dezza
Well-known member
I want to investigate what the average angler understands by a rod "locking up", when it is bent.
Any of you like to describe what happens?
Any of you like to describe what happens?
Rods which "Lock Up".
- Thread starter dezza
- Start date
The only way I can describe this Ron is that when certain rods start to curve they ''lock up'' when they curve no more, I used to have a shimano 13 float rod that locked up half way down the butt, it used to scare the c.r.a.p out of me when I got a big fish on!!
I have no such problems with my preston excel rods...sublime!
mark
I have no such problems with my preston excel rods...sublime!
mark
dezza
Well-known member
Thanks Mark, I will also investigate this phenomenom with Steve Harrison who has a Ph.D in mechanical engineering or Mike Helliwell.
I'm trying to establish something scientific regarding the term. I think there might be a way to establish quality in a fishing rod. It's not good enough in my opinion to say that the rod locks up, we want something better than that.
I'm trying to establish something scientific regarding the term. I think there might be a way to establish quality in a fishing rod. It's not good enough in my opinion to say that the rod locks up, we want something better than that.
Is that not just a fast/tip actioned float rod?
I've seen fast actioned carp rods where the butt section doesn't bend whilst playing fish
dezza
Well-known member
These of course are fast taper blanks, and although the butt section might look as if it is not bending, in actual fact it is bending, although by a small amount. No matter how stiff the material is, some deflection will take place if the rod is loaded in the way of a cantilever beam, as indeed most rods are when playing a fish.
Lord Paul of Sheffield
Well-known member
Ron
A rod locking up - can this happen when a rod has a "flat spot"?
A rod locking up - can this happen when a rod has a "flat spot"?
Mr Cholmondeley-Corker (PaSC)
Senior Member
So, what do we mean by 'Locking up'
Think of a rod as a spring with the ability to absorb load by its movement. If a rod locks up then there is no movement left in it - any further increase in load after this point is carried by the strength of the materials involved (the line and the rod) - if the load is high enough then one or both will fail.
As I said, think of a rod as a spring. If you take a coil spring (like the ones you see in a biro for example) and compress it then it will flex and absorb the load (or more precisely it will exert and equal and opposite load back). However, if the spring is compressed to the point where all the coils touch each other then there is no flexibility left in the spring and it becomes solid - or coil bound as it is known in the trade. The spring has locked up just like a rod bending to the point where there is no flexibility left in the material.
---------- Post added at 11:39 ---------- Previous post was at 11:35 ----------
Paul
A flat spot on a rod is a section that is stiffer than the lengths either side of it ie there is a none uniform change in stiffness - usually due to joint design.
Think of a rod as a spring with the ability to absorb load by its movement. If a rod locks up then there is no movement left in it - any further increase in load after this point is carried by the strength of the materials involved (the line and the rod) - if the load is high enough then one or both will fail.
As I said, think of a rod as a spring. If you take a coil spring (like the ones you see in a biro for example) and compress it then it will flex and absorb the load (or more precisely it will exert and equal and opposite load back). However, if the spring is compressed to the point where all the coils touch each other then there is no flexibility left in the spring and it becomes solid - or coil bound as it is known in the trade. The spring has locked up just like a rod bending to the point where there is no flexibility left in the material.
---------- Post added at 11:39 ---------- Previous post was at 11:35 ----------
Paul
A flat spot on a rod is a section that is stiffer than the lengths either side of it ie there is a none uniform change in stiffness - usually due to joint design.
Lord Paul of Sheffield
Well-known member
Sean Meeghan
Well-known member
I think what Ron is getting at is that in engineering terms rods shouldn't lock up. The rod should continue to bend until it fails - it can't become coil bound like a spring can Matt.
My own understanding of locking up is that the tapers or the wall thickness of the rod have been poorly designed. The rod may have been designed to have a soft tip and a stiff butt, but if the transition between the tip and the butt isn't progressive enough as the tip starts to straighten out under load the rod stiffens up suddenly -what we term as locking up.
My own understanding of locking up is that the tapers or the wall thickness of the rod have been poorly designed. The rod may have been designed to have a soft tip and a stiff butt, but if the transition between the tip and the butt isn't progressive enough as the tip starts to straighten out under load the rod stiffens up suddenly -what we term as locking up.
dezza
Well-known member
But the spring on a rod works completely different to a coiled spring which if compressed reaches a point where the coils are sitting against each other, and a whole lot of different circumstances come into play.
After discussions with Mike Helliwell at Harrison Advanced rods, we came to the conclusion that the term and condition known as "locking up" is rather spurious and has no base in any form of science.
Many anglers will experience that a fishing rod will reach a certain degree of deflection, and then appear to stop any further bending. This is probably due to the fact that to exert any further degree of bending, an increase in force is required, that force being something that the angler does not have the strength to apply, hence the sensation of "locking up".
Certainly a quality blank will most likely bend a great deal more, and at the some time maintaining progressive resistance to bending before fracture, than a cheap and nasty blank.
Top quality blanks, and Harrison make some of the best in the world, exhibit the above property.
And we both agreed that a rod capable of taking a progressive through action curve is capable of putting more pressure on the fighting fish than a fast taper rod.
Lord Paul of Sheffield
Well-known member
not my post Ron - Corky's
i'm not that clever
i'm not that clever
dezza
Well-known member
You have a good point there Sean.
---------- Post added at 05:34 ---------- Previous post was at 05:33 ----------
We seem to have a problem with the quotation system on this site.
Sorry Paul, not my fault.
barbelboi
Well-known member
Surely the lock up point of a rod is when you cease to be able to play the fish on the rod and are effectively playing it off the reel/line?
Jerry
Jerry
dezza
Well-known member
But that would be the point where you point the rod at the fish, or the rod handle is in line with the line and the rod is not a curve of resilience against the activities and plunges of a fighting fish.
barbelboi
Well-known member
Wasn't thinking of it like that Ron, more like when the lunge hits the 'lock up' point surely everything further is transferred to the line irrespective of whatever angle the rod is?
Jerry
Jerry
Jeff Woodhouse
Moaning Marlow Meldrew
'ere, 'ere!
Because you copied part of a copy that Paul posted.
I keep all my rods locked up, can't trust the tea leaves around here.
dezza
Well-known member
OK but I think that this may happen in the case of a cheap or poorly constructed blank. Make no mistake there are some cheap and nasty blanks out there and one day when you are playing that fish of a lifetime the rod will cease to perform as a shock absorber as you describe.
Let's hope you have the reels drag set correctly when it does, or else it's goodbye.
Earlier this year I lost a big fish off the NSW coast that "pointed" me. I was using a brand new reel and had not set the drag properly - my fault.
barbelboi
Well-known member
Just expressing an opinion to the thread Ron, none of the blanks to my rods that I use these days lock up.
Jerry
PS Apart from maybe the old MK4 Avon
Jerry
PS Apart from maybe the old MK4 Avon
Sean Meeghan
Well-known member
Just expressing an opinion to the thread Ron, none of the blanks to my rods that I use these days lock up.
Jerry
PS Apart from maybe the old MK4 Avon
That's because you're fishing with something which should really be used in the garden for supporting things. :wh
dezza
Well-known member
Ja well, split cane is rubbish compared with top class carbon fibre.
There has been a whole load of **** spouted about carbon fibre since it was first introduced. The worst were those who said that tubular carbon goes from circular to ovular in cross section when bent. It will have a tendency to do this but I very much doubt if it does happen. Fracture takes place before it does.