Through Action Rod ?

[yorkieman]

What would be your main criteria on choosing a Through Action Rod over a Tip/Middle Action one ?

The forums search seems to suggest the size/type of fish
and venue conditions, casting distance is also mentioned.

 

[rayner]

Sam vimes will be best to speak to. He's our forum tackle guru.
As far as I know, the term now for through action is parabolix, I wouldn't be surprised if I wrong, I normally am.
The parabolix rods action is right through to the butt, the first choice for me. Giving me the opportunity to use lighter lines.
They cast well for pellet waggler and fish well for smaller fish. Very versatile for me.

 

[sam vimes]

Size and type of fish would play little part in my thinking. Method and casting distance (with respect to lead/feeder size) are more important considerations.

I wouldn't choose a full through actioned rod for any type of float fishing, I can think of little worse than any genuinely through actioned float rod I've ever encountered. I also can't stand using a through actioned Avon rod for float fishing. However, don't necessarily confuse faster, more tippy actions with greater power.

When it comes to carp and barbel rods I do tend to prefer more of a through action than is currently fashionable. However, I don't tend to use huge leads (or bags) and I'm not particularly concerned with casting well in excess of 100 yards. My casting style is such that I can actually cast a smaller lead further with a through actioned rod further than I can manage with a broom handle and a big lead.

 

[trotter2]

Through action rods the idea was when a load is applied to the rod the bend or load will be applied to the rod will be equally distributed down the whole length of the blank. The whole of the rod becomes a shock absorber protecting the line from sudden impact. More suited these days to heavy duty fishing , although we see less and less full through action rods these days. A rod with a more progressive action is often confused with a true through action rod. A parabolic action rod is deliberately made so the tip, mid are strong and the butt flexes. Once made famous by by pezon Michel fly rods.

 

[nottskev]

"Through", like "fast", is not tightly defined, so people can have different ideas of what it means.

Personally, I associate "tippier" rods with smaller, fast-biting fish, and more "through" with fishing for bigger species when playing them is more the issue. Of course there are some excellent rods that contrive to combine fast striking and forgiving tips with non-locking playing actions.

The only rods I've had that were really "through" weren't so good in practice. I had a Berkely Tri-tip Barbel rod (tackleshop bargain) that looked nice but was hopeless at playing barbel. You'd find yourself with the handle pointing behind you and the fish still doing what it liked. Another through action disappointment was a Shimano float rod I bought from someone who imported it. Made for the US market, it was a beautiful, slim, cork-handled classic design with a line rating of 6-12lb and I fancied it as a barbel float rod. But when I tried it out in the close season on ordinary commercial carp of 5-8lb, it just wasn't powerful enough in the butt, and you had to splint the rod well up the blank with your reel hand to pull a fish up. The high line rating proved very questionable.

More positively, I've had great value from a couple of Carbonactive Asaki float rods that have proved tippy enough for roach and elastic enough for small to medium size tench.

 

[mikench]

Another through action disappointment was a Shimano float rod I bought from someone who imported it. Made for the US market, it was a beautiful, slim, cork-handled classic design with a line rating of 6-12lb and I fancied it as a barbel float rod.

Is that the rod I tried to buy from the US unsuccessfully Kev? I thought you liked it.

 

[nottskev]

Is that the rod I tried to buy from the US unsuccessfully Kev? I thought you liked it.

It's a lovely rod in many respects - but the action is not really up to what I was hoping to do with it.

 

[mikench]

It must have its uses though? Perhaps for silver fish.

 

[nottskev]

Sure. I think, from what Aknib says about needing to be careful not to pull the hook out of a big perch, it could be ideal for perch fishing, if I ever try fishing specifically for them.

 

[Aknib]

In the stricter sense my criteria for choice of an 'Avon' style action would have to be dictated by method and distance although I do like playing fish on through action rods which will occasionally see me use them when there are better suited options.

I do love the 1lb t/c Ultralite Avons for their feel when heavy trotting, they feel crisp in the hand and fast on the strike although at only 11' they should but they retain a wonderful action when called upon.

 

[john step]

For years I struggled along with a couple of old glass pike rods I made. Money was a problem. They were certainly through action!
They did the job of playing fish OK but as to casting a deadbait any distance that was not OK.

My two Shimano rods with a more progressive action are much more pleasant.

 

[trotter2]

If we have any older generation sea anglers the change can be seen most dramatically when we look at old beach casting rods compared to the rods we use today for the same purpose. Though action rods were common in the 60and 70s in contract the rods today,they are so stiff the rod hardly bends even when playing a fish.

 

[steve2]

If we have any older generation sea anglers the change can be seen most dramatically when we look at old beach casting rods compared to the rods we use today for the same purpose. Though action rods were common in the 60and 70s in contract the rods today,they are so stiff the rod hardly bends even when playing a fish.

I think the problem is many rods are now made for distance casting not fish playing.

 

[tigger]

Of course there are some excellent rods that contrive to combine fast striking and forgiving tips with non-locking playing actions.

I think I have a few that fit that description Kev....you described that well .
I'm not sure if some people would describe them as being a progressive action, because they have a fast strike and are quite tippy, the same as a spliced tip almost, until enough pressure is exerted at which point the rods start to bend through through the middle and when enough pressure is put on they bend into the butt. I think those are perfect for float fishing on the river.
I have the browning spliced tip rods and although quite a stiff bottom and middle section they do bend through under load, so a very nice action. I'm yet to find out for sure but I think the spliced tip may not be so good for hitting fish at distance on the trott. Reason I say this is because the tip is so soft and folds easier on the strike so not driving the hook home so well as a hollow tipped rod with a more powerful tip section. If I live through this virus i'll be interested to see if my theory is correct or not.

 

[rob48]

I think I have a few that fit that description Kev....you described that well .
I'm not sure if some people would describe them as being a progressive action, because they have a fast strike and are quite tippy, the same as a spliced tip almost, until enough pressure is exerted at which point the rods start to bend through through the middle and when enough pressure is put on they bend into the butt. I think those are perfect for float fishing on the river.
I have the browning spliced tip rods and although quite a stiff bottom and middle section they do bend through under load, so a very nice action. I'm yet to find out for sure but I think the spliced tip may not be so good for hitting fish at distance on the trott. Reason I say this is because the tip is so soft and folds easier on the strike so not driving the hook home so well as a hollow tipped rod with a more powerful tip section. If I live through this virus i'll be interested to see if my theory is correct or not.

Hi Tigger,

Re: the Browning spliced tip rods, I've not had any problem setting the hooks or bumping fish, although distance is relative I suppose. If I keep a tight line to the float a simple flick of the rod is enough, bearing in mind I tend to fish fine with small barbless hooks or B560s with the barb crimped down. I tend to use the 13'6" for stick float fishing (where if I have to go more than 25 yards I'm not feeding properly) or the 15'6" on the bolo where I'm likely to run up to twice that distance.

 

[trotter2]

To answer the spliced tip question .
A lot of the very early spliced tip rods had this problem were the tip was soft to absorb the strike when light float and fine tackle was used. The problems started when the transition from spliced tip to hollow blank section did not provide a smooth transition of power. The spliced tip would bottom out and crack you snapped off ,sprung the hook or ripped out of the fish. This was common and it took some time for manufacturing to get this right. Once hollow tips could be made fine enough to do the job actions became more progressive. Now technology is so good it's possible to have a fast rod with a progressive action down the blank. Instead of a poker with a tip that bottoms out.

 

[tigger]

Hi Tigger,

Re: the Browning spliced tip rods, I've not had any problem setting the hooks or bumping fish, although distance is relative I suppose. If I keep a tight line to the float a simple flick of the rod is enough, bearing in mind I tend to fish fine with small barbless hooks or B560s with the barb crimped down. I tend to use the 13'6" for stick float fishing (where if I have to go more than 25 yards I'm not feeding properly) or the 15'6" on the bolo where I'm likely to run twice that distance.

Trotting at those shorter distances isn't quite the same. I very often cast 25 yards across the flow before the trott starts. To hit fish/set the hook a simple flick of the wrist won't set the hook properly and then you would most likely start missing/bumping fish. That would apply wether your line is tight to the float or not.

 

[sam vimes]

I'm having no issues with the Brownings at far more extreme ranges. I'm not having to resort to excessive sweeping striking methods either.

 

[rob48]

Trotting at those shorter distances isn't quite the same. I very often cast 25 yards across the flow before the trott starts. To hit fish/set the hook a simple flick of the wrist won't set the hook properly and then you would most likely start missing/bumping fish. That would apply wether your line is tight to the float or not.

I often cast further across the river than that with a bolo float and then let it run up to 50 yards. It's easy enough to keep a direct line to a 4 or 5gr float so I only have to tighten up to set the hook. Bigger barbed hooks might be a problem I suppose but I rarely use those for float fishing.

 

[tigger]

I'm having no issues with the Brownings at far more extreme ranges. I'm not having to resort to excessive sweeping striking methods either.

Chris, from this conversation so far I can only conclude that yourself and rob48 are better at trotting than me, I do admire you both if you can practice what you preach.
I don't consider myself to have weak wrists, but there is no way I can flick my wrist and be sure to set a hook at 70 to a 100yds, I just can't do it. I mean, even the stretch in the line and bend in the rod has to be accounted for at those kind'a ranges.
I'd love to witness your skills being applied...really I would, maybe you could teach me something new, which would be great for me .
Possibly all three of us could meet up after all this commotion and I can be a pupil?
I read this post through and it does sound a little sarcastic, but it isn't meant to be, so don't take it the wrong way.