Are some forms of Fishing dying out

I have recently been doing some research in to River fishing, mainly the Float fishing side of things.

I've read articles on here by Mark Wintle and a few others which i found very informative if not a little confusing at times (my own lack of experience) showing there.

Now i have never trotted a float or anything down a River before, so i thought that when my health problems are sorted out then one day i would very much like to give it a try.

I have ventured on to the Net looking for what i thought might be a suitable Trotting Rod of around 14 or 15 foot, i didn't particularly want one of them rods that have Multi Lenghts 13ft to 15ft for example.

I found it quite difficult to find a good range of Rods to chose from, and this got me to thinking. Is it anglers that are making some forms of fishing seem less desirable or is it the Manufacturers that are making them less desireable.
I suppose when i use the word Desireable i am meaning Popular at the same time.

You can still get plenty of Centre Pin Reels and a very good choice of prices as well, from cheap and cheerful to blimey how much.

I have been coarse fishing for what must be 10+ years (not entirely sure) but to have never trotted a float down a River, why is that ? (that is me thinking out loud) i never had the opportunity to do so and i never knew anyone that could do it anyway.

What else is becoming less popular due to changes in the way fishing wants us to head in ?

steph mckenzie said:

I have been coarse fishing for what must be 10+ years (not entirely sure) but to have never trotted a float down a River,

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I have been fishing for 43 years and I have never trotted a float down a river! I use centre pins alot, but for ledgering.
I think alot of the problem is supply and demand. The vast majority of anglers today fish commercials/lakes. so it stands to reason this would be the market to be in if you want to sell fishing tackle. A 15ft trotting rod is now deemed specialist, which puts the price out of reach of "Joe average" which makes it less popular and so on.
What has definately become less popular is walking to the fishing/swim. People have now become used to almost fishing from their car.

Hi Steph
I’ve been trotting since the mid 50’s and IMO It’s one of the most stimulating forms of angling – bet if you do try it you’ll be back for more. Also IMO the action of the multi length 13’-15’ option is not a patch on a 3 piece 15’. There are quite a few of good trotting rods about depending on how much you want to pay – from a Shakey to a Prestons, or similar.



‘What else is becoming less popular due to changes in the way fishing wants us to head in’ ?

In my area, while the Colne Valley lakes thrive, most of the field ponds scattered through are in a less happy state. Many are almost forgotten, and as they dry out and become overgrown so their unusual wildflowers, dragonflies, newts, frogs and toads decline. The area has long been a stronghold for Great Crested Newts, but they must now be struggling in many areas. Fortunately I have a few ‘looked after’ field ponds within 10 miles of where I live and when a couple of us fish them It’s like having your own fishery in the middle of nowhere.

I agree with the Park and Fish comment, however, it must have also opened fishing up to a lot of people who would never have been able to if they had to walk a distance to their swim.

I know that a 13 foot rod will probably suffice for trotting a float, but, i did think to myself having that extra couple of feet to help mend the line and for that little bit of extra power when needed would be a whole lot better.

When the time comes and i feel the need to purchase that type of rod i will probably look for a decent qquality rod that may cost a bit but will pay in dividends when it comes to weight and action.

I think that Waggler fishing has gone the same way, you can buy a load of decent Waggler Rods and Fixed Spool reels to accompany them, but you just don't see many people fishing the Waggler these days.

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Ah, so some lakes are also becoming less popular, estate lakes perhaps ..... Easier Fishing and Access and Amenities on Commercial Fisheries are more favourable to the general public ?

steph,

It's all about choices, you fish the way you enjoy.

It might be legering, float fishing or bolt rig fishing.

One of the good things about the internet, there is a wealth of information to be found on any number of sites.

By the very nature of what I prefere to catch (Specimen Fish), much of my time is spent fishing is behind Buzzers and and some form of bolt rig.

I do use a float rod, centrepin and stick float to catch my baits and if I fancy a days trotting, it often makes a nice change.

Bob

I agree Bob it is all about personal choices, however, it would appear that some of these choices are becoming less readily available for those that haven't tried them before.

It wasn't easy to find articles regarding Trotting a Float, there were some but some were not easily informative if you get what i mean.

I like ledgering, i have ledgered on Rivers before and enjoyed it thoroughly, i just wondered whether or not the basics of fishing have been neglected for the quick fix style of introducing people to fishing.

steph mckenzie said:

i just wondered whether or not the basics of fishing have been neglected for the quick fix style of introducing people to fishing.
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Nail, head, hit, on, the.

Steph
Have a look at the Drennan Matchpro 14'. I don't think you will be disappointed as these are superb rods. Plenty of power and nice and light to hold while trotting. If you want something lighter the Ultralite is also a superb rod.

steph mckenzie said:

I agree Bob it is all about personal choices, however, it would appear that some of these choices are becoming less readily available for those that haven't tried them before.

It wasn't easy to find articles regarding Trotting a Float, there were some but some were not easily informative if you get what i mean.

I like ledgering, i have ledgered on Rivers before and enjoyed it thoroughly, i just wondered whether or not the basics of fishing have been neglected for the quick fix style of introducing people to fishing.

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steph

It's all about what you enjoy ?

The Bolt Rig ang and Boilie has changed some forms of fishing, but it does not stop any one fishing how they want.

You will always get a certain section of older anglers who decry the " times are changing " within our sport.

These are usually anglers who have very limited ability to accept change.

A good second hand pin cost very little, look at the Rapidex/Trudex/Speedia/Royal Supreme range and the choice of cheap fixed spool, suitable for float fishing is numerous, 13/15ft trotting/waggler rods have never been cheeper, again s/h trotting rods don't cost a fortune and floats/ line etc is easily aquired.

A good book can point you in the right direction ( The Complete Book of Float Fishing by Allan Haines ), there are many such books or the Dave Harrell Vidio's.

Bob

I fish mainly rivers although some private lakes, I have only fished at what I would call a popular day ticket Carp water maybe ten times in the past two year and my knowledge of Modern Carp fishing is very limited.

However river fishing is a different ball game with 57 seasons under my belt and a lot more than once or twice a week. I fish with a centrepin and a fixed spool and would say to a novice to this side of the sport/hobby/pastime Do Not Buy A Centrepin until you have mastered trotting with a fixed spool.

Yes trotting with a centrepin is old fashioned and very traditional these days, although more people in my experience have been put off river fishing and in particular river trotting and stret pegging because they cannot quickly master casting a centrepin reel. So I would suggest use a fixed spool to begin with it is easier to master and may well be the easiest introduction to river fishing you can get. Plus in the short term it will save you some expense.

River fishing and the associated river/watercraft is an amazing section of the angling world and one not to miss, taking one closer to more (although these days not completely) wild fish than any lake private or public can. For me the fish are more wily, crafty, very cautious and far more nervous than most lake fish. River fish know and use the currents to assist in escaping capture just as the know all about snags and unhooking tricks you can imagine.

In some venues they are scared by shadows in others a heavy footfall or perhaps the noise of a bankstick being pushed in. The baits to can be very different for example I have only fished with pellets and boillies a handful of times but maggots, cheese, bread, worms, slugs, luncheon meat, wasp grubs, grasshoppers, beetles, corn, hemp, tares, wheat, mussels, snails, liver, bacon, kidney, potatoes (...hehehe...starting to sound like a meal sorry), hundreds maybe thousands of times.

I cant often walk far so lack of mobility is not an issue for anyone, there is always somewhere on a river you can get to.

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Dave Slater said:

Steph
Have a look at the Drennan Matchpro 14'. I don't think you will be disappointed as these are superb rods. Plenty of power and nice and light to hold while trotting. If you want something lighter the Ultralite is also a superb rod.

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Most excellent and sound advice use them both myself in fact I have just put a 14' Drennan match pro ultralight in my car to get a couple of hours fishing today. The times when the Drennan will not be up to the job is when the flow is strong and the target are Barbel on the float.

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steph mckenzie said:

I agree with the Park and Fish comment, however, it must have also opened fishing up to a lot of people who would never have been able to if they had to walk a distance to their swim.

I know that a 13 foot rod will probably suffice for trotting a float, but, i did think to myself having that extra couple of feet to help mend the line and for that little bit of extra power when needed would be a whole lot better.

When the time comes and i feel the need to purchase that type of rod i will probably look for a decent qquality rod that may cost a bit but will pay in dividends when it comes to weight and action.

I think that Waggler fishing has gone the same way, you can buy a load of decent Waggler Rods and Fixed Spool reels to accompany them, but you just don't see many people fishing the Waggler these days.

---------- Post added at 13:56 ---------- Previous post was at 13:53 ----------

Ah, so some lakes are also becoming less popular, estate lakes perhaps ..... Easier Fishing and Access and Amenities on Commercial Fisheries are more favourable to the general public ?

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Once you move above the 14' mark you may find that (a) costs for good rods dramatically rise. (b) When on a small river or one with a lot of bankside cover you are too long.
You can get rods up 20' and if you really want beyond.

---------- Post added at 06:53 ---------- Previous post was at 06:47 ----------

Bob Hornegold said:

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steph

It's all about what you enjoy ?

The Bolt Rig ang and Boilie has changed some forms of fishing, but it does not stop any one fishing how they want.

You will always get a certain section of older anglers who decry the " times are changing " within our sport.

These are usually anglers who have very limited ability to accept change.

A good second hand pin cost very little, look at the Rapidex/Trudex/Speedia/Royal Supreme range and the choice of cheap fixed spool, suitable for float fishing is numerous, 13/15ft trotting/waggler rods have never been cheeper, again s/h trotting rods don't cost a fortune and floats/ line etc is easily aquired.

A good book can point you in the right direction ( The Complete Book of Float Fishing by Allan Haines ), there are many such books or the Dave Harrell Vidio's.

Bob

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Hehehe. I am not one to decry the many modern improvements long may they improve our tackle my only gripe would be the increasing difficulty in getting good river rods at reasonable prices there are several out there and most excellent some of them are but the choices are getting smaller and the prices are increasing due to the lack of popularity.
However the use of centrepins is on the increase and although I have not seen a lot of it locally to me from what I read there are more looking to give river fishing a go or to return to river fishing...pity...I have been enjoying the solitude on the river bank...hehehe

It's all about supply and demand. The popularity of commercial fisheries as seen fashion move away from long rods towards shorter ones. Not that long ago it was nigh on impossible to get a float rod of less than 11'. Now short "commercial" rods are becoming increasingly popular. Many folks can no longer be bothered with the long walks that are often necessary when fishing rivers. With that decline there has been a decline in the number of folks buying longer rods. If no one asks for them the tackle shops won't stock them and slowly but surely the tackle companies produce less of them. There seems to be a couple of factors that have checked this a little. One is the Bolognese method and the other of using strong 15'+ rods as an alternative to margin poles on commercials. An awful lot of people are very resistant to the use of longer rods. They probably remember the long rods of old which were often damned heavy and unbalanced. 12-13' really was as much as most wanted to use. Things are better these days with blank diameters coming down and materials getting lighter and stronger.

I'm a big fan of 15' float rods and have a decent selection to choose from. I use them on deep stillwaters, rivers and, occasionally, on commercials. I have a dedicated 15' stick rod, a "specimen" 15' rod that I'll use for big chub, barbel and margin fishing on commercials and two 13-15' rods. Not all multi-length rods are terrible but many are. Dedicated stick float rods are increasingly difficult to find these days. Daiwa seem to be a little better than most in keeping a full variety of float rods in their range. The sad thing for many is that they are usually to be found amongst their most expensive top end ranges. Drennan also tend to keep proper trotting rods in their ranges and are usually a bit more modestly priced.

I doubt that stick float fishing will ever die out completely. However, it's a skill that is being practised by fewer folk and they are often using older gear.
I suspect we are already at the point where many anglers will have never joined a club, never fished a river and are unlikely to try.

As some one who has river fished all my life, here's my thoughts on why the vast majority of anglers I see on the rivers I fish (and mine are not short of anglers btw) don't fish the float.

Many are ex carp anglers chastened by the whole carp thing. Usually under 40, never fished a float of any kind even, even for the carp. Most have only ever carp fished, didn't serve there apprenticeship float fishing for silvers on the pond canals. There time was spent behind static rods on pods with bite alarms and so on, you know the picture.

They have brought that one style they know into river fishing some even using the alarms and fishing the rods flat to the water. I think ? it was Lee Swords that nicknamed it Carbarbeling.

Those over 50 who grew up just before the carp explosion learnt their fishing, fishing for silvers on stillwaters and rivers.
And here's the crucial point the local club outings, usually matches on the rivers that at that time had fish in them, particularly if you were northern based.
The club matches to far flung rivers like the Trent, Witham, Yorkshire rivers were the highlight of the month and you spent the coming time after the last one, plotting for the next

You also learnt the skills you needed from the older guys traveling to the venue on the coach in theory and then in practice on the bank sat behind them, watching how they did it because you weren't catching owt.

These days it's your own personal transport traveling with may be a mate who knows about as much as you do about float fishing......naff all!......The bind leading the blind.

There are just occasionally the exception like my mate I fished yesterday just 40, learnt those skills because he started fishing for silvers locally, then matches, progressed to specialist fishing. He spent all afternoon/evening trotting on the pin and perfecting his Wallis casting.

I think it is down to the sponsorship in angling and commercialism.By that I mean ,is that a guy who gets sponsored by a large tackle company is asked for his input on certain things and therefore suggests what feels right to him with his style of fishing .The item comes out and is plastered all over the press saying this is the rod that is going to catch you more fish because.
Link ledgering stret pegging float ledgering trotting a float down a river even slider fishing its all done by a few but not the majority because its not as popular as it once was as commercials have now taken over .

noknot said:

Defiantly it seems some forms are forgotten, this I put down to the commercialism of Carp fishing. It seems to me that the majority of new comers to the sport want to catch Carp from the off, which I see as sad!
They buy the Mag's and Comics and what do they see every week? Lots of big Carp and they then want to catch one!
Along with this they will need the gear to do so, there is no shortage of Carp rods on the market is there! They must be 3lbs + TC and big pit's and Delk's! Even though they have never caught a Roach or a Perch before! Everything is catered for on these "Carp waters" even to the point of booking your swim six months in advance! How could you do that??? Remember watercraft? So off they go to their pre booked swims, with all the gear and no idea, cast "boat" a bait out and catch a 30+ Mirror! Or catch overstocked pale pasties that are starving, and need to eat bait to survive and cause damage to the fish whilst playing them and on the bank through inexperience.
I'm glad I started on Rudd and Perch from a small weedy pond, as there is so much to learn.........................

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so much that we will never learn it all and i am glad for that

Who said link ledgering ? ..yes thats not happening as much...I wonder how many people dont know what the term even means anymore !

It seems the only reason people change a lead nowadays is to put on a bigger one to stop it being pulled out of position by the current.

I used to use these tiny eighth of an ounze leads on the Kennet to bump flake down under nearbank floating rafts and bushes. You could get it miles under on occasions.

Quoted for extra truth

The bad one said:

Most have only ever carp fished, didn't serve there apprenticeship float fishing for silvers on the pond canals.

...And here's the crucial point the local club outings, usually matches on the rivers that at that time had fish in them...

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Hear hear.

I am one of the lucky ones in my early 50's to have learned my skills (modest as they are) before the single species take over. Returning to coarse fishing 8 or 9 years ago (after a long lay off working too hard and only game fishing two or three times a year with blinkers on as regards to the wider world) was a shock. I kid you not. Poles ????? Carbon fibre ???? etc...

And the collapse of the club scene and general river match scene. Why did it happen ? I am still at a loss to understand where it all went.

I'm really interested to know what the problem is ?

Does it matter if anglers from a different generation only Carp Fish and never look at a trotting rod or link leger.

And who cares if they were not brought up on the club match circle and the coach trips ?

With so many other activities open to youngsters, if getting into Carp fishing is the only route they want to take, then so be it!

Why this need for older ( not wiser ) anglers to condem the young modern carp type angler, because they were not taught in a traditional way.

Are we so narrow minded, that we cannot see that if we don't encourage the Carp type anglers into the sport, there will be No Coarse angling as we know it in the next 50 years !!

And before anyone asks, I can and do use a trotting rod, I can Wallis Cast (taught by Mr. Roe) I have never been in the slightest way intersted in the Club and Match fishing sceen and since an early age only been interestyed in catching Specimen fish of all types, using all methods, that includes a Pole !!

Bob

And there I thought a bait dropper was a split in the plastic bag which held the boilies :wh

Bob Hornegold said:

I'm really interested to know what the problem is ?

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You misunderstand.

You seem to think that I am in some way criticising.

I am not.

I am just grateful to have had a full and wide general coarse fishing education before making the choice to spend my time in one particular discipline.

I feel sorry for those who have not had the opportunity of such a wider general coarse fishing education.

It's not that Carp fishing is the only way that today's youngsters want to take, it's generally the only way they can take.

You say "so what" in relation to the "club match circle and the coach trips" that used to be part of the scene. That is a very sad "so what" if you have also missed out on the camaraderie, fellowship and (trying not to be tooo pompous about it but probably failing) brotherhood of fishing in that way and at that time.

Dads and sons and uncles and brothers and best mates and the thrill of beating Dad at something for the first time when you finally weigh in an ounce above him, and that first illicit underage half pint of shandy with his sideways wink of approval...

And bicycle clips and Hovis. Possibly all bullcrap, but there it is....

Put it shortly: It's a bit like those poor kids brought up in one isolated and exclusive religious communities or cults, (7th day Adventists, The Family, Scientology, whatever). What real choice of religious belief do they ever have ? None.

Same as the kid who had a 2 1/2 lb carp test curve tool + BaitRunner pushed into his hands at age 11 and has never known anything but.