River Carp

Steve Spiller · Jul 11, 2005

Hi guys,
As I've already said I'm targeting river carp this season, with no joy.
Tackle; 15lb mainline, 12lb kryston braid hooklength, size 6 haired.
Hookbait; tiger nuts, pineapple boilies, 14m/m and 21m/m halibuts.
Loose feed and PVA bags; maize, wheat, hemp and same as hookbaits.
I am fishing well known carp swims, but have only caught bream and a surprise barbel.
Last night I fished a very well known swim with no success, carp and bream were rolling everywhere, but wouldn't get their heads down.

What am I doing wrong?

Steve

Les Clark · Jul 11, 2005

Baiting up ?

Steve Spiller · Jul 11, 2005

This should have gone into the carp forum, but it aint working, so I put it in here!

I pre-baited for four days, heavily!

It's doing my nut in! The carp were under my rod tip, almost!

I can understand they might not be used to the hookbaits, but the pre-baiting should have encouraged a run, I would have thought?

Les Clark · Jul 12, 2005

D.B. I had some of that last week ,carp jumping all night ,but not having it ,no reason ?

Steve Spiller · Jul 12, 2005

Spawning? maybe? but I think and hope their done with all that, hopefully!

Steaker - The Fat One · Jul 12, 2005

When I used to have difficulty on a river and the fish appeared lively, especially after a rise.
I used to freeline an unequal wishbone of two hairs, one at 12" and the other at 18" Spread at the end of the mainline using clear silicone tube and locked off with a swivel. (don't use braid for the hooklengths)
Just before the rig reached where I knew the fish to be I would drop a backlead down the mainline and fish through it.
I would then drop small quantities of my chosen hookbait, say pellets,corn,nuts,maggots etc. into the current.
As the bait rolled towards the fish I would ease the wishbone rig further down and the hookbaits moved in much the same way as the freebies.
I have seen patroling fish go from cruise to actively seeking the bait because it is moving.
Although not carp specific, I have had mixed bags where previously I had struggled.
There's more guess-work involved in coloured water and it can be snaggy through patches of weed.

Steve Spiller · Jul 12, 2005

Hi Gary, good advise cheers.

The water is coloured and 6 to 13 foot deep, so no visual sighting is possible, apart from when the Friggers are rolling or basking in the margins.

The carp don't get targeted by many anglers, they are usually hooked and lost by match and pleasure anglers. I think the problem has to be the lack of familiarity with my hookbaits. So I'm gonna do another pre-baiting stint (start Monday, fish Friday)

Paul H · Jul 12, 2005

Maybe the simple answer is a more 'natural' bait?

Lob worm or a big bunch of juicy maggots on a 'medusa' type set up to discourage roach etc...

If the match guys are hooking them then I would assume maggot is on their menu.

Chub King · Jul 12, 2005

DB, we've been having simi8lar problems on the Nene. I think we may have been baiting too heavily. The fish probably stay there most of the summer so why bait is my thinking. When we fill it in I'm convinced that big shoals of bream are keeping the carp out, after all there aren't all that many carp in the stretch. I'm convinced that bread might be the best bet, or bunches of lobs (but watch out for snigs!). Stret-pegged breadflake or crust or legered white chocolates on a chod rig with a little mashed bread for bait? Just something to try....

Herr General Swordsy · Jul 12, 2005

Totally agree with chub king. Most of my Trent fish are caught on bread but don't tell anyone because bread aint in fashion and everyone will laugh at me!

Steve Spiller · Jul 12, 2005

Paul I've been thinking that too, BUT, we've got some huge "Grinners" (have you ever looked at an eel, eye to eye? their grinning at you!) that love worms and maggots! I try to avoid them nowadays!

CK, the stretch I am targeting has a large head of bream and carp. Your lot blew my cover in a "prime river carp venue to target on the Bristol Avon" pre-season, I couldn't believe it, as I was pre-baitng at the time, haha never mind.

My dad was chatting to a guy who lost what he estimated was a 25lb carp, whilst bream fishing on the feeder! Groundbait! Hmmm?
I think the bread theory has to be put into practise.

What is a "chod rig"?

Lee I must appologise, you told me to try bread but I haven't yet, that will change on Friday week. But do I pre-bait? I'm not sure now!

Thanks guys

Steve

Deecy · Jul 13, 2005

The only thing you are lacking is a bit of faith.You don't seem to be doing much wrong.Keep on trying and they will come.Worst thing you can do is chop and change things now.
Bear in mind though that if the match anglers are catching they wil be feeding little and often as they fish and not over a great big bed of bait.
This is the challenge of river Carping, crafty blighters.
Chod rig (aka silt rig), short hook link fished helicopter style which allows the hooklink to travel up and down the mainline depending on the depth of any silt or other detritus on the bottom.Used to be called a silt rig and possibly before that was used to beat heavy bottom weed.Claimed as invented by several including Kevin Nash , Frank Warwick and almost every magazine article writer.

Chub King · Jul 13, 2005

Chods are great for winter carping as they're essentially a pop-up mounted D-rig style on a short (2inch) hooklink. The hooklink is tied to a ring swivel that runs up and down a 1m long leadcore leader helicopter-style. Stop it with beads and short pieces of tight-fitting rubber rig tubing (just check it all pulls apart, is safe and won't tether fish).
Good thing about it is that wherever it lands it tends to fish (unless you chuck it into an unknown snag!). White chocolate pop-ups are great over bread mash. Can get runs within seconds of casting, especially from rogue chevins, but also carp!

Chub King · Jul 13, 2005

Oh. And sorry if we blew your stretch in the paper! Hopefully the rush has tailed off now and you can resume your fishing in relative peace. The people who write Where To Fish are always putting my favourite stretches in too. Par for the course I'm afraid.

Steve Spiller · Jul 13, 2005

Haha no probs Greg, I couldn't believe it!
It's no secret, Jackie Whites stretch of the Bristol Avon.

Thanks for the advice Greg and Deecy. When you think your fishing well, you've done all the preparation, there's fish in the swim and no joy, you start to have doubts.
It is a challenge, I can see it turning into an obsession. I knew it wasn't going to be easy, I've just got to stay with it and find the bait they want, when, or if I do, it will be well worth it!
The last thing I want to do is start chopping and changing, but I will give the white chocs ago and the bread.

Cheers guys

Steve

sash · Jul 13, 2005

It certainly isn't now DB!

Steve Spiller · Jul 13, 2005

;-)

I never could keep a secret.

sash · Jul 13, 2005

It is a valid point though mate, there are a lot of lurkers on internet sites waiting to pounce on other anglers' fishing.

By all means, name the river, but I'd keep the stretch to myself unless of course it is highly private and patrolled with gun toting baliffs all year 'round. ;o)

Steve Spiller · Jul 13, 2005

Good point!

Did I say Bristol Avon?

Prat! I meant Johns Weir Hampshire Avon

Paul H · Jul 13, 2005

I have limited funds to spend on things like leadcore etc...

My chod rigs, which have been succesful on several occasions have involved a length of 15lb maxima approx 1 metre long covered in sink rig tubing. At one end I attach a swivel to fix to my mainline (20lb braid) and at the other a swivel clip to attach leads or a method feeder. Onto the tubing covered line I thread on first an esp rubber bead (which grips the tubing but will easily slide off in the event of being broken off). Then a short (2inch max) hooklength of 10lb flourocarbon with a hair, this is on a ring swivel to give easy movement on the sink tubing. Lastly another esp bead, the amount of movement of the hooklength on the cast can be adjusted by moving the beads.

This, to me, is a very safe version of the chod rig as the hooklength should break first however if the maxima breaks then all the tubing and beads etc... will slide freely off releasing the hooklink leaving the fish with minimal debris attached.

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