Gary Knowles on the Ribble

Baz · Feb 21, 2005

A good session Gary, and an interesting write up to boot. I used the QC clips, and what a difference they made to changing rigs over. I used mashed bread on Saturday, but soon realized that liquidised might have been better for the spot I was in. I have never known the river to be as still as it was.
The other thing was, I should really have flavoured it as you did.
Never mind, next time eh?

Gary Knowles 2 · Feb 22, 2005

Baz,

The big difference in the spot I chose was that it was fast water. The majority of 'known' spots on the ribble are practicaly no-flow areas at this time of year.

If you can find some pacey water, you always have a chance during the day.

Also as you pointed out, when I expect it to be tough I always use liquidised bread. It remains a good attractor but is much less filling than mash.

Baz · Feb 22, 2005

What I was thinking Gary, was that if I had used liquidised bread in pacey water it would have been washed out of the swim too fast, working on the assumption that it would have taken any fish out of the swim.
As things turned out, I was in a swim that didn't have much flow, or not as much as I would have liked. Space was a bit limited in the faster water, where I would have thought mashed bread would stay in the area longer.

Baz · Feb 22, 2005

Plus,
my own fault I know, although I only fished one rod, I didn't try touch ledgering. From what I saw, I only had two very minute little pulls throughout the day, but who knows what I might have missed.

Gary Knowles 2 · Feb 22, 2005

On a river like the ribble Baz, I think having a certain amount of your feed washing downstream is a distinct advantage. You can draw chub a long way from downstream.

Its a trick matchmen have used for years. I remember one guy who used to stick float fish for chub used to catapult maggots not only in his swim but occasionally at various distances downstream to draw fish into his range.

That said, I think the majority of liquidized bread when fished through a cage feeder will stay pretty much close to where it's deposited.

Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA) · Feb 22, 2005

I would agree Gary as the flow on the bottom of the river, even in fast stretches is always less than on the surface & small particles will congregate between pebbles etc.

You would presumably have to compress the bread in the feeder quite tightly to prevent it coming out before the feeder settled although as you point out a few particles wafting downstream can draw the fish up.

Bully · Feb 22, 2005

Nigel, I dont think some people realise just how much slower it is. Its considerably less. I spent 3 years measuring water flows in various rivers around the country and the profiles never ceased to amaze me, although 23 years of lager and wine mean I cannot remember exact percentages !

Its the key reason why, when trotting, holding back quite hard is so important.

Baz · Feb 22, 2005

I don't mean to be argumentative lads, but have you seen the method Tony Miles uses to catch the bigger fish from a shoal of chub?
He puts liqudised bread in so that the smaller chub chase the paticles of crumb down stream in the current.
And he puts mashed bread in just behind the liquidised to hold the bigger fish in the area.
I suppose what I am saying is that mashed bread will hold better than liquidised.

Gary Knowles 2 · Feb 22, 2005

Not that simple I don't think Baz. It would depend on the consistency of the mash.

If you make it really mushy, almost like soup it will drift a long way downstream.
If you make it really heavy and stodgy then it will sink to the bottom like a stone and stay there....

As a general rule of thumb though I use mash for when they are feeding hard. Liquidized for tough conditions.

Nigel - I don't compress it too tight because like you say, I think there is an advantage to having a tight area of bait AND a long trail downstream of that area to draw fish in.

Baz · Feb 22, 2005

That's worth bearing in mind Gary, I had'nt taken the consistency into account. Again that's what seperates the wheat from the chaff.

Clive Evans 1 · Feb 22, 2005

Gary, nice informative article in A/T this week. I'll be keeping that for future reference.

In your opinion, is it the water in the mash that creates the downstream attraction, or is it necessary to have particles as well?

If the second, could you then fill a feeder half and half with mash and liquidised? And which would you put in first?

Excuse me butting in Baz.

Gary Knowles 2 · Feb 22, 2005

That's some question isn't it Clive !

I'm not a scientist but I'd guess it's a bit of both, especially if you add some flavouring to the mix as i assume this would give a 'scent' trail as well as a food trail.

But in the main I'd say the small particles of bread have the biggest effect. Rightly or wrongly when you get them into a feeding situation I picture chub darting around searching out drifting particles of feed and folling them upstream until they ultimately find their way to the hook bait.

If you mean the particles such as hemp and micro pellets that I sometimes add to the mix then i use them only sparingly and the intention of those is to hold any fish that have followed the trail upstream in the area of your hookbait for as long as possible.

It's a very effective method and to be honest I'm amazed how few people I see fishing in this way.

With regard to your second question. I'm not sure why you would want to do it so I've never considered mixing liquidised and mash. So I can't really answer I'm afraid.

Neneman Nick · Feb 22, 2005

gary as a matter of intrest,how do you prepare your bread mash???do you use tinned loaves or sliced bread???
mash isnt a method i`ve really sat down and tried,on the other hand bread put through a blender is a method which has served me well.i once won a club match with 15lb of bream using bread through the blender with casters and hemp,cast out in a taped up feeder<that was on the nene at oundle>.

Neneman Nick · Feb 22, 2005

baz,how about trying a taped up groundbait feeder???

Baz · Feb 22, 2005

For a slower release? that's someting else I have never thought about for liquidised.

You are welcome Clive, the more's the better.
I love chub chat.

Clive Evans 1 · Feb 22, 2005

Thanks Gary, that's given me plenty to think about.

The particles I meant were liquidised bread particles leaching off from the mash area, if you put both in at the same time...I think.

Anyway, flavouring the water in the mash is something I'm definitely going to look into!

GrahamM · Feb 23, 2005

I tend to use liquidised bread when fishing swims with not too much flow and supplement it with pinches of bread flake of the same size I'm using on the hook. That way you're giving the fish a real sample of your hookbait and not just a taste so that they can latch on to exactly what to look for to get the best feed, ie, make them hunt around for the hookbait amongst the crumbs.

You have to make sure you pinch all the air out of the flake or it won't stay put for too long.

Using a percentage of mash in the liquidised is a good idea but I prefer to just dampen the liquidised a little with a spray of flavoured water to make it stodgier, how much according to the swim I'm fishing, but more stodgy for faster and deeper water.

Also control the feed by swapping from a cage feeder (faster feed) and standard groundbait feeder (slower feed) and obviously, of course, by how firmly you compress the liquidised bread in the feeder.

On waters like the Ribble, where the chub are used to feeding on pellets, I supplement the liquidised bread with micro pellets, some at the time of making the mash so it's well soaked in, and continually with a few pinches of micro pellets while I fish so they always have a few fresh and still crunchy ones. I never use anything bigger than micro pellets when bread fishing as I don't want to trigger the chub into feeding on pellets.

Using one of those Drennan flat bread punches can make a big difference when the chub are being tricky. And they make ideal samples for the feeder for they have already compressed about 40% of the punched bread.

Gary Knowles 2 · Feb 23, 2005

Nick,

I buy the cheap economy loaves from Tesco at about 12p each and at any one time have a bout 4 of them open, with the slices spread out going stale. (Stale bread makes much better mash)

Then just take a dozen slices at a time and soak them in your landing net at the river, before squeezing as much wate as you can out.

Transfer the lot into a bucket give it a good stir whilst adding any flavourings or particles you fancy.

Like Graham I never use anything larger than micro-pellets or hemp as I don't want them switching onto pellets, which they can do on a river that sees a lot of pellets.

John McLaren · Feb 23, 2005

Thanks for all this Gary it has been very useful - I have never used hemp, micro pellets or flavours with liquidised bread although I do with mash! Must try it.

As for Saturday, that was some session - you'll understand that in the White Bull quite a few thought you were winding Graham upwith your text messages!!!

Baz · Feb 23, 2005

I have flavoured Liquised bread on many occasions, and I would say it does make a difference. About a good half capfull to a loaf of bread works for me.

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