A Price On Their Heads

I've often thought long and hard about what happened at Adams Mill and its huge barbel. They are not there now of course and the last thing I want to get involved with is how they dissappeared.

However one aspect of the whole Adams Mill debacle was the high cost of fishing there when the barbel were alive. These days you can fish there for a reasonable amount now that the barbel have dissappeared.

I know I willl be sneered at for mentioning Walker at this juncture, but I will. Walker was always against the idea that anglers of wealth could buy fame for themselves. He particularly applied this to salmon fishing.

He said that "more big salmon are caught by people who's money compensates for what skill they may possess, than by skillful anglers."

Maybe it was the same at Adam's Mill where certain anglers were able to buy fame for themselves on account of how much money thet were able to throw around,

But what do you think?

Adams Mill still gives good fishing, especially for chub and roach, and if I lived closer I would certainly take out a MKAA season ticket. But if the barbel make a re-appearance, which I hope they don't, will it mean that the yearly ticket will shoot skywards again, and the clique will return?

article in the angling times today,
looking sad and neglected now that the circus has left town

Walker was right, but fishing is like any other commodity, those with the deepest pockets will always have the best. However; In the case of Adams (or any other known big fish venue) in this age of instant media where everyone wants their 15 minutes of fame I think it can work to the anglers disadvantage. Many people will look at pictures of known fish and rightly or wrongly automatically mentaly discount them as being 'just another Ouse/Kennet/wherever fish'.

If you think Adams was bad be grateful you dont want to fish for salmon.

River Dee Aboyne Water Fishings - Salmon fishing for sale

That's dirt cheap, but then do bear in mind that those February weeks will probably never offer a buyer a chance of a fresh-run salmon, just foul February weather, snow water and maybe some spawned-out old Kelts. Only such non-fishing weeks are ever offered for sale, the prime weeks having been either privately and quietly purchased for simply eye-watering sums ... or certain prime beats on certain prime weeks "retained" by individuals as part of their portfolio of salmon fishings in the safe knowledge that their grandsons, if they so desire, will be fishing them after them. Sea-trout have had the same number done on them by the same big money, sporting agent mob over the past decade.

All of which leads me to the oft-muttered Boote refrain: "Just glad I did what I did when I did it."

re Adams Mill

Adams in fishing cost terms was expensive BUT if you compare it to some other "sports" was dirt cheap. Football, Rugby etc all costs a lot more for a premiership season ticket and the time constraints when you can actualy attend are far greater. Fishing has and always will be cheap when compared to other forms of entertainment.

As for the bit about "Maybe it was the same at Adam's Mill where certain anglers were able to buy fame for themselves on account of how much money thet were able to throw around,".
I'd agree that certain anglers with little ability or knowledge were able to fish for some magnificent barbel of unbelievable weights to try to gain celebrity status, but in the main most who parted with their cash or who ran the place were knowledgeble anglers who'd been around for many years.

The bit I found funniest about the situation were those who at the start criticised those who'd gotten membership, and the fact it had been syndicated, and yet within a couple of years were there themselves.

davefeeney said:

article in the angling times today,
looking sad and neglected now that the circus has left town

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I saw that, but it's not neglect by anglers/club, it's down to lack of water.
The comparisom photo's have a bit of artistic licence, from my memory of the place. The before picture showed coloured high water conditions, the now picture shows it at an obvious very low level. Abstraction!!
So a pinch of salt methinks, but seriously low, much like many other rivers.

I would certainly fish there again and may well have a go soon when levels improve.

I am always interested when I hear about waters losing fish so all the crowds move off. The fact is if a water can hold a big fish then it could hold a new big one. I doubt Adams Mill has become a bad water simply because some known big fish have gone. My advice for those who stayed would be to make hay while the sun shines because the crowds could be just round the corner again.

As for Salmon fishing I really cant see why people are prepared to pay such an amount. I honestly would be prepared to pay more for quality coarser fishing than I would for Salmon. I suspect if I ever did have the money to fish one of those mega Salmon beats or exclusive Trout chalkstreams I would immediatly have my head turned by what was there in terms of Coarse fish to have a go for....the game fish would be most certainly in the back of my mind !

Same for the trout rezzies ....I suspect many would pay a fair old sum to fish for say Roach or Bream on some of these waters...probably allot more than the trout guys are prepared to pay to fish for trout.

Make no mistake the balance is shifting back towards coarse fish because thats were the money is now. Perhaps its about time those at the top started thinking about shifting a bigger % the licence money in that direction too.

Judas Priest said:

re Adams Mill

Adams in fishing cost terms was expensive BUT if you compare it to some other "sports" was dirt cheap. Football, Rugby etc all costs a lot more for a premiership season ticket and the time constraints when you can actualy attend are far greater. Fishing has and always will be cheap when compared to other forms of entertainment.

As for the bit about "Maybe it was the same at Adam's Mill where certain anglers were able to buy fame for themselves on account of how much money thet were able to throw around,".
I'd agree that certain anglers with little ability or knowledge were able to fish for some magnificent barbel of unbelievable weights to try to gain celebrity status, but in the main most who parted with their cash or who ran the place were knowledgeble anglers who'd been around for many years.

The bit I found funniest about the situation were those who at the start criticised those who'd gotten membership, and the fact it had been syndicated, and yet within a couple of years were there themselves.

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I can't see how you can draw a fair cost comparison between spectator and participation sports, a better comparison might be a round of golf; about £20.
Though bear in mind all the additional costs incurred in running a golf course.

I'm forever hearing/reading of all these wannabes trying to gain status in the sport but I've not met any, I've always found that those banging on about it to be a somewhat embittered type.

I mean it's not exactly a complex task gaining some notoriety; catch a few reasonable sized fish, not necessarily huge, just of a good stamp; 6lb+ chub, 11-12lb barbel, 8lb+ tench, 11-12lb bream, all very obtainable and fairly widespread. Take some good HD pics and write an article, simples!

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Fred Bonney said:

I saw that, but it's not neglect by anglers/club, it's down to lack of water.
The comparisom photo's have a bit of artistic licence, from my memory of the place. The before picture showed coloured high water conditions, the now picture shows it at an obvious very low level. Abstraction!!
So a pinch of salt methinks, but seriously low, much like many other rivers.

I would certainly fish there again and may well have a go soon when levels improve.

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Spot on there Fred, the ironic thing being; small tribs like the Tove offer far better quality fishing than the rivers they feed. Simply because often they aren't abstracted so relentlessly or so heavily dumped on with sewage.

I did have my name down, but only got the call once the big fish had died and after some frank communication with Stuart Court didn't feel even the "reduced" price sufficient incentive for the time and petrol costs required.

Was it expensive? Not in my book. For the chance to fish for the undisputed biggest known barbel in the country with a restricted membership I would have paid it and made sacrifices elsewhere. Even if only for a season to say I tried. I've never had the "bottomless" pockets implied by Ron of (potential) members.

There are plenty of carp syndicate waters that go for similar prices and plenty of waiting lists for them, too.
I have my name down for one of them for next year at a similar price. Not record fish, but historic within its context and very tricky. A Challenge. I'll sacrifice something to pay for that as necessary, but no angling "fame" will ensue, no matter how well (or not) I do.

In reality, a syndicate was the only option available once the size of the fish was established in such a small stretch and the pricing for limiting the numbers of members reflected both the demand, the overheads and some profit.

It was a one of a kind venue and may never be repeated again. What price angling history at less than £10 a week and go whenever you like? There are plenty of anglers who spend more than that fishing day-ticket or commercials once or twice a week for a season.
What bull.

As Judas says, compared to other major sporting season tickets, it was a snip.
All that "green-eyed" baloney about anglers and fame and money.................there may well have been one or two, but how about anglers like Ray Walton and Stuart Court who are just passionate about catching barbel, especially big ones; Martin Bowler and Tony Gibson, two of the country's top specimen anglers for ALL species..............and plenty of others over the years.

The majority there were simply very good, passionate anglers, did their time, worked things out and reaped the rewards. From speaking to those guys, it wasn't an easy venue by any means and they had their work cut out big time to catch the big fish.

And that was the challenge. I guess you have to be a Specimen Hunter or of that mentality, to understand it.

---------- Post added at 22:22 ---------- Previous post was at 22:20 ----------

cg74 said:

I'm forever hearing/reading of all these wannabes trying to gain status in the sport but I've not met any, .

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I have. :wh

Ah the Tove, my winding down river just across the road after a 12 hour day at the office.

Cracking little river with plenty of surprises.

---------- Post added at 22:26 ---------- Previous post was at 22:22 ----------

I tried to get a ticket when it was first syndicated after many tough days on the stretch,and would have paid the £200 odd to fish it, but didn't know the right people!

Simon K said:

In reality, a syndicate was the only option available once the size of the fish was established in such a small stretch and the pricing for limiting the numbers of members reflected both the demand, the overheads and some profit.

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I think you're right, Simon.
Though I questioned some of the anglers actions, I think it was a move intended foremost to protect those fish.
I don't think they'd have lasted anywhere near as long as they did were anyone allowed to fish for them.

Regards

Damian

Damian Kimmins said:

I think it was a move intended foremost to protect those fish.

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Sorry Damian but I dont buy that at all. If people cared that much about fish they would not fish for them. It was a move foremost to protect the fishing not the fish.

looking at the picture of the ouse in the times is pretty similar to most small rivers round this way at the moment...barely any rain all year so it's hardly surprising that its drying up.

syndicates like what happened at adams mill are not surprising though and i don't really see a problem with them, way of the world and all that. perhaps it did take the pressure off them a bit in the last years of there life and ensured history was accurately written and photographed.

whether it peed off some of the former club anglers that didnt have the opportunity to join the syndicate would be the only issue that i can see with it.

like simon said i think i would have taken the opportunity if i had the chance back then.

cheers
jason

Morning,
I think some of you are way off track regarding why Adams Mill was syndicated. You need to look back through the archives both on FM and BFW to get a balanced view of what took place. Then you may be better placed and able to form that balanced view.

As for the fish dying or disappearing it is my understanding that a couple of the big fish died through natural causes and some from otter predation.
Personally I doubt that Adams Mill will ever return to the heady days of 20lb + Barbel, maybe another part of the Great Ouse will take its place or some other river?

Ray

i was a member of mkaa until they brought adams mill and i was disgusted with the fact they wanted to charge higher rates to fish a stretch of bl**dy river. i refused to renew my membership and have never regretted that choice.
it was the same with linear guys syndicate. i was among the first people to hold membership and very reasonable price it was but as with all things the price goes up year after year until it was touching the £300 mark for a year. i know some of you will think its a good price still but when i can only get to the lakes for the odd session i cant justify the prices.
i am now in a club with a restriced night syndicate, 20 years ago i was a member of the syndicate but gave it up when i joined the army then i refound the lake early this year and to my horror i have to wait 2 years before i can get on waiting list for the syndicate. ok not a problem until i find out its about 8 year waiting list and this is all down to anglers that have more cash to throw around. out of the 40 members allowed on the syndicate about half of them dont even fish the place its their back up water incase the syndicate lake they fancy fishing is to busy.
those with the extra cash to throw around will always do better than those without the fast flowing funds. well that is until a day angler sets a new record or pulls out the largest catch of the season

I was in MKAA when they had Adams Mill as part of the club ticket ?

The Farmer asked for more money for the Rent of that section of the Ouse and to raise the money they formed a syndicate.

What is wrong with that ?

You pay a Hell of a lot more for Golf Club Membership, for even the most modest of Golf Clubs.

Fishing has always been too cheap in this country and has a history off not paying enough for it's fishing.

I am fortunate to fish in an area where it is possible to catch 8lb Chub, 17lb Barbel, 40lb Carp, 10lb Tench, 15lb Bream, 30lb Pike and 4lb Perch for very modest cost, the price of a Club Ticket.

Some are not as fortunate and choose to buy syndicate tickets, their choice in my book.

Bob

Bob Hornegold said:

You pay a Hell of a lot more for Golf Club Membership, for even the most modest of Golf Clubs.

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And look what company you have to keep and opinions and values you have to espouse when doing so...

Paul Boote said:

And look what company you have to keep and opinions and values you have to espouse when doing so...

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Paul,

That depends on which club you belong too ?

But the same thing could be applied to a private section of the Test, Itchen, or Nadder !!

Who do you think runs this country ?

It certainly ain't the Goverment, look No further than the Public schools and Upper Classes !!

Bob

Bob Hornegold said:

It certainly ain't the Goverment, look No further than the Public schools and Upper Classes !!

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Yes, it takes real class to charmingly but firmly say to that mob "Thanks, but no thanks"!

For those wondering what's become of Adams mill, there's a couple pics on this link, that might give a clue as to its demise:
The worrying state of our rivers - CEMEX ANGLING | FORUM