Single Species Societies

Way back in the 60s we had what were known as "Specimen Groups". We even had a National Association of these groups and for a period everything went well

Over the years however these groups were replaced by single species organisations.

For example today we have:

1: The Carp Society
2: The Barbel Society
3: The Chub Study Group
4: The National Anguilla Society
5: The Perchfishers
6: The Grayling Society
7: The Tench Fishers
8: The Real Tenchfishers
9: The PAC.
10: The Catfish Conservation Group

And a few more besides.

Now with the exception of carp and catfish, I will probably fish for all the other species listed in the space of a year, with a few other species added too.

What gets me is that there are anglers out there who will fish for the rest of their lives for one blinkin species! I truly wonder how the minds of these angler's work?

Still it's not for me to criticize too much, what suits one might not suit another.

However for me one of the main attractions of angling is in it's variety. Winter to me means roach, pike and chub. Come springtime and out comes my fly tackle. June means tench and maybe some bream. Autumn, barbel, grayling, pike and zander, although I might have a few sessions for perch or even rudd if I can find some.

But there are some for instance who will fish for barbel right throughout the season. I would get bored stiff quite frankly.

Perhaps there is room for an "All Rounders Society"?

What do you think?

An all-rounders society?


Isn't that called NASA?

I personally see little wrong with single species groups, after all, just because I am a member of the PAC this doesn't mean I have to fish for pike all year round, and I'm fairly sure that the Tenchfishers members don't pursue Tench all year round.

Single species groups have done a huge amount to further research into their chosen species, the Anguilla boys and the Perchfishers in particular and the PAC has raised the profile of Pike and helped put a stop to the mindless slaughter of all pike that used to be standard practise in the past, the old BCSG did a lot of work into various carp strains and growth rates, so for those reasons alone I feel that such groups have a valuable role to play, never mind the social aspect of these organisations, after all there is a great deal to be learned from fellow pikers, chubbers or whatever......

You are right of course Jon.

However there are some members of these societies who tend to think that what they fish for is the only species that swims.

By the way Jon you're not the re-incarnation of Ray Webb are you?

Pike and tench were Ray's only interest.

I must admit Ron I've yet to encounter a true single species angler except for carp fishermen. Even a couple of the die-hard eel boys still wet a line for pike or tench when they feel the need.

As an all-rounder myself I find it difficult to justify the cost of joining a mass of single species groups and limit myself to the 2 or 3 that I believe I can dedicate enough time to.

It would be nice to have a local specimen group in the mould of the Northhampton Group for example but I fear that the days of those are long gone.

Back in that golden era, Ron, there were all manner of enthusiasts who happily banded together to share information about waters, techniques and baits. There was cameraderie even allowing for the rivalries between different groups. But above all anglers joined these groups to go fishing with like-minded souls.

We mustn't forget that there was but a fraction of the information available to the average angler that there is now. There were very few 'how-to' articles and no videos, internet, Sky TV, etc. Magazine production values were rubbish.

Today we have still have groups but they have become politicised. Groups are expected to conduct research (for Christ's sake don't we pay others to do this!), start fighting funds, attend rallies, and when it comes to the actual fishing it's all secret squirrel.

I was asked by one idiot recently from his very high horse, "And how many meetings at the houses of Parliament have YOU attended?"

Oh - my - God!!!!

I've attended many different kinds of meetings in my time - be that species led, syndicates, match groups and so on and underlying all this is the same old desire, we just wan to go fishing. It's just that the ones who do the agitating are more verbose and politically aware. If they weren't in angling they'd be somewhere else behaving just the same but they dominate events.

It's time we got back to our roots and started a whole new bunch of fishing clubs, or specimen groups, or call them what you will. Let's foster the good things in fishing and leave those who want to play politicians to get on with it.

Don't go thinking that's irrisponsible on my part because in my experience, the minute you put someone in charge of something they only work to their own agenda anyway, so let them get on with what they enjoy because they seldom achieve anything anyway.

Can you name the top five achievements of the NFA - or any five for that matter?

June 16th sounds like a good date to kick it all off, don't you think? In fact I'm going to launch my own specimen group here in South Yorkshire this afternoon. Poor old matt doesn't know it yet but when we meet up later he's going to be invested as the new secretary and web site co-ordinator.

In fact you are now chairman, Ron.

I wish the local specimen groups would return. The national one species groups are great but you don't get much info on local specimen sizes etc that a local group would bring.
We also could learn from one another in a more relaxed atmosphere between anglers of different species.
Bring on the Lancashire Specimen Group.

What are we going to call it Bob?

The Rotherham and District Specimen Group?

The Donny and District Specimen Group?

Or The South Yorks Specimen Group which I beleive does exist?

You are right about the politics Bob. The last time I attended a meeting of this kind of group I was told not to bring up the subject of fishing.

Seriously.

For those of you who might not know, I was partly instrumental in starting off the NASG back in 1965 along with people such as Eric Hodson, Eric Taylor, **** Clegg and a few others. And I formed the Northern Specimen Group in 1962.

But these were different times and as Bob says there was very little written about how to catch fish in the magazines then.

A few of us did do a bit however. Names like **** Walker, Pete Stone, Graham Marsden and even me on odd occasions.

As for all round groups we have the NSG/NASG/NASA/SACG/SAA (the specialist big fish movement), one group metamorphosing as both political and climate change dictated. The Group (The Mother) has always been divided into two main segments, Social/Scientific and Political. So lets take a step back here, the old NSHG (the one you founded Ron, was a scientific/social body and of course was the acorn which through Eric Hodson`s ideas, brought together the first National Big fish group, NASG (24th April 1965), NASG was what I term as scientific/social, in that many of the early members had a scientific leaning and a number of members belonged to professional bodies like the BIS, the social side of thing was achieve through the actual coming together of all the groups and the start of the National Conferences

Towards the end of the 70s NASG was due for its first change an in changing reflected the climate of the time, the localised groups were in decline and thus NASA was born, initially with political activation, but mainly progressing the social side of the specialist movement. Towards the end of the eighties concern was shown that NASA was not doing enough for the political side of the sport, so the SACG was born, some ten years on and both interests created natural joining together of both the political arm (SACG) and the social arm (NASA) thus SAA was born. Because of the nature of the climate and the orientation of the amalgamation and most importantly a lack of assistance on the social side of the moment (other factors are involved here also, like the growth of the national single specie groups from the mid-seventies), the SAA like the SACG before it continued with a strong political orientation. Of course they would welcome a regeneration of the social side of the movement, but simply don?t have the man power.


Moving on to Ron?s question; we have National single specie groups prior to NASG of course with the Carp Catchers Club, Barbel Catchers, Tenchfishers and National Anguilla Club. The groups of today however are slightly different, science has changed and knowledge has improved, much more is written and available and more people can now be termed as big fish hunters or pleasure anglers whatever you chose to call them. The single specie groups (The Nationals), act as a point of interest for that particular specie, members on the other hand break up into various groups, those that fish solely for that specie, those that fish for other species as well and ones like me who at times can be a member of a number of single specie groups as interest takes.

Many of the National single specie groups of today provide both education and a social side to those interested in these species; they also support the political organisation by funding bodies like the SAA, while in addition they too are evolving in an ever changing environment.

Some very interesting facts you have listed mate.

Sash,

I have met quite a few anglers in my life who are only interested in one species.

Pike, Carp, Roach, Trout, Eels and Barbel are the species that tend to attract these sorts of anglers.

must admit I`m only inrterested in two species












Fish and women

Bob your being a bit harsh on the scientists and politicos in angling.

Scientists first (and yes I am a scientist) Yes we do have people we pay to do this work it?s the EA, but they don?t always do the job we want and at times their work is at best poor, poorly researched and selective in the information they publish. The EA is an arm of Govt. and therefore prone to political interference and bending to the Govt. of the days will.
Angling needs its own independent scientist sector (most do it for nothing btw) that can read, assess, and question in an informed scientific way such politically interfered with so-call evidence and fact.
It is na?ve to think Govts. and their arms don?t distort the truth in scientific terms, they do and history throughout the last (20th ) century is littered with it.
Bluntly, Govts and their agents lie to the populous if it?s in their interest to do so!

Politicos
Knowing many of the present crop of politicos to suggest they are working to their own agenda is not my observation of the majority of them. They are in the main, working for the greater good of all angling to the best of their ability. If it your view their ability isn?t that good, then get involved put your views on the political stage and change it from within. It?s all too easy to hide behind the keyboard or the Eds control of an angling mag and its bubble, but the real world isn?t like that is it?

i couldn`t have put it better meself jon!
i would find it extremely boring to pursue just one species.a mate of mine knows a bloke who is only interested in big carp.if he "only" catches bream to 14lbs and tench up to 12lbs,he classes it as blanking as he didn`t catch a carp!!!!!!!!????? how strange!

Ron, a reincarnation of Ray Webb? Flattery doesn't work on me (unless you happen to be blonde, size 10 and female!!) If I had half that man's drive and natural ability I'd be a happy chappy indeed!

In my own experience a lot of the single species groups are a friendly lot by and large. Our own Somerset levels region of the PAC is a very accommodating example of this, and the craic at the PAC shindig is second to none. Contrast this with the local specimen group, which is known to many as "the masonic lodge" which basically exists only in rumour and hearsay and where character assassination is the order of the day if you happen to be even fishing the same river/drain as another member! I was once accused of following one of the members, because I was fishing the same drain on the same day more than 4 miles away!! I was also once told that the South drain (7+ miles in length) "was so-and-so's water" and he didn't take kindly to others treading on his toes!! All this despite the fact that I have fished this water since I was a kid, and it's virtually on my doorstep, whereas "so-and-so" lives 30 miles away!!

There is secrecy in all aspects of angling, and I don't think single species groups are any more guilty of this than anyone else! Match anglers may just be the worst of the lot in this respect, as understandably anything that can give you the edge over the opposition automatically is translated into cash, and guarded closely for as long as possible.

you once called me spider web once jon,when i was so knackered that i fell asleep with a spider spinning its web between my nose and chin!and you took a pic ya b..../?!"!

one of the funniest things I ever saw mate! How you never swallowed the thing is beyond me!! If I'd done that to a member of the "lodge" I'd have had me camera confiscated, smashed, the film nicked and have been strung up by my knackers from the Blake statue in the middle of Bridgwater!!

Secrecy? Surely not...........

i`ve heard that one of the secret society plonked himself down next to two blokes at the big round place, who had been blanking for a day and a half, and then proceeded to catch 17 greenies!
i haf vays of making them talk!!!

well this member of the not-so-secret society had one tiddler male of about 3lb this morning, despite having a shedload of big tincas tearing up the bottom right in front of me.

JC, when you get any fish ripping up the bottom of the swim it usually means you have attracted too many fish into your swim and the competitive instinct of the fish works against you with very few on the bank as a result. Hemp if introduced in large quantities has this effect as does pellet.
Try cutting back on the feed and try the little and often approach as it sounds like you have a reasonable head of fish and the trick is not to get them too competitive or madness results. The other 'trick' if this happens is to fish on the edge of the feed area and pick up the more cautious bigger ones. Another method that works is to spread small amounts of feed in different areas of the swim and fish each one in rotation only topping up when a fish is caught.

Back to the thread i am a member of various groups of interest to me mainly for the social side and the chance to wind up some of the more serious idiots out there; brilliant sport and almost as good as the fishing itself when one of the 'heavyweights' has a bite. Reeling them in can be really good fun!!!

yeah, that's what I was thinking mate! Too much hemp caused preoccupation, which is why I couldn't buy a bite! I'm gonna try just feeding casters and corn next time I'm up there, probably on wednesday evening..............

wednesday?what are you on holiday jon?