Closed face reels

Old Nick · May 28, 2010

I have recently inherited an old shakespeare closed face reel from an old relative, but I have no idea how to use it!

What are their advantages and disadvantages?, what fishing styles are they best suited to? are they prone to tangles?

Any advice greatly appreciated.....

the indifferent crucian · May 28, 2010

Well they go on top of the rod usually, unless you have one of those that doesn't !

They can get tangles if they are the type that goes on top and has a brake button on the back. Mostly this is from being indecisive with using the button, but I never use one without taking whatever tool I need to get the spool off with.

The Americans call these spincast reels sometimes. They are invariably right hand wind, though some are ampidextrous, particularly those from Shakespeare.

Some of those that go under the rod have an arm reaching forwards and are a bit of a learning curve....!

Jeff Woodhouse · May 28, 2010

Or is it like these?

I love them, as it says, and would you believe, a couple of weeks ago I manage to buy a 507 MkII Gold in almost perfect condition. It had a small paint chip on the stem near the reel foot, but that was common when a bit of grease was sitting on the metal before enamelling. Used it and what joy!

Had carp to well over 10lbs on it.

Not the best casters, but work well in a facing wind, no line blowing back. Great for trotting, just let line peel off and stick you finger straight down when you want to strike. Retrieve ratio seems a bit poor and the handle seems awkward.

They're like Marmite, you'll either love em or hate em.

Old Nick · May 28, 2010

They're the ones Jeff! now, how are they used? how do you cast with them? and what type of line strength can be used?

Fortunately it doesn't seem as complicated as the ones TIC mentions, but this thing is quite a mystery to me. I'd like to master it as its something totally new (for me), and the chap who bequeathed it to me was the uncle that first introduced me to fishing!!

the indifferent crucian · May 29, 2010

Hopefully Chavender will be along in a moment...he's got loads of them and knows the different models well. Some people like to do away with the reverse wind check on them and others like to do away with one of the line snagging pins.

They are very similar to the baitcasters in the way they snag and retreive the line. One would assume this would hurt the line if a big fish is played...rather like running your fingernail down it, but it seems this is not the case. I have one reel..a massive Shakespeare, that is clearly intended for salmon, steelhead and musky.

I did read on another forum that the Shaky is not very popular, but if nothing else it will give you an introduction to this style of fishing.

The baitcaster/spincaster reels aren't really complicated...it must just be my clumsy way with words. Sorry

John Howard · May 29, 2010

The old shakey closed face was considered a poor reel. It was made using a poor quality alloy for the gearing. Having said that I had one for years and till it wore out it served me well.

To use the outer cone is twisted to release it. Inside you will see the inner cone with the pick up pins. The line comes from the spool over the inner then fed thru the outer which is then replaced. To cast simply press with the side of the finger on top of the reel the line should then be picked up by your finger. Cast and simply turn the handle to engage the reel.

The inner cone is threaded and is removed by unscrewing, it uses an opposite thread.

If I remember rightly it has a clutch on the handle in the form of a knurled knob. These reels were intended for light lines, so I would suggest 3 or 4lb line as the maximum. I would also suggest that you use the back wind on this reel.

Dave Burr · May 29, 2010

I had a Daiwa close-faced reel that I used (as is their purpose) for trotting. They fill the perfect gap between a centre pin and a fixed spool. When trotting beyond comfortable pin casting distance they are brilliant.

Mine had a front cover that twisted off and a second one beneath it that was a left hand thread - meaning you turn it right to undo it.

You tie the line on, put it all back together so that the line comes out between the cover and the inner disc.

Pressing the disc 'opens' the bale arm (pins) and a cast can be made or line fed for trotting. To strike you can lock the line with your finger before closing the bale with a forward turn of the handle.

Close faced reels don't have clutches (well, mine didn't), so backwinding is the only way to play a fish but as you are in such direct contact, it is a pleasurable way to fish.

On the down side, they are prone to tangles and line disappearing down the wrong side of the spool.

Jeff Woodhouse · May 29, 2010

Dave Burr said:
On the down side, they are prone to tangles and line disappearing down the wrong side of the spool.

Well, if that was your experience Dave, thank heavens I've only ever bought ABUs. Rarely had any problems like that.

To cast, hold as a normal reel, extend your finger to the ring on the front of the spool and click, the line will automatically fall against yoru finger. Make the cast releasing the line as normal at the 10 o'clock position or thereabouts and simply wind to to engage the pins and retrieve line.

On sophisticated ABUs, there is a synchro drag you can adjust, but it only kicks in with a slight backwind of the handle. To cancel it, simply wind forward against some tension on the line - like a fish.

On the latest ABUs, there is an anti-reverse switch that you can turn off to play the fish using the reverse of the handle, some people like this. However, until your re-engage the anti-reverse you can't also use the synchro drag. It's one or t'other.

chavender · May 29, 2010

the shakespeares ,where not the best ,actually pretty poor really .that said if used carefully should be ok ,(all the ones i've used are resting on the bottom of the trent) mostly the old match version

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i just prefered (still do) the abu's not perfect but you could work with a abu and make it perfect .

best used with 3-4lb lines and used for trotting ,the main advantage is single handed casting ,you can cast & feed at the same time ,once you've got the knack of clicking the front button too cast it really is simplicity too use one ,and you can soon forget your using one as your casting becomes fluid and effortless as you settle into a rythem ,which is why match anglers liked them ,like all reels they have there moments and tangle but it usually only takes a minuet or two too get sorted and back too fishing .

use it ,get the feel of using a closed faced reel ,then pop it on e-bay .and then get a abu c/f and really enjoy using one .

every angler should own a closed faced reel (but perhaps not a shakespeare one :wh )

Old Nick · May 30, 2010

If I understand correctly, pressing the front ring effectively opens the bail arm, for casting, and then presumably as you back wind, the bail closes?

Thanks for all the advice gents!

Alan Tyler · May 30, 2010

"you could work with a abu and make it perfect ."

Could we persuade you to enlarge on this, Chavender?

.

Old Nick, you press the centre button to retract the pick-up pin; the line is released and falls neatly onto the crook of the finger that just pressed the release. You cast, feathering the cast with the tip of the same finger, then use the same to control the tackle as it trots.
On the strike, the same finger traps the line, and you wind forwards. The pick-up pin then pops out and takes the line from your finger, giving the fish no slack. Now you can curl that finger round the rod butt, out of the way of the line.
The only time you ever wind backwards is when a fish must be given line. Winding back with no tension in the line pays out slack under the cowl, and that will find its way under the spool and drive you mad!

Andrew Macfarlane · May 30, 2010

You don't backwind. Just crank the handle forward as you would with a fixed-spool.

Back-winding is just a way of playing the fish off the rotor, rather than a slipping clutch/rotating spool. I was never into the idea of back-winding when there was a perfectly good drag system on fixed-spools but lately, now that I'm tench fishing, I've started back-winding and it really is a nice way to keep in contact with a fish. The rod doesn't have to flex to a certain degree before the clutch allows the spool to slip and give line. As the fish runs, you 'backwind' and as you gain control you wind normally and take up slack. Backwards and forwards. It's really good fun. You feel like you've done more to bank the fish, which raises your level of accomplishment I feel.

I wouldn't suggest back-winding with pike. I tried it and suffered for it, with rapped knuckles.

---------- Post added at 08:01 ---------- Previous post was at 07:59 ----------

Alan, you beat me to it!! At least I explained backwinding...

Alan Tyler · May 30, 2010

... And very well, too.

Nick, there's one more thing; if you enjoy the Shakey and decide to upgrade to an Abu, the clutches on those are a bit tricksy. I have the 508, being a southpaw; its right-hander's brother is the 507, and I heartily recommend it, if you can find one.
BUT if you don't know that beginning to backwind half a turn sets the drag to half the tension it's at when you wind forward, you can get a hell of a shock! The fish plods off; you intend to give it a little line, just to cushion the shock - and off it takes like a drenched tomcat as the drag suddenly yields.
Practice on medium sized fish first!

Old Nick · May 30, 2010

It probably won't get an outing until the river season starts which should give me a chance to play and get used to the feel before connecting with a live fish!

Again thanks for everyones help and input.

chavender · May 30, 2010

Alan Tyler said:
"you could work with a abu and make it perfect ."

Could we persuade you to enlarge on this, Chavender?

the main downfall of all closed faced reels is smoothness when letting out line when trotting ,if the spool is in side the winding cup the line has too transverse oblique angles on its way out of the reel ,but if its at its bottom end of its oscillation the these angles are greatly reduced giving better line release .when trotting or casting

the old abu 500 series had a oscillation ratio of 1:1 ie one rotation of the handle produced one oscillation of the spool up & down ,and if you was too set (remove then refit) the position of the handle so it pointed downwards aligned with the spool being at bottom dead centre of its travel (ie best position for line release) after casting out if the handle was left in the downwards position you get smoother line release every time because of the oscillation ratio ,the spool would allways be in this position.

if you didn't like using the two stage syncrodrag (possible the worst part of the abu reels ) you simply removed the anti-reverse pawl from deep within its case ,then tightened up the drag real tight ,you was left with a reel you had too back wind .much better than fiddling around with the dodgy drag system .and had the perfect light trotting reel

Alan Tyler · May 31, 2010

Brilliant! That's a really useful bunch of insights; many thanks for taking the trouble to post.

Andrew Macfarlane · May 31, 2010

Love the float site Chavender...

I might look at some of your tench floats in the near future.

Closed face reels

Old Nick

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the indifferent crucian

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Jeff Woodhouse

Moaning Marlow Meldrew

Old Nick

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the indifferent crucian

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John Howard

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Dave Burr

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Jeff Woodhouse

Moaning Marlow Meldrew

chavender

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Old Nick

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Alan Tyler

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Andrew Macfarlane

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Alan Tyler

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Old Nick

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chavender

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Alan Tyler

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Andrew Macfarlane

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