Southern Specimens
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jason fisher
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the point being from dorset to hampshire is a couple of miles and there you certainly can catch many nationally notable specimens, where within a few miles of yorkshire are you going to achieve this. i certainly cant think of anywhere at the moment other than the trent which is a good hours travel at least.
J
jason fisher
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with tench it took me less than 3 hours to catch my first hampshire 6lb fish from a pond in the middle of the new forrest. ive only seen 1 6lb+ tench in yorkshire in 20 odd years.
N
Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA)
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I think it depends on what species you are after to be honest. There are some truly big Yorkshire Chub for example which would rival some of Throops finest but few if any anglers seriously target them. What you have to remember about Throop is that there are not numerous big chub but a limited number in a fairly short strech of river which are targeted by top anglers day in day out.Its hardly surprising they are caught in numbers.
Its fair to say however that Chub would be one of the few fish which you could compete for a place in the record books if you confined yourself to Yorkshire.
The point has been made on here before, by Ron in particular, that if you judge your own fish by the standards you see in the press you are on a hiding for nothing.Set yourself realistic targets achievable from your local waters taking into account the time you have to fish and be proud when you achieve them.A 10lb Yorkshire Barbel may be half the size of the Traveller but how much more satisfying a capture it would be.I fished for years to achieve that goal only to reach it funnily enough when I had moved down south and had a one off session on the Swale.I have fished the Avon and Stour many times in the past for Barbel and never had a double! Its all relative.
Its fair to say however that Chub would be one of the few fish which you could compete for a place in the record books if you confined yourself to Yorkshire.
The point has been made on here before, by Ron in particular, that if you judge your own fish by the standards you see in the press you are on a hiding for nothing.Set yourself realistic targets achievable from your local waters taking into account the time you have to fish and be proud when you achieve them.A 10lb Yorkshire Barbel may be half the size of the Traveller but how much more satisfying a capture it would be.I fished for years to achieve that goal only to reach it funnily enough when I had moved down south and had a one off session on the Swale.I have fished the Avon and Stour many times in the past for Barbel and never had a double! Its all relative.
C
Chub King
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A specimen is a big fish in that water, be it a lake or a river. If you can catch the biggest fish in your water you're as good a specimen angler as those who fill the pages of the country's angling publications.
Tench are confined to certain latitudes, you don't find many big ones in Yorkshire and even less in Scotland.
My own experience of tench suggests that some waters regularly do whackers but any hard water lake with good eutrophication and lots of big sub-aquatic plants could do a really big fish. I have seen tench in waters around Peterborough that I know are ridiculuously hugeg enough to give me the shakes. And these are in un-named, uncontrolled waters where the average fish weigh between 5 and 6lb. Over the last three seasons I've seen a lot of tench in the water abnd a handful have actually scared me they are that much bigger than the average!
So, as long as the pre-requisites are there, I'd say there are far more waters capable of producing doubles than people think.
Tench are confined to certain latitudes, you don't find many big ones in Yorkshire and even less in Scotland.
My own experience of tench suggests that some waters regularly do whackers but any hard water lake with good eutrophication and lots of big sub-aquatic plants could do a really big fish. I have seen tench in waters around Peterborough that I know are ridiculuously hugeg enough to give me the shakes. And these are in un-named, uncontrolled waters where the average fish weigh between 5 and 6lb. Over the last three seasons I've seen a lot of tench in the water abnd a handful have actually scared me they are that much bigger than the average!
So, as long as the pre-requisites are there, I'd say there are far more waters capable of producing doubles than people think.
stuart clough
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OK lets add it up for Dorset
Record potential:
Grayling, Chub (and possibly minnow!)
Nationally significant:
Barbel, roach, dace
Big:
Pike (30+), perch (4+), eels (6+)
Nothing special:
Tench, carp, bream
Doesn't sound so bad, and I know of a lake near Hamworthy with double figure tench.
And just for balance, I used to drive for an hour and a half to get to Yorkshire from the lake district, where, in those days apart from pike and perch there really weren't many coarse fish of any size.
Having lived in Dorset (5 years) and Hampshire (7 years) I would say that Hampshire has the edge, but in my opinion they are both near the top of the big fish per squre mile league, and having grown up in the North I agree that, in general, you have to travel further if you want to catch a specimen.
Record potential:
Grayling, Chub (and possibly minnow!)
Nationally significant:
Barbel, roach, dace
Big:
Pike (30+), perch (4+), eels (6+)
Nothing special:
Tench, carp, bream
Doesn't sound so bad, and I know of a lake near Hamworthy with double figure tench.
And just for balance, I used to drive for an hour and a half to get to Yorkshire from the lake district, where, in those days apart from pike and perch there really weren't many coarse fish of any size.
Having lived in Dorset (5 years) and Hampshire (7 years) I would say that Hampshire has the edge, but in my opinion they are both near the top of the big fish per squre mile league, and having grown up in the North I agree that, in general, you have to travel further if you want to catch a specimen.
Well I live on the borders of Oxfordshire, Northamptonshire and Buckinghamshire.
So I guess that there are plenty of potential records in my area, but I haven't come close to any of them.
And I don't care, I always enjoy every fish I catch and although it is nice to beat a personnel record as long as I don't blank then I'm happy.
Leave others to do the record chasing and enjoy whats available to you, are you really that desparate to have your mug in a weekly / monthly rag?
So I guess that there are plenty of potential records in my area, but I haven't come close to any of them.
And I don't care, I always enjoy every fish I catch and although it is nice to beat a personnel record as long as I don't blank then I'm happy.
Leave others to do the record chasing and enjoy whats available to you, are you really that desparate to have your mug in a weekly / monthly rag?
B
BLAM
Guest
Beer is nicer oop north but the girls wear too much makeup oop north but the fish are smaller oop north but houses cost less oop north but temperatures are colder oop north but people are friendlier oop north but ron lives oop north....
What nonsense. Catch the fish in front of you and be happy you're out on the bank.
What nonsense. Catch the fish in front of you and be happy you're out on the bank.
Fishing Gimp
Active member
I will make no bones about it, I live in the south but lived in Scorton Lancs for many many years so can see the arguments from both sides, instantly making myself a target from both sides. However, surely everyone can see the sense of setting personal achievable targets(even those denizens of yorkshire). Despite having caught fish exceeding the following, the targets I use as a yardstick of a specimen (if I catch one over that weight I 've had a good day):
Roach 1lb
Chub 4lb
Barbel 8lb
Tench 5lb
Carp 20lb
Grayling 1lb 8oz
Trout(river) 2lb
Trout (still) 4lb
Perch 1lb 8oz
Salmon (Any)
Dace (any)
Pike 10lb (I only spin or Plug for Pike)
Eel 3lb
Bass 5lb
Mullet 3lb
Most of these target weights can be achieved virtually anywhere in England and to say that I 'm happy to catch any fish on or over the above makes me a happy man; surely that is the reason we go fishing in the first place or do you out there in internet world know different?
Roach 1lb
Chub 4lb
Barbel 8lb
Tench 5lb
Carp 20lb
Grayling 1lb 8oz
Trout(river) 2lb
Trout (still) 4lb
Perch 1lb 8oz
Salmon (Any)
Dace (any)
Pike 10lb (I only spin or Plug for Pike)
Eel 3lb
Bass 5lb
Mullet 3lb
Most of these target weights can be achieved virtually anywhere in England and to say that I 'm happy to catch any fish on or over the above makes me a happy man; surely that is the reason we go fishing in the first place or do you out there in internet world know different?
B
BLAM
Guest
Look on the bright side. At least you don't get bothered by too many East Europeans up north since the fish are rarely big enough for the pot.
Graham Whatmore
Senior Member
I think Mark puts this "south is better than up north" into some sort of perspective. Its brought up time and time again on here and casual readers might be mislead into thinking that you only have to fish in the south (of where?) and you are guaranteed to catch a specimen of anything you like. Bloody rubbish, most fishermen never catch a specimen anything and thats a fact.
I am not a dedicated big fish angler and any fish I catch that is bigger than what I've caught before is, to me, a specimen and that would apply wherever I fish.
I am not a dedicated big fish angler and any fish I catch that is bigger than what I've caught before is, to me, a specimen and that would apply wherever I fish.
Matt Brown
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Mark, I think confining oneself to named borders isn't thr right approach. Surely if you are to measure what fish you have locally you have to look a radius by mileage or travel time. You have some cracking waters available to you.
Generally, it's true that on average there are bigger fish in the South. If you want to complie the stats just map all the catches from one weeks Angling Times.
It's not really a North / South thing. Well not exactly. It's just that most areas South and East of the Midlands, excluding much or Wessex have a much higher average size of fish.
I think it's true that some people wrongly think they can turn up to a known big fish venue and catch.
I've had enough good anglers tell me how hard Throop is, for instance, and I expect I'll fall flat on my face when I eventually get round to fishing there.
But you've got to be in it to win it and it doesn't matter how good an angler you are, or how much time you put in. You can't catch what's not there.
ps. Yorkshire is a big place and it's 70 miles North for me to fish the Swale and have a reasonable chance of a big Yorkshire Chub or Barbel. You have quite a few waters within 70 miles of you - the Kennet valley for instance!
pps. I'd like to think big Perch are all over the place and that anglers as a whole don't target them in the right way.
Generally, it's true that on average there are bigger fish in the South. If you want to complie the stats just map all the catches from one weeks Angling Times.
It's not really a North / South thing. Well not exactly. It's just that most areas South and East of the Midlands, excluding much or Wessex have a much higher average size of fish.
I think it's true that some people wrongly think they can turn up to a known big fish venue and catch.
I've had enough good anglers tell me how hard Throop is, for instance, and I expect I'll fall flat on my face when I eventually get round to fishing there.
But you've got to be in it to win it and it doesn't matter how good an angler you are, or how much time you put in. You can't catch what's not there.
ps. Yorkshire is a big place and it's 70 miles North for me to fish the Swale and have a reasonable chance of a big Yorkshire Chub or Barbel. You have quite a few waters within 70 miles of you - the Kennet valley for instance!
pps. I'd like to think big Perch are all over the place and that anglers as a whole don't target them in the right way.
R
Ron 'The Hat' Clay
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When I go fishing these days I do tend to target what I call "mature" or "grown up" fish. Personally I soon get bored with catching small fish one after the other.
Take roach for example. You can fish for lots of roach, many of which will be small, or you can use methods that will tend to target the bigger roach, like fishing a bait like bread or caster on the deck into evening.
You might have to spend a bit of time waiting but often it's worth it.
When I fish the Idle for example my target weight is a 1 1/2 lbs fish. I've often sat for hours catching virtually nothing whilst other anglers have been getting a bite a chuck. But I've had a fair number of 1 1/2 lbs roach over the past two winters.
And lets' be honest, Where can you go In England today that will give you the chance of a 1 lb river roach?
Take roach for example. You can fish for lots of roach, many of which will be small, or you can use methods that will tend to target the bigger roach, like fishing a bait like bread or caster on the deck into evening.
You might have to spend a bit of time waiting but often it's worth it.
When I fish the Idle for example my target weight is a 1 1/2 lbs fish. I've often sat for hours catching virtually nothing whilst other anglers have been getting a bite a chuck. But I've had a fair number of 1 1/2 lbs roach over the past two winters.
And lets' be honest, Where can you go In England today that will give you the chance of a 1 lb river roach?
Matt Brown
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Ooops. There's loads of commas, apostrophes missing from that last post.
Matt Brown
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I was refering to my last post, not Ron's!
Fishing Gimp
Active member
A river Roach of over 1lb is a creature to be cherished and their location kept to oneself as it does not take long for them to be plundered by the 'time' angler(?).
Ron is right when he states that the better stamp of Roach come to bread in low light levels but you won't get many; however if you do get a few over the 1lb in a session the pleasure stays for a long time.
One of the best Roach men I' ve ever come across said that 'if you want a big Roach then fish for them like you would chub!' By that he meant use a biggish hook (size 10 or 12) with a decent sized bit of flake or crust presented in the crease and still on the deck. Over the years this advice has proved to be spot on.
Ron is right when he states that the better stamp of Roach come to bread in low light levels but you won't get many; however if you do get a few over the 1lb in a session the pleasure stays for a long time.
One of the best Roach men I' ve ever come across said that 'if you want a big Roach then fish for them like you would chub!' By that he meant use a biggish hook (size 10 or 12) with a decent sized bit of flake or crust presented in the crease and still on the deck. Over the years this advice has proved to be spot on.
Graham Whatmore
Senior Member
"And lets' be honest, Where can you go In England today that will give you the chance of a 1 lb river roach?"
Loads of rivers Ron, Severn, Warks Avon, Bristol Avon, Wye and thats just my area. What you don't take into consideration is that most anglers don't fish for them these days.
Loads of rivers Ron, Severn, Warks Avon, Bristol Avon, Wye and thats just my area. What you don't take into consideration is that most anglers don't fish for them these days.
stuart clough
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"And lets' be honest, Where can you go In England today that will give you the chance of a 1 lb river roach?"
These river systems all give a realistic chance of a 2 lb roach:
Frome, Piddle, Stour, Avon, Test, Itchen, Kennet.
These river systems all give a realistic chance of a 2 lb roach:
Frome, Piddle, Stour, Avon, Test, Itchen, Kennet.
Bob Roberts
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You little tinker Wintle!
I hate to be picky over tiny little details but since when has the Trent been in Yorkshire?
And just for the record the Idle that Ron talks glowingly of is in Nottinghamshire.
I don't know if you actually read the article you are quoting but the theme was that you should make the most of the fishing in the area you live and adjust your sights accordingly. It was not a North versus South critique.
Geographically Dorset is but a grain of sand when compared with the mighty Yorkshire. Take the acreage of Yorkshire and plant it over Dorset and the surrounding counties. Then tell us how bad the fishing available to you is within that locale.
To draw fair comparisons you must compare like with like, apples with apples. Oh, and I didn't spot a mention of the grayling in your argument. Nor crucian carp.
Or are you just being selective?
Tell you what, here's a challenge. Why not give me a list of the coarse species that you would expect to find bigger specimens of in Yorkshire than in Dorset alone. And maybe give a double star to those that would still remain if you drew a circle with a 60-mile radius from the centre of Dorset.
Methinks you out to make maketh much mischief sir!
I hate to be picky over tiny little details but since when has the Trent been in Yorkshire?
And just for the record the Idle that Ron talks glowingly of is in Nottinghamshire.
I don't know if you actually read the article you are quoting but the theme was that you should make the most of the fishing in the area you live and adjust your sights accordingly. It was not a North versus South critique.
Geographically Dorset is but a grain of sand when compared with the mighty Yorkshire. Take the acreage of Yorkshire and plant it over Dorset and the surrounding counties. Then tell us how bad the fishing available to you is within that locale.
To draw fair comparisons you must compare like with like, apples with apples. Oh, and I didn't spot a mention of the grayling in your argument. Nor crucian carp.
Or are you just being selective?
Tell you what, here's a challenge. Why not give me a list of the coarse species that you would expect to find bigger specimens of in Yorkshire than in Dorset alone. And maybe give a double star to those that would still remain if you drew a circle with a 60-mile radius from the centre of Dorset.
Methinks you out to make maketh much mischief sir!
Merv Harrison
Senior Member
Club water's East Yorkshire, part of specimen list,
Bream......12lb 10oz
Roach.......3lb .4oz
Tench.......8lb 12oz
Carp.......42lb .8oz
Crucian.....2lb 10oz
All caught within a 3 mile radius.
And just one more for Monk, Sturgeon 26lb, although I believe it was caught a couple of months ago at a greater weight by a Carp angler, on a boilie.
I do not wish to open a 'new can of worm's', but do we in the North, not just Yorkshire, tend to confine any 'triumph's' to a few chosen friend's, which by it's very nature distort's some of the list's.
Bream......12lb 10oz
Roach.......3lb .4oz
Tench.......8lb 12oz
Carp.......42lb .8oz
Crucian.....2lb 10oz
All caught within a 3 mile radius.
And just one more for Monk, Sturgeon 26lb, although I believe it was caught a couple of months ago at a greater weight by a Carp angler, on a boilie.
I do not wish to open a 'new can of worm's', but do we in the North, not just Yorkshire, tend to confine any 'triumph's' to a few chosen friend's, which by it's very nature distort's some of the list's.