Hard Venues

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Leon Foreman

Guest
I have heard and read a lot about so called hard venues. What are they exactly or rather what does the description refer to? Is it a personal Viewpoint or a general viepoint ammongst Carp anglers? What makes for hard waters? I know it has to be obvious to you but here its a new term.
 
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David Will

Guest
A hard venue would be a place where everything i know (refer to back of fag packet:) )has failed.I like these sorts of venues as they are a challenge and continue the learning curve.
My hard venue may be some one elses banker.
 
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Carp Angler

Guest
A venue is described as 'hard' when the fishing is not easy.
This is normally for either, some, all or a couple of several reason.
Location.
(Big venue, small head of fish)
Cute fish.
(Highly pressured fish that have seen every rig and bait going)
Rich venue.
(Natural food levels so high as to make anglers baits inconsequential)

This is obviously my personal view, and as David said, someones hard venue is someone elses sure bet.
 
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Paul Williams

Guest
Venues are also increasing being discribed as hard purely for journalistic reasons!! eg Kickles when the Barbel are still at Adams! or am i being to synical?
 
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Leon Foreman

Guest
Thanks Guys I got a clearer picture now. Another question I want to ask and If Neil is looking maybe he can Help as well as any other regular River Carper. I Seldom fish lakes or dams rather as they are called here. Most of My fishing envolves rivers. About 80% of the time I fish the Middle Vaal Section just above the Vaal Dam. The river is enormously wide and alltough it has a rather fast flowing stream in its center the river in general is described as slow flowing. Is Carp in river Migratory or do they stay put in a general Area of a river if they find s food source they like. With migratory I actually mean do they migrate for miles?
 
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Ron Clay

Guest
When I used to fish Vaal Dam together with others, we used to find that in some areas you would catch plenty of carp in the 4 to 8 pound bracket. Then there were areas where the average size was much bigger - 14 to 25 lbs. I once saw a catch taken years ago of about 30 carp, all over 15 lbs, the best was 30 lbs plus taken from the River near Villiers by one man in an 8 hours session, all on sweetcorn fishing the "method" as it is called in UK using crushed boiled maize.
 
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Leon Foreman

Guest
Ron, an old friend and fishing partner of my late father gave me a visit about a month ago and he told me about his recent trip to the Vaal on the Free State side near Oranjeville. What he told me was almost unbelievable. In 6 Hours time he caught 18 Carp and the smallest was 9 Pounds with the biggest 26 pounds. He called me about a week ago and said he went back and believe it or not they all comepletly blanked for the whole week end. I sometimes really wonder about the Fish in the Vaal They really do at times defy all logic.
 
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Ron Clay

Guest
Its a huge water amd the fish move around a great deal. Have you tried mass baiting with hard maize, a method my old friend Trevor Babich used to great effect. It will hold the carp in one area for a long time. If you have the money I would mass bait with boilies
 
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Leon Foreman

Guest
Mass baiting with maize used to work a great deal some time back but I guess the bigger fish started to wise up to maize concentrated in a area. Maize is part of their natural food sorces in the Vaal system especially seeing that most bank sides are ajasant to maize fields and in teh harvesting season a lot of maize do get washed into the system. Biolies are verry expensive here even the two or three Local brands. The only imports at this stage is from Hudcies and at R70 a kilo are rediculiuosly expensive. My usual method that I found that works good is by using a bolt rig and replacing the Lead/sinker with a local type method feeder and boilie as Hook bait. I usually fish this over a bed of variuos partickle bait and a couple of loos boilies. Seeing that most places i fish have never seen boilies in variuos quatities they are very wiery of them. Most partickle bait is alos new so you never know how the fish will react to them. As you might well know the standerd baits are paste based with and with method feeder over maize or crushed maize as groundfeed.
 
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Peter Morton

Guest
Leon
this friend of your father,who blanked for a whole week,has he ever met stewart????????:)
 
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Leon Foreman

Guest
Dunno Peter, the power of the darkside is mysterious, who knows how far it stretches and by what means it spread!! ;o) Think Ill have to ask him if he didnt see a coffin float by his swim. Nah, seriuosly tough, its actually easy at times to blank on the Vaal. You might catch them by the dozens while the guys next to you tottaly blank even if they use the same bait and method as yourself. Sure there are always logical reasons for it but it aint nice when its you that is blanking.
 
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Ron Clay

Guest
Leon, have you tried making your own boilies from a mix based on Pro Nutro.
 
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Ron Clay

Guest
The other bait you should try is trout pellets. You should be able to get these quite easily in SA. If you soak them you can mix them up into a paste for the hook. Carp love them!
 
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Leon Foreman

Guest
Ron, I am bussy sourcing some of the porducts mentioned in the "Beekay guide to Carp Baits". I have treid a couple of stuff with Pronutro and Birdseed and variuos "Household" ingrediants. The biggest problem I face however with ingrediants is that it isnt so redally available here. Most of the stuff is available in smaller quantities at health shops which means its a bit expensive. The other options is buyin them in bulk from suppleirs. Anyone want to share a 50 Kg bag of semolina. I think most of the suppleirs are catching on tough because a year aggo essential oils were only for use by new age health freaks and suddenly there opened up this huge angling market so we get them now in most pharmacy's and supermarkets. Still struggeling to get Betain(HCL) have to use imported health tablets else i have to buy a gallon in bulk. I have to decide wheater to go for an instant Bait with Low NV or a bait that I can actually use for a longer Term. Any advice or recipies?
 
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