The Lady of the Stream

Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA) · Nov 17, 2006

I've caught many many grayling in my life, mainly from Yorkshire and Derbyshire rivers. In my younger days I used to catch grayling from certain stretches of the Wiltshire Wylye on condition that all fish caught were killed.

Of course I discovered that grayling make fine eating.

The Derbyshire Derwent in parts is stuffed with grayling. In fact on some tickets it allows you to take two fish for the table per day.

I get the idea that if grayling were truly recognised as a game fish in England, angling on ,many waters for them would be limited to fly only. Actually this would be no bad thing as where graying are numerous, they can be ridiculously easy to catch on bait, especially maggot feeder or legered sweetcorn.

Grayling are suckers for sweetcorn did you know?

As Mark says, grayling when caught on the leger tend to swallow the hook and can be a devil to unhook if your hook has a barb.

The last thing you should ever do if you catch a big grayling is go through the normal spezzy hunter rigmarole of weighing in a sling, holding the fish for a trophy shot etc. They will not survive, especially during warm weather.

If you want to weigh the fish, get one of those nets with a built-in spring balance. I have one I use for trout and I've had fish and weighed them too to 7 1/4 lbs. If you want a picture, lay the fish on a bit of wet grass in your net and take one quickly.

If you hook a fish and it is bleeding, it won't live at all. Don't waste it however by trying to return it.

Knock it one the head, take it home and eat it.

Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA) · Nov 17, 2006

Good point on the photographing of Grayling Ron.I tried to holding a Grayling for a shot for the write up on the recent Kennet day and it was impossible.I will follow your guidance in the future although I do use barbless hooks.If you keep decent pressure on the fish they do not come out often despite what some writers say.The odd lost fish is a price worth paying to preserve the health of the fish however.

Certainly the upper reaches of all the Yorkshire spate rivers hold good stocks.Nothing large like the Itchen and Test, a pound fish would be a specimen in most places, but perhaps the fish have grown big in these rivers because of the culling in the past?Any views Mark?

I do not think we need to fear too much for the future of grayling on a nationwide basis for they remain widespread and unpressured in most places.The situation on fisheries like Timsbury,Lower Itchen etc is slightly different in that they do receive quite a lot of pressure from some good anglers over the winter and I suspect that may have an impact over a few seasons from what Mark is saying.Certainly the Grayling fishing at Barton Court on the Kennet has declined somewhat.On the plus side the same anglers are use to high standards of fish welfare for other species and I would be surprised to see any significant mistreatment.

Graham Whatmore · Nov 17, 2006

The Teme used to hold lots of grayling and I have on occasions caught them on the upper stretches of the Wye but they were never prolific.

Its been a few years now since I caught a grayling and they are always bonnie little fighters but suckers for a maggot, it is a shame they aren't more widespread.

Mark Wintle · Nov 17, 2006

Nigel,

Culling used to significantly depress the average size so that the water was overrun with 1-2 year old grayling but no chance of the big ones living long enough to get big. I suspect declines in dace/roach numbers could help on some waters though cannot prove it but I have one or two waters in mind.

On the Itchem website it mentioned the proportion of 2lb+ fish back in 2001; I suspect that it is no longer the case, and it would be interesting to see last 5 years figures.

Does anyone else support my plea for a keepnet ban for grayling, given that you can't put brown trout in one?

John Ledger (ACA) · Nov 17, 2006

One of my favourite fish Ron and like dace are a sadly neglected fish

Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA) · Nov 17, 2006

Mark, I would never dream of putting Grayling in a net and so would all of us on here I suspect, but ultimately it should be down to fishery owners perhaps rather than a legislative ban? Where would one draw the line?Barbel etc?

Lark · Nov 17, 2006

Ron, Did you watch 'How To Watch Wildlife' with Bill Oddie on Tuesday evening? Some beautifull footage of grayling and roach on the Frome in Dorset.

Evan · Nov 17, 2006

Much though I am against unnecessary legislation for the sake of it I would support a keepnet ban for Grayling not intended for the pot if it is the case that they simply do not survive the experience.

If so then the whole point of a keepnet is academic - if you wish to catch and release in good condition it HAS to go back immediately, if not then a swift blow with the priest is better than fading away in a net....

And Nigel, I don't see the problem about other species if it is clear that

(a) this is a special case due to this species special vulnerability to keepnet death and

(b) isn't Grayling properly and genuinely classed as a game fish anyway ? Doesn't it have an adipose fin ? [Edit]Yup ![Edit]

Mind you, i was unaware of any general rule against putting game fish in keepnets anyway. Just that no-one would ever bother to, either the trout is returned on catch 'n release or banged on the head for the pot forthwith.

Not that I would ever want to but is there such a rule or is it just down to the individual fisheries ?

If there is such a national rule, I would ask again, as I have done a number of times, where the hell we can find and access these rules ? EA website.... not blody likely. You'd have thought they would publish the very rules they are entrusted with enforcing but no, not their interest it would seem....

In passing I am not a member (yet) but this lot seem to have their hearts in the right place

http://www.graylingsociety.org/

and this site is pretty good too

http://www.grayling.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/

paul williams 2 · Nov 17, 2006

I would far sooner fish for grayling than any rainbow trout......they are wonderful little fish and the surroundings they are caught in is usually wonderful too!

Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA) · Nov 17, 2006

As regards classifying the grayling as a game fish, we find there are some strange anomolies.

Outside of the UK, grayling are indeed classified as a VERY game fish. They have all the attributes of what a game fish should be. They take artificials, they fight well, they are pretty and they are very edible.

Go to places like Scandinavia, and you will find that perch and pike are also classified as a game fish. And they are not salmonids.

In America, The large and small mouth bass are both classified as game fish. In SA, the Yellowfishes - Cyprinids and members of the barbus sub-species are also classified as game fish.

Non of the above mentioned species are salmonids. Yet there are still people who classify the grayling as a coarse fish, and it is indeed a salmonid.

It's pluudy confusing to some I know.

Yet I truly hate this coarse fish/game fish divide.

It was created actually by the people who were involved in the Mundella Act of 1878.

Neil Maidment · Nov 17, 2006

On the recent fish-in, at Denford (Kennet carriers), the grayling were quite prolific. Lots of small fish, from a few ounces to just under a pound, plus a few to around 1.75lb. They seem to be thriving but I wonder if Mark will be proved right in that the owners are clearly happy for a "different" type of angler to pay for access after the trout season.

Not sure how heavily that particular stretch is fished but if it does come under sustained pressure, I wonder how it and it's fish will cope? I'm sure all the anglers there that day know how to treat fish well, not just grayling, but suggest there are others out there just wanting to bag up on something different.

Having said that, that days fishing was one of the best I've had for many a year and to catch grayling in such an environment was just superb. I'd almost forgotten what beautiful fish they are, but they are suckers for a couple of maggots on a 14!

stuart clough · Nov 17, 2006

The following link shows what happens to grayling sizes when they are culled:

http://www.mikeladle.com/tackle/tackle131.html

stuart clough · Nov 17, 2006

I agree that angling pressure appears to have an impact on catches, but there may be an element of fish moving/becoming more canny. On the lower Itchen the fish were still present (and visible!) but became very diffcult to tempt after a lot of pressure.

Also, it is known that because grayling grow so quickly strong year classes can suppress subsequent years recruitment through intraspecific competition - means that there is often a cyclic nature to populations.

I had my first Dane grayling this week - on trotted luncheon meat!

stikflote · Nov 17, 2006

i caught a big grayling in the region of two pounds,on the derwent at raynesway
i took the hook out, lowered it in landing net to put it back in water, and it promptly bellied up ,it really upset me for a while ,because its not often you get that size

clam · Nov 17, 2006

Stikfloat,next time hold the grayling facing the current(like you do when putting back barbel)It some times takes over 5 min to recover but they should swim away eventuly.
Ive been float fishing on the upper derbyshire derwent over the last few weeks and had them up to 1lb 5oz.Realy good fighters and when you hook one you are never sure youve got it till youve landed it.

Peter Jacobs · Nov 18, 2006

Although I am totally against any sort of 'ban' in Coarse fishing, (and that inlcudes the sad loss of lead shot) I would wholeheartedly support a ban on witholding Grayling in keepnets.

George387 · Nov 18, 2006

Being originally from Scotland I used to always fish the upper clyde for grayling years ago, I often watched game anglers culling grayling as they were under the impression that they ate the eggs of trout. This was over a 5 or 6 year period and now if you go fish the upper clyde for the grayling they are not as plentiful in such big sizes. I now fish the upper swale for the grayling and can report that they are here in good numbers and with careful handling and proper treatment they will be here for years to come. Nothing more breathtaking than strolling along the river on a white crisp morning in persuit of the Grayling, you feel alive

clam · Nov 18, 2006

Thats it,iam going grayling fishing again tomorrow.
Thanks George387.

George387 · Nov 19, 2006

LOL, Clam Im just back from a walk along the river and its up by 3 ft and really chocolate Brown so wont be catching a lot on the river up here today if its the swale your fishing
In conditions like that you are better fishing one of the side becks and with me living in Bedale I can confirm that the bedale beck is stuffed with grayling, nothing massive but big enough to keep you occupied. If you need info on the beck which is free fishing at certain points, drop me a line only to happy to point you in the right direction.

Peter Rothman · Nov 19, 2006

I totally agree with the arguments against retaining grayling in keepnets, then again I feel that the use of keepnets is quite unnecessary, matches excluded.
It is also important to return all fish as soon as practicably possible, so why do so many anglers weigh so many of their fish? I've read many articles where the weights of all 8 chub are mentioned or 'I had 3 barbel weighing....' Are we really obsessed with weights? Do people really care that much? I do carry a set of scales with me for 'special' fish, but probably don't weigh more than 3 or 4 fish a season, the last, which might interest Mark, was a Frome grayling caught a couple of weeks back that was just 1oz shy of 2lb and a best for me. Needless to say it swam off strongly after being held facing upstream in the current for a few minutes. Chris Yates in his latest book describes the weighing of a large perch as 'an undignified ritual' which, to me, sums it up!
Regarding the theory of angling pressure and grayling, the fish I mentioned came from a stretch (not private) that I rarely fish and so far have never seen another angler using. My more regular haunts that have more pressure have not produced large grayling for me for a couple of seasons now.

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