The same ol' same oh!

I 've been around the block a few times and over the years have noticed that the vitriolic arguments concernig various aspects of Barbel fishing that appear on this site are just like the vitriolic nastiness that used to occur between various self proclaimed primadonas in the late 60's and 70's in the Carp world.

Some of the arguments went on for years with the animosity between individuals (no names, no pack drill) getting to the violent stage more than once. Silly really as all the anglers concerned cared passionately about carp in their different ways. But they had become so blinkered with their animosity they could not see any other point of view apart from the one they were espousing. At meetings it used to be embarassing to witness the silly goings on, so much so I walked away from the scene for a while and went fly fishing. The good news is that now most of the protagonists have either moved on or grown more tolerant with age.

I remember going to one of the inaugural meetings of the Barbel society, the one in the pub at Walton, with a lot of the big names at the time in the specimen world in attendence. And low and behold there was animosity right from the start, not only from the floor but between the newly installed committee.

I had seen this all before; in fact a lot of the arguments were the same old recycled crap from twenty plus years before but applied to a different new 'in species.' I concluded as I drove hurriedly away not to get involved this time.

My question is how much longer can this vitriol between Barbel anglers carry on or will it eventaully dry up, as it did in the Carp world as the protagonists age and become more tolerant of anothers valid argument. Let's hope so. Or will the circus move on to the next new 'in species.'

It would seem we have learned very little about presenting a united front to more serious opposition over the years!

Doug,

I think your last paragraph and line sum up for me where I think we should all be looking.

We live in hope that some can look further than their noses for the benefit of all and the sport we love.

We may be the largest participation sport but until we all realise we are in this together and direct a unified front we will continue fight ourselves and achieve nothing.

I just hope that the grandchildren I now teach do not look back, critcise and think if only.

Keith

Out of curiousity what was the animosity at this first B.S. meeting about?

You only have to read other threads on this site Mark (what's with this name change thing is someone after you?) to realise that there is always going to be one group of anglers who are quite willing to SH*t on everyone else. The Warrington A.A. thing is one example and there are plenty of others. Control of waters makes you god in this game and this is particularly so where good quality fishing is a rare comodity. I can quite easily see how someone who has lost the right to fish on a venue which perhaps he/she has INVESTED IN for half their life, cannot justify just letting it go without comment.
I quite admire anyone who is going to stand up for themselves. I'm not talking about silly egotistical issues here but real issues that effect peoples fishing lives..
If we were to just give up on such in house issues are we to just sit back and wait for all our rivers to be polluted and straightened, for other watersports and nature groups to take over all our venues without so much as comment! Thats what it amounts to. There are times, when all political means have been exhasted that its not such a bad thing to kick the sh*t up!

Good post Mr Gimp, as Tim points out 'silly egotistical issues' are often mainly to fault.

Can you expand on that Eddie?

Yes, I think its fair to say that in angling, like other aspects of life, groups and individuals are often looking out purely for themselves and their own interests!

Sorry mate I wasn't with you first time around.

No worries Bazza!

I don't think its neccesarily so that just because something is of personal value that its silly or egotistical, you seem to have misinterpreted me Eddie.
After all we all put ourselves to the fore in one way or another.
In some cases whats good for an individual is good for everybody. These problems arise when this personal gain comes at a cost to others who perhaps deserve otherwise.
What I meant by egotistical issues was that some anglers just clash, their personalities are such that they simply cannot agree regardless of the issue.

The Ref for most Old Trafford games usually sees things differently to the away crowd but who is right?

Tim, sorry mate, no deliberate misrepresentation intended, I didnt read your original post correctly and quoted 'silly egotistical issues' out of context!

I do think the individual clashes of personality can however, lead to an almost pig headed unwillingness for some parties to ever co-operate! This can become personal and will, if those parties have any kind of political sway, affect others. Thats not just the case in angling but life generally.

People love to belong to groups, it comes from our tribal heritage I suppose, but many frequently stand up and defend their 'tribe's' position without considering the wider picture.

The level of blind following shown by some is little short of paranoia!

And its amazing that the ones that state "it's not about ego's" are often the ones most driven by their own egotistical nature.

I for one am completely fed up with angling politics, hypocrisy and name calling. This season I am going to spend my time catching lots of fish of different species and the back biters and wannabe heroes of the specialist world can go and .............. do what they like.

By the way Fishing Gimp, yer logo's broke. Spurs have got a new cock now haven't they?

Dave you are correct about the logo but I prefer the old one, just as I prefer me old rods and reels rather than the new ones; does this mean I'm getting old?

Tim nice to hear from you again winkle. Yes the points you raise are valid and to be honest I was not criticising those that stand up for important issues. No the wallies I'm having a tilt at are the ones who just shout at each other at meetings trying to get meaningless points off one another or the bullies who shout everyone with an opposing view down. You know the type Tim as you were a victim of one such character at a NASA do some years ago. If you remember this character tried to intimidate you by stubbing cigarettes out on his tongue and threatening you in no uncertain terms. What perhaps you don't know, is that I had a quiet word with the gentlemen concerned and that silliness stopped. Everyone has the right to their own opinion and should be given a fair hearing from others because after all most of us have a vested interest in the good of fishing.

Two examples above. Dave is correct, the nature of the beast we are where we become tribal. This can bee seen in the football teams we support and how some can get quite of hand when they hear criticism from other supporters about their team.

Not only that, but Doug here too is steadfastly against changing his logo to a new one approved by the team, apparently. This can turn to digging in your heals and refusing to budge. This too leads to aggression and that also happens in angling of all kinds.

Message and lesson for today is - be flexible and accept everyone and everything new.




Just don't involve me!

Woody I am not being aggressive about my logo it is just simply I prefer the old one, I believe freedom of choice is still allowed, and secondly I can't change it!

Thirdly how flexible should I be as at my age it is becoming increasingly difficult to be so. Plus I will not bend over backwards to please people because I've heard Baz is trying to widen the circle of his friends; with his BA logo what else could I possibly mean.

However, should we panic when he says 'give me a ring sometime'

Oh good another row on the Barbel threads.

I thought we were discussing wether Marks cock has been replaced!

No row going on here is there?

Dear All,

Out there in fishing land there is undoubtedly a lot of people going fishing. 3 million so they say and its probably higher than that. But all this so called back bitting egotistical not playing the game "our" way tripe is, if it really exists anyway, within the realms of a tiny minority within the whole angling congregation. 99% of our nations anglers just go fishing and thats always been enough for them.

Its only total idiots like us that actually talk about such utter codswallop.

Regards,

Lee.