Catching roach with a feeder

Tony Campbell · Mar 13, 2005

Hi guys,

I'm having problems catching the roach on my stillwater. I have tried fishing the float, but can't reach them easily and accurately. I want to try to get them on a feeder setup with maggot, but the complete bottom of my water is covered with thick weed. Has anyone got any tips regarding overcoming this problem? I have tried with the feeder, but have not ever had a single bite. I'm using a small blockend feeder, sliding on the mainline (3lb) stopped by a bead and swivel to a hooklength of 1.5lb to a size 20 hook. I can only think that the feeder,bait etc is sinking into the weed as it always comes back in, completely covered.

Ron 'The Hat' Clay · Mar 13, 2005

With a very soft weedy bottom try float fishing using casters not maggots which will sink and sit on top of the weed.

Use a couple of dark floating casters which will conterbalance the weight of the hook and sink dead slow, stopping when the bait touches the weed.

Also try breadflake pinched on the hook so that it justs sinks. Use a little mashed bread as groundbait.

Darkstar · Mar 14, 2005

Hi Tony, You could try catapulting a lot of particles or pellets into the area you intend to fish. Do this for a couple of weeks and the fish will tear up the weed looking for food. They will clear the area of weed which should make it easier for you on the feeder. As a bonus it will create a feeding spot which if you keep secret squirell about should put the odds in your favour.

Tony Campbell · Mar 14, 2005

Thanks for the info guys, Ron, I tried casters a week or so ago. I stuck it out for about 4 hrs, but got no joy. I'll give it a try next time I'm there.
Darkstar, I never thought about using the fish to clear the weed..... sounds like it's well worth the try.
It's a really peculiar water.... when the fish are up in the water, bites on the float are fast and furious. But when they are low down, feeding on the bottom, I switch to the feeder but never even get a twitch. I would love to see what the bottom really looks like. If there were weedless patches that I could target, life would be so much easier (but then it just wouldn't be 'fishing', would it?).
I'm seriously considering making a weed rake and clearing a good size patch, feeding it up well for a few days and then giving it a go. I'll let you all know how I get on.

Cheers guys.

P.S Just took delivery of a Preston Innovations Carbonactive 13ft float rod.... dying to give it a try.

jason fisher · Mar 14, 2005

so i take it that a leading rod and marker rod don't feature in your initial investigations then.

Tony Campbell · Mar 14, 2005

Eh? What? Pardon?

jason fisher · Mar 14, 2005

leading about and judicious use of the marker rod will find all the nice gravelly bits in the weed, you then cast on to these areas.

jason fisher · Mar 14, 2005

just realised this is in the beginner section, have a look on the carp forum for articles on feature finding and investigating a swim, you only really need to do it once to build up a picture of the water that you have in front of you, then you will be fishing a lot smarter than the blind methods you appear to be using at the moment.

Tony Campbell · Mar 14, 2005

Thanks for the info Jason, but the problem with this water is the constant growth of weed. I would have to lead out the area every time I went, as the weed is constantly changing. I have fished this water for two years (perhaps more) and no matter where I have cast, I get weed. I assumed that virtually the whole bottom, within casting area, is weeded. I'm going to try the rake method, but will keep your tip in mind.
Thanks.

Peter Jacobs · Mar 15, 2005

Tony,

What sort of distance are you having to fish at?

I would have thought that a decent sized weighted bodied waggler would have been the answer if the weed problem is as bad as you say.

If you can try this then get one with most of the weight already in the float, like the Sensas Bob, Ken or **** models and then only use one or two dropper shot.

If using maggot then by employing Sticky-Mag you should be able to catapult your feed a fair distance, but only use just enough to bind them so that the maggot balls break up on the way down.

Otherwise, then a weed rake seems like a good idea

Big Rik · Mar 15, 2005

or if you're determined to use the feeder, then dry, exploding, punch crumb in a groundbait feeder, with a semi buoyant bit of flake on the hook.
(you can also mix casters into the crumb mixture)

Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA) · Mar 15, 2005

Silly question perhaps but when you are not getting any bites on the float you seem to be assuming that the fish are feeding on the bottom & switch to the feeder.Could it be that the fish just are not feeding at all hence your lack of bites?

I am not a stillwater roach expert & have limited experience on rivers but from what I have read is it not the case that roach prefer to feed on the bottom on clean areas?Others might want to comment?

There certainly doesn't seem much point in banging out a feeder only for it to disappear into the weed where it completely useless.

Tony Campbell · Mar 15, 2005

Peter, Funny you should mention the loaded wagglers..... went and bought some today following the advice of my local tackle dealer. PLUS..... going to get fitted with contact lenses so that I can see the damn thing (not joking). I was struggling to reach any roach that I could see feeding before, so these loaded wagglers should help. And no.... I wasn't joking about the eyesight problem. And before anyone else says so..... I probably had hundreds of bites and didn't see them

Nigel, I was thinking along the same lines as you... thats why I was considering using a weed rake to clear a patch or two and try and entice the roach to them. I must admit to prefering the feeder approach, but I am coming around to the float.... just not very experienced.

Another problem I have, is finding first hand advice. I live in scotland, which is not exactly over-run with coarse fisherman that could give me the benefit of their experience. So a lot of the time, its a case of read, and read some more..... then suck it and see.

BTW.... thanks to everyone who has taken the time to answer my thread. It has helped a lot. It's a pity we aren't all in the pub discussing this over a pint or two

Tony Campbell · Mar 15, 2005

Peter, You mentioned something called 'sticky mag', I assume thats to make maggot balls? I think I read somewhere in 'Improve your coarse fishing' magazine, that you could use Horlicks as a 'sticky'. Is this just as good?
I've also seen topsoil mentioned as a groundbait additive. What is it's purpose?

Peter Jacobs · Mar 16, 2005

Tony,

You can use Horlicks and it is a lot cheaper than Sticky Mag. Personally I prefer to use Sticky Mag as I don't particularly like the smell of horlicks and it is adding a flavour to the maggot that I am not confident in.
That said, Sensas do market a Strawberry flavour sticky mag which I have used a lot.
The one tip when using either is not to make the maggots too wet, and don't use too much powder otherwise you end up with a useless stciky mess.

Topsoil as an additive to continental groundbaits adds 'weight' and helps it to sink quicker.
There is no feed or attractant quality in topsoil, much the same as leem. Alternatively you can use PV1 Collant to add 'weight' to your groundbait.

Hope this helps.

GrahamM · Mar 16, 2005

Tony, tell us more about the water and the roach:

1. What depth is the swim you're fishing?

2. How far from the bank?

3. Are the roach there in reasonable numbers?

4. Are they good sized fish of 1lb or more?

5. Have you seen the roach in the swim you're fishing, or seen anyone else catching them from there?

The answers will help us to help you more.

Tony Campbell · Mar 16, 2005

Thanks for the info peter, I would never have guessed what the topsoil was for.

1. Hi Graham, The swim varies from 5-6 ft in depth (not sure if that is the underwater topography or the height of the weed (canadian pondweed or oxygenating plant as the garden centres call it).

2. At this time of year, the roach appear on the surface, around 30-40 yds away. I cant see any feeding surface or bottom any nearer to the bank at this time of year, but during the warmer weather they are easy to spot right at your feet.

3. This loch has what seems to be huge numbers of roach, judging by the commotion over a large area when a pike attacks. There is also a huge number of Pike, have caught over 50 jacks in one day on lure and deadbaits.

4. Most of the roach I have seen and caught are around the 4-5 oz size, but have been present when 1 or 2 of over 1lb have been taken. There also appears to be perch but in much lesser numbers.

5. Yes, at this time of year, the roach can be seen 30-40 yds away, dimpling the surface (i assume it's the roach). Every one that I've spoken to at this Loch, also have difficulty catching them at this distance. During the summer, they are very easy to catch.... in fact, if you fell in, you would climb out with them in your pockets!

When I come to think about it, even during the summer when they are very close in, I still can't seem to catch them on the bottom with a feeder, even in a visibly clear area.
2 miles down the road at another water, I can catch them on the feeder without any problem. The easy answer, is to fish at this other water where catching them is easy.... but I'm damned if I'll be beat!!!

jason fisher · Mar 16, 2005

are you sure they're not rudd?

you seem to be mentioning lots of suface activity which doesn't match with my experiences of roach unless they are very very small.
i've had very large shoals of roach taking maggot right infront of me and seen nothing other than the odd small swirl.

try a loaded crystal waggler fished about 1 foot deep and cast right into the middle of the swirls.

GrahamM · Mar 16, 2005

Sounds like fishing for them fairly close in with a pole or a whip is a good bet. You can lower the bait in to sink slowly and sit on top of the weed. A pole will also allow you to use very fine tackle as I'm assuming the water is very clear, given the amount of weed growth.

Tony Campbell · Mar 16, 2005

Jason, I'm certain they are not rudd, definately roach. And they definately cause a lot of surface movement during the summer months. When I went to get the bodied wagglers, I got a lot of different wagglers, including loaded crystals of various sizes. Up until then, I had been using the stickfloats that I would normally use up here for trout on the river. Perhaps the change of tactics and equipment will work?

Graham, Although I would really like to give pole fishing a try, the expense at the moment would be a bit much. As far as the water clarity is concerned, it is really gin clear. As for the lightness of my terminal tackle, I'm currently using 1.5lb hooklength. I might get something a bit lighter, probably 1lb or slightly less. I don't think that the size of the roach that are in here are going to be a problem on this kind of breaking strain, and now that I have a decent float rod, even less so.

I will conquer this water!!! I have made these roach this years target ( along with some really big perch in a nearby reservoir. They are huge by Scottish standards. My fishing buddy had one of nearly 3lb on worm.

Catching roach with a feeder

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