've often though of getting beetroot powder, but never got round to it.

 

[rayner]

Difficult to find information regarding the dangers of Robin Red if indeed there are any.
I'm beginning to wonder is it worth the bother. At the moment it smacks of homework. I thought I'd finished with that in the 60s

 

[seth49]

Robin Red(R) for carp baits and ground bait (UK/EU) | Haith's UK

This might be of help, Haiths are primarily an animal food company, so there products will be safe.
As it says they’ve just changed the dye they use now.

 

[iannate]

Difficult to find information regarding the dangers of Robin Red if indeed there are any.

I can't argue with that; however; based on personal experience using the stuff, reading several articles on the suppliers web site and reading between the lines of those articles:

A few years ago, using the stuff would stain or colour anything it came into contact with, pretty much permanently. The current version does not, although I haven't tried the hook bait version.

Once regulations for the declaration of ingredients were introduced (taking several years to become enforced), there was a sudden need to re-formulate the one and only Robin Red. The recipe has always been a closely guarded secret, not even individual ingredients were revealed.

Nash have been fined for the use of unauthorised ingredients [pigments banned from use in the EU] in their baits - this was a newspaper article which I can't find now, so chose to ignore if you wish.

In the mid to late 90s, I worked for a company who received goods in 200 litre (45 gallon) drums that were supplied in various colours - very useful to see what was what; suddenly all the drums were supplied in the same few colours (mainly black and blue, but orange and red were not allowed) because of EU regulations on the use of certain pigments.

I might look into designing a blue pigment for use in baits and bird food, I shall call the said bait / feed enhancer Norwegian Blue ... for a beautiful plumage.

 

[rayner]

After looking around it's proving tricky to find much information regarding Robin Red.
If it's so secret they can keep what they have, its a bait colour for Gods sake. I've never been one to swallow companies guff. I thought someone on here could put a little light on it, hence the question.
When I need red there are other alternatives. Thanks everyone for your posts.

 

[sam vimes]

After looking around it's proving tricky to find much information regarding Robin Red. If it's so secret they can keep what they have, its a bait colour for Gods sake. I've never been one to swallow companies guff.

If all you want is a bait dye, bog standard red food dye will do just fine. However, it's wrong to suggest that Robin Red is just a bait colourant, it's more than that. The fact that Haiths are keen to protect the exact composition of their product should give at least some indication as to just how successful it's been and how many attempts to copy it there have been. People don't go out of their way to copy things that are useless.

I don't use Robin Red as an ingredient in anything I mix myself. I've very rarely used a bought bait that uses Robin Red as in ingredient. I wouldn't miss it if it didn't exist. However, I can't deny that it's been a very effective ingredient in some very successful baits, and groundbaits, down the years.

 

[spenbeck]

I seem to remember way back in the 80's the colouring E123 red was banned in the EU for being cancergenic.

 

[rayner]

If all you want is a bait dye, bog standard red food dye will do just fine. However, it's wrong to suggest that Robin Red is just a bait colourant, it's more than that. The fact that Haiths are keen to protect the exact composition of their product should give at least some indication as to just how successful it's been and how many attempts to copy it there have been. People don't go out of their way to copy things that are useless.

I don't use Robin Red as an ingredient in anything I mix myself. I've very rarely used a bought bait that uses Robin Red as in ingredient. I wouldn't miss it if it didn't exist. However, I can't deny that it's been a very effective ingredient in some very successful baits, and groundbaits, down the years.

I understand what you say.
The main thing that concerns me is do any flavours work. The only flavours I have purchased in the last twenty years have been pellet soaks and Lagunas SAC juice.
I like the pellet soak but am unsure if the colour that catches fish or the flavour. Laguna SAC does no harm to bites I'm not sure it has improved my catch rate or not.
On top of that is Red Robin safe for fish, some may say who cares but I do.

If more information was available on the product I may have a different view.
The conclusion I've come to is for me not to bother.

 

[sam vimes]

The main thing that concerns me is do any flavours work. The only flavours I have purchased in the last twenty years have been pellet soaks and Lagunas SAC juice.
I like the pellet soak but am unsure if the colour that catches fish or the flavour. Laguna SAC does no harm to bites I'm not sure it has improved my catch rate or not.

You simply can't be definitive about such things. A flavour, or colour, may appear to work one day and then not the next. A change of venue can appear to give totally different results. Sometimes, the best you can possibly say is that something isn't doing any harm. However, another bloke using the same stuff, on the same venues, might get a totally different impression of what's going on.

On top of that is Red Robin safe for fish, some may say who cares but I do. If more information was available on the product I may have a different view.

It's not unreasonable to question whether something is safe for fish. However, if you apply that criteria equally, to all baits, you may end up with fewer options than you might imagine. You really can't expect Haiths to provide every last detail on what makes up Robin Red. It would be commercial suicide to do so.

 

[rayner]

You simply can't be definitive about such things. A flavour, or colour, may appear to work one day and then not the next. A change of venue can appear to give totally different results. Sometimes, the best you can possibly say is that something isn't doing any harm. However, another bloke using the same stuff, on the same venues, might get a totally different impression of what's going on.


It's not unreasonable to question whether something is safe for fish. However, if you apply that criteria equally, to all baits, you may end up with fewer options than you might imagine. You really can't expect Haiths to provide every last detail on what makes up Robin Red. It would be commercial suicide to do so.

I didn't expect to find any secret ingredients, a little information as to why Haiths say it's only to be used on hook baits would be good.

 

[sam vimes]

I didn't expect to find any secret ingredients, a little information as to why Haiths say it's only to be used on hook baits would be good.

I can't answer that. If you require a definitive answer, you are going to have to contact Haiths. However, don't rule out the chance of it being a website cock up. It may just apply to that one particular Robin Red product, not all of them. There are plenty of instances of Robin Red ground bait additives or inclusions in baits (pellets and boilies) that will be used as loosefeed.

 

[rayner]

I can't dispute any of your comments, nor would I want to. Even still I have totally gone off the idea of adding RR products to my feed baits.
If that costs me one or two fish it won't bother me too much.