I've just seen the little bit of a blurb on the new Korum Neoteric(?) rod and was interested to note that the second tip is rated at 2.2lb which is quite a refreshing change as for some reason unless you buy barbel floodwater rods it seems difficult to get general allround specialist rods now in this sort of range. I believe that up untill the last 5 or so years the most popular rod rating was about 2.25lb for carp fishing with 10lb line being about the norm. Can anyone shed some light for me on why we have stepped up to a point where the average carp rod is 2.75 to 3lb and the lower test curves aren't even available? Are rods of this power and the lines that match them really necessary? I fish a pit that contains carp well into the 30's but also has some fantastic tench and bream so I tend to fish with methods that allow me to keep my options open and I was looking to but some 2 or 2.25lb rods so I can get full enjoyment from catching the "nuisances" these would be matched with 8 - 10lb line which I'm fairly confident I could land most things on but am I being delusional and will I actually be wasting my money. I've landed carp to 25lb on 2.5lb rods before and mid doubles on 1.25 avon rods with 6lb line and never once felt out of control so is the modern "tow rope and a broom handle" approach really necessary?
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The stepping up of kit over the years......
- Thread starter ByNasty
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B
BLAM
Guest
Nope, but the need to conform and consume usually over-rides common sense. Without new rod making materials on the market manufacturers must keep changing specs of existing products or they will eventually go out of business. How interested would you be in buying another 1.5lb test curve rod if the one you already had wasn't broken? Yes fish are bigger on average these days and yes carbon rods are better than they were but its necessary to keep you on an upgrade cycle or companies will ultimately fold (assuming the overall numbers of people fishing are static).
E
EC
Guest
Could it be that carp rods are being asked to cast heavier weights now with method feeders, pva bags, stockings and the like?
I must admit I'm as much of a sucker as the next man for wanting shiny new kit even though I know it's ridiculous! I'm even cutting down on reading magazines because I end up wanting to buy stuff! Didn't Chris Yates land his record on a split cane avon?
Any of you older boys out there willing to let us know what kit, bait and the like you were using 10 or 20 years ago compared to what you are using now? Might make for some interesting reading.
Any of you older boys out there willing to let us know what kit, bait and the like you were using 10 or 20 years ago compared to what you are using now? Might make for some interesting reading.
Fair point Eddie, but do people really need to be using heavy rods if they aren't using heavy leads? I rarely fish any bigger than 1.5oz leads with small bags and nearly all my runs are screamers so are big leads really that necessary? If you pull your finger onto a hook with even an ounce of weight hanging off it it goes pretty bloody deep! After that a firm lift into the fish and played on a tight line seems to be enough to drive the hook right home.
Don't get me wrong I'm not knocking people that use heavy kit, each to their own I say, but it strikes me as odd that there doesn't seem to be much of a compromise for people that want to fish differently.
Also why does someone fishing somewhere like Makins really need 2.75lb rods, big pit reels 12lb line etc, as I've seen stated in some of the media?
Don't get me wrong I'm not knocking people that use heavy kit, each to their own I say, but it strikes me as odd that there doesn't seem to be much of a compromise for people that want to fish differently.
Also why does someone fishing somewhere like Makins really need 2.75lb rods, big pit reels 12lb line etc, as I've seen stated in some of the media?
Lee Sambrooks
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I tend to agree that most people are taken in by the blurb they read in the mags.
However, I do feel rods should be adequate to land the target fish effectively and efficiently, and for this reason my tend to be on the heavy side - tc wise.
The average sized carp in this country now has grown to quite high proportions, and I believe rods made now reflect this.
Another consideration is the quality of the carbon blank these rods are manufactured from these days; they are now super-slim and 'feel' so much better than the 'broom handles' of testeryear of equivalent tc.
However, I do feel rods should be adequate to land the target fish effectively and efficiently, and for this reason my tend to be on the heavy side - tc wise.
The average sized carp in this country now has grown to quite high proportions, and I believe rods made now reflect this.
Another consideration is the quality of the carbon blank these rods are manufactured from these days; they are now super-slim and 'feel' so much better than the 'broom handles' of testeryear of equivalent tc.
E
EC
Guest
Might be the old 'mines bigger than yours' adage again mate!
I remember a lad who I knew buying armalites going back 10-15 yr or so, 'They're 2 and three quarters TC' he boasted, strange that we only have ponds round here and fish to mid doubles, but as you say, each to their own!
I remember a lad who I knew buying armalites going back 10-15 yr or so, 'They're 2 and three quarters TC' he boasted, strange that we only have ponds round here and fish to mid doubles, but as you say, each to their own!
It worries me a bit that other areas of fishing seem to be going this way, again I know there is a time and a place for heavy floodwater rods for barbelling but up to 2.5lb t.c.'s? Personally I've taken to bit bashing on my local canal with a 4.5lb test spod rod, a big pit loaded with 30lb braid and 6oz leads!
T
The Monk
Guest
45 years ago I was using built cane, Greeheart, Tank Ariels and Spanish Reed rods, they were crap, 30 year ago I was using glass, compaired by todays standards they were crap too, but the best we had at the time. These days I would only use Carbons, times and technologies change and it pays you to move forward. Chris Yates used a cane rod to enable him to fit into an accentric niche, which to the younger anglers, he did. It certainly didnt give him any advantages over any modern and more efficient gear.
B
BLAM
Guest
"it pays you to move forward". That's the rod for me then...I've always done the oppositie and paid to use it.
LOL! Well done BLAM very witty!
I understand moving forward and using the latest technology Monk, even the basic kit we have now is massively better than some of the stuff that was top drawer in the past but does that mean that the old stuff was underated in strength because they couldn't produce it up to the ratings they can today without excessive cost?
I understand moving forward and using the latest technology Monk, even the basic kit we have now is massively better than some of the stuff that was top drawer in the past but does that mean that the old stuff was underated in strength because they couldn't produce it up to the ratings they can today without excessive cost?
T
The Monk
Guest
Yes, possibly, but you have to judge that for yourself of course. The first Carbon rods to hit the streets were designed for fly fishing and they were very expensive (I`m going back to the mid 70s here), I remember at the time saying, yes but they will not produce a carbon carp rod, no need really because carp rods are static. The only advantage I could see at the time was the weight, but of course we now know carbon has other advantages over glass of course. Now carbons have also improved, from memory didnt we start off with Boron?
T
The Monk
Guest
Interestingly, I remember traiding in my old glass mark 4s for 3 of Jim Gibbinsons Cloopers which had unlined eyes, we later moved on to the T24s
K
Kev Jones 2
Guest
Have test curves of carp rods got higher and why ? Yes they have, I believe. My first "proper" carp rods were 2lb Hutchy Spirolites (circa 1986), and they seemed to be the most popular TC at the time. It seemed all the major carp rod builders were pushing 2lb TC rods as the sort of general purpose, go anywhere rods (for instance Century, NW, Tri-Cast et al ).
Why have the TC,s increased over the last 20 years? Well, as someone wrote earlier in the thread, PVA bags, the Method, the need to fish heavier leads at extreme range in the inland seas, and also I believe that carp waters in general have become a lot weedier now, due possibly to eutrophication.
Having said that, I think that their is a hint of "fashion" in people buying heavier TC rods, and a lot of folks (self included) would be better off still using 2lb or 2 1/4 rods.
Why have the TC,s increased over the last 20 years? Well, as someone wrote earlier in the thread, PVA bags, the Method, the need to fish heavier leads at extreme range in the inland seas, and also I believe that carp waters in general have become a lot weedier now, due possibly to eutrophication.
Having said that, I think that their is a hint of "fashion" in people buying heavier TC rods, and a lot of folks (self included) would be better off still using 2lb or 2 1/4 rods.
T
The Monk
Guest
test curves have gone higher, but its also a funny one because the TC of a glass rod is different from that of a carbon rod, the materials act differently. and yes fashion definately comes into it.
ByNasty, good thread,this one got me thinking back 30 years,my first Carp rods were Bruce & Walker Mk 1V`s 2lb TC (fibreglass of course)paired with Mitchell 300`s.Line was mono,twice as thick as modern line and "real" lead weights.Baits at this time would have been meat, cat food,Kidney beans,potatoes and that real wonder bait Black Magic.Any fish over 20lb would have been classed as a whopper & hardly anyone fished on the surface,how things have changed.
Glad you are enjoying it Ginger. I still class a 20 as I whopper! I do sometimes wonder whether there would be a noticable difference if you could put two anglers on the same relatively low pressure lake, one with modern kit one with old school given that the new kit could outcast, outsnag-fish and use heavier bolt-rigs, modern baits etc.
Wonder what differences there will be in my lifetime.
Wonder what differences there will be in my lifetime.
T
The Monk
Guest
Black Majic Ginger that was weird stuff mate, like tarmac but it worked. I took a few doubles at Cuttle Mill on the stuff in the 70s.
Yes ByNasty a 20 is still a big fish, I spend years trying to catch a 10 pounder, its very difficult trying to keep things in prespective once you start fishing the foreign waters, but a fish is only as good as the water it comes from and at the end of the day its all about please and not size (now were have i heard that before)?.
Yes ByNasty a 20 is still a big fish, I spend years trying to catch a 10 pounder, its very difficult trying to keep things in prespective once you start fishing the foreign waters, but a fish is only as good as the water it comes from and at the end of the day its all about please and not size (now were have i heard that before)?.
S
Sage
Guest
I still use 2.25lb t/c rods for most of my fishing. 20's are no problem on these rods, and for close range fishing I don't see the pont in using anything more powerful. Years ago I used 1.75lb North Western rods...so I guess I have "upped" my rods as well.
R
Robert Woods 1
Guest
My first carp rods were Northwestern glass AC6's 1.75tc. Used Mitchell 410's and Au Lion Dur' 1534 hooks.