Should Treble Hooks Be Banned?

Almost a year ago Bury Hill Fisheries banned the use of treble hooks
Bury Hill fisheries have now banned treble hooks | Coarse Fisheries News | Angling Times | Gofishing UK
To me this in an interesting topic of discussion for the following reasons:
During the late 60’s and the 70’s (until Marlow Weir was removed from the Thames Weir Ticket Permit) a few of us used to regularly fish there for all the usual species – including pike. We used a method that was completely different to Alfred Jardine’s Snap-Tackle (Oops, sorry Alfie) method. We made our own traces incorporating one single hook, this was used in conjunction with a rolling ledger, with the live bait lip hooked. Once dropped into the water, literally beneath your feet, you could almost guarantee a ‘bite’ as soon as the ledger hit the bottom. The difference to traditional methods where you let the fish ‘run’ was that you struck immediately and the fish was always hooked in the ‘scissors’. Because the pike fishing was so good there we never tried it on other waters so I cannot comment personally and since the Weir disappeared from the ticket I have, apart from a few lure sessions, restricted my colder weather fishing to most of the usual suspects apart from pike.
I believe that treble hooks were still used for carp fishing up to **** Walker’s time and are still in common use in other countries today, particularly the USA.

I don't think they should be banned however on some fishing lures i dont see the need for having over two treble hooks there really is no benifit in it and can be tricky unhooking them

i think we have shot ourselves in the foot enough in the past with bans, lead shot,livebait bans, if a fishery wants to bring in bans on their own waters thats fine you always have the option of not fishing there.

I completely understand a commercial fishery especially banning trebles, I would probably do the same myself if it was my stock, but I wouldn't support it if it were to be suggested as a law.

They are banned in Australia, I don't know of anywhere else though.

I fished Bury Hill last winter for the zander. I never lost a fish on single hooks and never felt even remotely disadvantaged.Much improved presentation IMO too and though I accept zander are not pike I had a few pike too. Dead easy to unhook too.

I'm not a fan of bans but I can understand why OBH brought this in & it doesn't seem to have affected catches at all...but I'm sure its lead to a few more fish surviving that might have been badly hooked on trebles. One thing that struck me was the noddiness of some anglers [only a few] who were predator fishing. To me they represented a far greater potential risk to the fish than treble hooks properly used by a competent angler.

If you are not properly equipped and/or cannot handle a fish safely then you really shouldn't be fishing for them.

S-Kippy said:

If you are not properly equipped and/or cannot handle a fish safely then you really shouldn't be fishing for them.

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That's an oft quoted point and easy to agree with - but we all have to gain experience. It don't just arrive out the blue. The best thing is to be a 'busybody' and help those out who are obviously learners, wether they want it or not.

geoffmaynard said:

That's an oft quoted point and easy to agree with - but we all have to gain experience. It don't just arrive out the blue. The best thing is to be a 'busybody' and help those out who are obviously learners, wether they want it or not.

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Good point Geoff
The problem is that many inexperienced anglers that are out of short pants would be very offended as they appear to think they know it all because they’ve watched a couple of DVDs. I've watched these confrontations develope in the past and they can become nasty. Possibly a better option is to inform the bailiff if their actions are considered dangerous to fish or other anglers.
It’s a shame that there are not more set ups, such as Marsh Farm, where youngsters may attend the fishery and get shed loads of advice on coarse fishing techniques and put it into practice under the supervision of experienced anglers. Yes, we know the reason, ‘elf and safety, red tape, cost, criminal record checks etc. Surely there must be another way?

Interesting....and a very good point. I've been fishing since I was 10 but I'd never seriously predator fished until last winter. In that respect I was a complete novice so far as predators were concerned but not a novice angler. I read up loads,asked,listened,bought the right gear and as a consequence,inexperienced or not I never had a problem. I was quite proud of the fact that I not only did my homework well enough to catch but that having caught I was capable of dealing with the fish confidently.

What bothered me a bit was watching far more experienced predator anglers than I behaving in a way that genuinely shocked and surprised me. My point ? It doesn't necessarily follow that experienced anglers are good anglers and that may not be obvious to a novice. OBH sets cetain requirements before you can predator fish...laudable...but just because Mr Allthegear has all the gear doesn't mean he knows how to use it.

BB is right. There is [I think] a certain responsibility to intervene if someone is struggling or being an idiot but how often do we ? There are very few Mr Crabtrees left out there.

And its not just predator fishing either. Dont get me started on the antics of some [some I said before anyone starts] so called "anglers".

S-Kippy said:

BB is right.
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You’re a genius S-K
I was having a sort out of my old fishing books the other day and re-discovered The Fisherman’s Bedside Book and some other little gems. Put it to one side, got waylaid, went fishing and forgot all about it...... Until now

barbelboi said:

You’re a genius S-K

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I exist only to serve. Not everyone on here will agree though.

Just because some anglers have been converted to using single hooks does not give the argument weight that treble hooks are unnessesary.

I am extremely critical of any branch of anglers calling for bans of any description - it would be the death of fishing as many seek pleasure in it....... e.g. I remember a letter that appeared in angling times entitled 'barbed hooks - barbaric'. I suspect this was some pole fishing angler fishing a commercial fishery with at least two boards of printed 'bans' (which would appear to be the norm regarding these muddy puddles) - missing the obvious issue that it is crammed to the extent that a battery chicken farm could not operate.......

I agree with S.K. being an experienced angler does not make you a good angler. My advice for anyone fishing for pike as an inexperienced or new angler is to fish with someone who knows what they are doing. learning from others and being open to advice not only benifits the welfare of fish - but your own catch rate may increase.

In what circumstances are treble hooks necessary Christian ? I'm not being cute...I'm genuinely interested as a fledgling predator angler. Chucking a big bait a long way ?

I admit I am not [and never will be] a pike angler.Zander are my thing and as the only zander fishing I have reasonable access to is Bury Hill that means singles...but because this was all new to me I had no "previous" about tackle,bait,rigs,hooks etc. I had an open mind in other words.

I'm not disagreeing...just asking.

there might be a case for using single hooks when fishing with small baits for zander but if you are fishing for pike at range [100 yards plus] i dont think they would be as effective as trebles, more important than using trebles or singles is having good bite registration and paying attention to whats going on, all hooks have the capacity to cause harm to predators if you dont have and do the things mentioned,chav is correct in that if you are inexperienced with predators go with someone who isnt.

The only real advantages/disadvantages I can relate to are:
With three hooks, chances are probably better of hooking a fish on a treble hook. For lobbing out a live bait at distance I would assume trebles have a considerable advantage {i.e. the live bait will generally still be attached after the cast). All my single hook pike fishing was carried out with a live bait literally lowered in front you.
When more than one hook buries in a fish, removing the hook can be difficult. Treble hooks have greater potential to harm fish than single hooks.
There are claims a single hook penetrates better than a treble hook because it is thinner in diameter. Single hooks are also less noticeable to fish.
Hooking fish could be more difficult with single hooks, especially when live bait fishing when the bait covers the hook, making it more difficult to set the hook into a fish.
One other point – would single hooks adversely affect the balance of lures?

S-Kippy said:

In what circumstances are treble hooks necessary Christian ? I'm not being cute...I'm genuinely interested as a fledgling predator angler. Chucking a big bait a long way ?

I admit I am not [and never will be] a pike angler.Zander are my thing and as the only zander fishing I have reasonable access to is Bury Hill that means singles...but because this was all new to me I had no "previous" about tackle,bait,rigs,hooks etc. I had an open mind in other words.

I'm not disagreeing...just asking.

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The honest answer? I have always used them with the exception of single hooks for small lives. Its a confidence thing. the Pikes mouth is hard, bony and a treble hook IMO gives me the confidence that I am twice as likely to 'grapple-hook' a hold. Its a personal perception.

If all I could use were singles and it was successful I would I suppose see no need to use trebles. I used to think I was a good predator angler (read the books, magazine articles, good emphasis on striking early and sensitive bite detection, got out on the bank catching - so all good grounding).....However, i was recently lucky enough to fish with and become good mates with an angler who used to be area rep for Essex PAC - I suppose my approach has been influenced further and this angler rarely uses anything other than treble hooks. My competance increased, I use tackle differently, tie my traces in a more effective way and as a result banked more fish. I am open minded about single hooks - but could never see the justification of banning trebles.

If you consider an in-experienced angler using treble hooks and allowing a pike to engorge the whole lot - obviously treble hooks would cause more damage. But when you see something that is wrong I think there is a responsability to educate. I bet if anglers used single hooks exclusively there would be a tendancy to give the fish more time to 'turn' the bait. occasionally a fish can literally inhale a bait nearly straight away - so any gain in fish welfare could equally be lost.

This is a topic that comes up every year in the letters section of a weekly angling mag. I can only imagine an angler has been 'converted' to singles... great. But then in seeking a ban they wish to impose there enlightenment on the rest of us. Same with live baits 'i caught a lovely big pike on a dead herring last week, if your skilful (lol) live baits are barbaric and un-nessesary...bla bla bla'..............

That's fair enough. As I'm fishing small baits at short/medium range [and can't use trebles anyway] I dont feel a ban affects me at all.But this is a very specific water & situation so it would be wrong of me to generalise. The only slight doubt I have is over hooking...but I am fishing small baits because they seem more effective & logically these get engulfed in one go. I hit pick ups immediately because of this & I do miss a few but I'm not convinced that's because of singles. Might be a factor but I am targetting the zander and they can be notoriously fussy buggers at the best of times.

Changing my trace & end rig did improve my hook up rate...which suggests to me presentation is more important than what hook or hook configuration I'm using.

I might change my view if I try bigger baits which I plan to do next winter.

Its funny really, I'm eel fishing next week and wouldn't dream of using anything other than singles. I should imagine Zander are like eels in that they do not tollerate any resistance or sudden changes in resistance. I used to use drop off indicators for eels but became aware of dropped runs.

I now wrap a piece of foil rubbing into where the line beds into the spool and it kind of grips (so long as it is not too windy) so you can leave the spool free to let the eel 'run' and make a small loop of tin foil to ensure the line brushs against the bush in the bite alarm. there is very little change in resistance and appears to be working for now.

Just a thought S-Kipp, have you thought of using a Polaris waggler float ledger. If you incorporate a 2oz lead and low resistance run ring - dot the float down - thats got to be pretty sensitive. even pop a startlite on the tip for night fishing........

I shall certainly be trying a float...but not like some of the crab pot markers I witnessed last year. By all accounts the OBH zeds are very active in the Autumn and small baits fished under a big pellet waggler can do very well.Some people even use quivertips.

I may even try fishing "the lift" . I see no reason why that shouldn't work either with the bait itself being the trigger. Lots to think about and try...this is why I enjoyed it so much.

I use both singles, doubles and trebles in my predator fishing - all dependent on circumstances, species and bait size / rig.

I do not believe that trebles are unecessary, or that they are in some way inappropriate, outdated or barbaric (not suggesting those views have been expressed here).

Trebles - when used correctly and in an appropriate size - offer the best hooking potential for certain baits and rigs. A large mackeral for, example, ie best mounted on a trace with two trebles matching the size of the bait (or a trace with one single and a treble).

When we catch a fish the hook penetrates the fish's flesh - it makes not one jot of difference whether that hook is a single or a treble - the hook still enters the fish and has to be removed.

The difference comes with the skill and experience of the angler - and in these cases the old saying of 'a bad workman blames his tools' comes to mind.

Now I am not critiscising those who choose to only use singles because they prefer it - that is fair enough, but claiming that trebles are unecessary or dangerous is simply inaccurate.

If you can get the same hook-up rate on singles, why bother with multiples?
Why not quadruple hooks or quintuple hooks : why trebles?
I can see a point to sprung doubles for ease of hook change and to balance a lure but the trend in lures nowadays is surely for large singles; less snagging, more variety in lure manufacture and better ways of making the lure work

I believe that trebles are now banned in Fuerteventura at least, the reason being the growing tendency to use half a bread roll smothered in small trebles to snag a mullet or bream supper.