Commercial Boilie Ingredients

Matt Brown · Oct 17, 2004

Recently I've been tinkering with making my own boilies and pastes from mixes found on the web and they've been catching me a few fish.

So now I'm wondering how these home made mixes compare with the likes of Nutrabaits, Mainline and other brands of commercial base mixes and liquid ingredients.

Are the bait companies making a fortune by selling simple variants of basic mixes or are they really applying the science and producing product that will catch more fish than a homemade mix ever would?

I'm sure there are bait experts out there who know exactly what's in certain commercial mixes.

Is anyone prepared to divulge the recepies?

Baz · Oct 18, 2004

Matt,
I'm doing much the same as youre self.
Have a look on the (Carping or Camping ) thread. there's some good advice on the subject of bait.

jason fisher · Oct 18, 2004

various pre digested fishmeals, various milkproteins such as cassiens. and other ingredients such as vegetable meals.

the one problem with this is unless you are buying in industrial quantities these ingredients will end up costing more than a shop bought base mix.

Matt Brown · Oct 19, 2004

Cheers Baz, I shall have a gander.

Jason, I was curious as to what exactly was, for instance, in Nutrabaits Trigga. Can it be emulated at a cheaper cost? Is the quality of fishmeal an issue?

I realise that most people who know exactly what's in these base mixes will probably be in the industry and will wish to keep things secret or they may put themselves out of a job!

Tim Ridge · Oct 19, 2004

Matt, I've been using home made baits for years and frequently I have detected no difference at all to results achieved with comparable commercial products except in certain instances my home made baits have outfished them consistently.
One example was a home made 50/50 mix which outfished a cream flavoured readymade by somewhere in the region of 10 fish to 1 on sywell over a six week period. Another instance was with a home made vitalin/fishmeal/robin red mix which cost next to nothing to produce but outperformed six different commercial mixes on the trent.
However, I don't bother making bait myself now because I don't gain anything financially. Two hours out in the cab pays for a kilo's of Dynamite baits boilies. It would probably take me two hours to purchase ingredients, measure them, mix together, roll and boil.

Malcolm Bason · Oct 19, 2004

Congratulations Tim. Care to elaborate on the following mate?

"no difference at all to results achieved with comparable commercial products"

When you say "comparable", what do you mean?

"One example was a home made 50/50 mix which outfished a cream flavoured readymade by somewhere in the region of 10 fish to 1"

So, which 'readymade' was this then?

"Another instance was with a home made vitalin/fishmeal/robin red mix which cost next to nothing to produce but outperformed six different commercial mixes on the trent."

Now you just gotta explain this one?

Time you started your answer by saying:

"I detected no difference at all to results", but yet go one to say:

"outfished a cream flavoured readymade by somewhere in the region of 10 fish to 1"

Cakey · Oct 20, 2004

Like I said Malc a shit bait in the right place !

Tim Ridge · Oct 20, 2004

I never said that there weren't uncontrollable variables, there always are; the point that I was trying to get accross was that you need not suffer crisis in confidence simply because you don't have the reddies to invest in a bait which costs over a tenner a kilo.

I will answer your questions.

The commercial readymade was cream cajouser which appearance wise and to my nose at least seems to be similar in make up to a 50/50 type mix (comparable) but with added birdfood. Of course this is speculation but because ingredients aren't published. To speculate is all we can do.
The bait I used as a comparison was much softer which might account for it being more acceptable to the tench. As I said uncontrollable variables.

You twisted my words malcolm/misinterpreted what I said. I didn't worry about walking on glass because the initial question was a simple one. I fully accept that my litteracey skills are not perfect though I have re-read my initial post and I still cannot see how this could be misinterpreted.

In most cases I have detected no difference at all to results but in the isolated examples mentioned (and others)home made baits HAVE outfished commercial products by a large margin. Is it not fair to compare one bait with a large proportion of fishmeal ingredients with another commercial product which smells strongly of fishmeal or two completely different types of bait for that matter? After all you pays your money!

I think the truth of the matter is that if it is edible and you throw it in the river/lake at some point something is going to eat it.

Budgie Burgess · Oct 20, 2004

Over the years Ive been involved with a couple of bait firms.Let me assure you that there aint nothing special going in to a lot of commerecial baits! Some are very "poor" baits but are sucsesfull regardless.One firm whose bait I have had a lot of sucsess with uses no binding ingrediants at all in its products! merely relying on large amounts of eggs and grinding the base mix very finely.A lot of homemade baits contain far better(?)and therefore a lot more expensive ingrediants.

Matt Brown · Oct 20, 2004

Budgie, that's what I suspected.

By the time you take packing shipping and everyone's profit margins, marketing, field testing and production into account they must be able to put a bait together at a very low cost price.

I fully understand that most people are happy to pay the going rate for a variety of reasons.

Anyway, when I've bought commercial base mixes they seem to contain lots of powder that looks like the Semolina, Maize Meal etc that is used in 50/50 mixes. DO most commercial base mixes still contain large amounts of Semolina etc?

What are people's opnions on fishmeal? Are there many different levels of quality? Does this matter to the fish? Does high quality fishmeal contain more meat and less bone?

Tim Ridge · Oct 20, 2004

I buy the stuff from a local cattle food manufactor (waltons) on the assumption that it obviousely goes through the human food chain at some point so it must be ok!
Admittedly this is a big assumption and it is something that I have not delved deeply into but then we have no idea at all what goes into commercially produced baits.

Budgie Burgess · Oct 20, 2004

Put it this way,an awfull lot of baits rely on good flavours/attractors and you dont gety much better flavour/attractor carrier/releasers than good old semo!

Budgie Burgess · Oct 20, 2004

Should at this point say that Im not knocking commercial baits at all.Just trying to give a bit of confidence to those who wish to make their own.

Malcolm Bason · Oct 20, 2004

Alright Tim.

Thanks for your reply.

I'm a bit thick you see, so I have to have everything explained to me!

Cakey · Oct 20, 2004

And semo is a good binder........

Tim Birch · Oct 20, 2004

Good thread
Spending too much on manufactured base mixes.
Need more answers.

If all base mixes are generally the same what are the main key ingredients?

I've always thought:
fishmeal/ground hemp

Semolina/Milk proteins

Am I far off the mark?

For example Could I emulate a succesful Tigga ice type boilie using Fishmeal/hemp, a small amount of the trigga ice activator, spices (cinnamon/Paprika etc)and maybe GLM ?

Tim Ridge · Oct 20, 2004

All manner of ingredients work tim. I've tended to look at the cost of bulk ingredients and once I've found one that I'm happy with I have then added bits to it which I think may compliment it.
The major bulking ingredients that I have used are....
semolina
Soya flour
white fishmeal
maize meal
Ground Vitalin
Ground pellets of various types
Ground dog cat biscuits

Secondary ingredients are chosen to compliment this for instance vitamealo has a distinctive creamy smell which smells very nice (to me)when combined with sweet style semolina based baits.
Various birdfoods add texture and a sweet/spicy aroma. Fishmeals used as a secondary additive give the bait (surprise surprise a fishmeally note that compliments savoury baits.

Thirdly additives are chosen to spice the mix up a little, to make it bind better and/or to harden the bait.
Robin red is a good example of something which will add to an otherwise bland bait, wheat gluten will make most mixes bind better and bloodmeal or egg albumin will harden them slightly.

Finally there are additives designed to give the ingredients a distinctive smell or even attract the fish (though it is debaitable if this is a realistic objective) Corn steep liquor, bovril, minamino, fish oils, chemical based smells or labels the possibilities are endless.

I dont claim to be some sort of bait guru so please dont take me to task over some complicated bait theory you have. All I claim is that simple home made baits work
Hope this is helpfull Tim

Budgie Burgess · Oct 20, 2004

Gey hold of a couple of the Carp books from the 80's like Rod Hutchinsons Carp Book,The Carp Strikes Back,Tiger Bay,even Carp Fever.These all have bait sections which as well as giving you a few recipies also give you an isight into various ingredients,their properties and sugested percentages for use.

Big Rik · Oct 20, 2004

I've just dug out some of my old recipes from 84 to 86 ish.....

not too relevant now and half the ingredients probably aren't available any longer.

Matt Brown · Oct 20, 2004

Bugger, I sold a copy of 'The Carp Strikes Back' on eBay and month or so ago.

Surely there's been some further development in the last 20 years?

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