A Haven for fish?

dezza · Dec 30, 2011

I have just seen a most interesting programme on how huge windturbines are constructed and assempled in wind farms offshore. Not only does this technology of producing clean energy interest me, I noticed that a number of these structures placed fairly close together could provide a haven for sea fish.

Certainly I hope that large commercial fishing vessels will be prevented from getting too close to these windfarms.

And it does seem that many more of these farms will be built in future.

I hope so.

Actually I am one who doesn't consider them to be blots on the horizon. They do in fact grow on you, just like the old windmills did.

Don't you think?

barbelboi · Dec 30, 2011

The main problem with Wind turbines is you cannot control the weather, and you cannot store electricity in large amounts. No matter how many turbines we build, we will always need a backup power source for when the wind stops (or indeed blows too hard).This means gas or coal-fired power stations, as they can be switched on quickly to balance the load on the grid - Nuclear power can’t be turned on fast enough, not at the moment anyway.
Jerry

Jeff Woodhouse · Dec 30, 2011

I don't know why we don't try and do without electricity completely. In fact get rid of all oil, coal, and gas burning engines and contraptions including jet airliners. If anyone wants to go to South Africa or Australia, let them go by sailing ship, an old three masted barquentine or schooner and the passengers have to act as crew also. Everyone must serve their time in the crow's nest, with almost 6 months sailing to Oz, yes!

dezza · Dec 30, 2011

Jeff Woodhouse said:
I don't know why we don't try and do without electricity completely. In fact get rid of all oil, coal, and gas burning engines and contraptions including jet airliners. If anyone wants to go to South Africa or Australia, let them go by sailing ship, an old three masted barquentine or schooner and the passengers have to act as crew also. Everyone must serve their time in the crow's nest, with almost 6 months sailing to Oz, yes!
__________________

Modern sailing ships have been designed which will do 25 knots in a fair breeze. They will also carry several thousand passengers in comfort, the electricity coming from wind turbines mounted on the ship.

The standards on these ships would be very luxurious. You wouldn't have to climb the mainbrace to set the sails, or recieve 3 dozen lashes every few days.

It would take about 3 weeks to reach Cape Town and about 8 weeks to reach Sydney.

The real answer to virtually all our energy requirements is nuclear fusion. Nuclear fission of course powers some of our biggest naval ships such as aircraft carriers and submarines. But at this rate I don't see fusion being fully operational until ca 2050.

cg74 · Dec 30, 2011

While I think as a source of energy, wind turbines are complete waste of time, money and effort. I do think they would prove to be great habitats for fish and if placed off the west coast of Scotland may help a little (albeit a p*** in the ocean) to aid the reefs that were once there up until just over 100 years ago.

But if fishing is permitted within 500m, it should only be with rod and line.

Ron, where was the windfarm, as the only major one I know much of is off Bournemouth but I'd reckon the west coast offers more wind?

soffit · Dec 30, 2011

Jeff Woodhouse said:
I don't know why we don't try and do without electricity completely. In fact get rid of all oil, coal, and gas burning engines and contraptions including jet airliners. If anyone wants to go to South Africa or Australia, let them go by sailing ship, an old three masted barquentine or schooner and the passengers have to act as crew also. Everyone must serve their time in the crow's nest, with almost 6 months sailing to Oz, yes!

You may enjoy 'The Last Grain Race' by Eric Newby then

eddyfish · Dec 30, 2011

cg74 said:
Ron, where was the windfarm, as the only major one I know much of is off Bournemouth but I'd reckon the west coast offers more wind?

When I looked yesterday there wasn't a windmill in Bournemouth Bay. Odd windsurfer maybe, a "surf" reef that doesn't work and two really boring piers for the grockles. But no giant white twirly things.

There is wind farm off Thanet, but then again there's lots of things off in Thanet.

Geothermally produced hydrogen is the way to go IMO.

barbelboi · Dec 30, 2011

Off shore wind farms.
Jerry
UKWED Offshore wind farms

PS The largest single turbine available today can only provide enough electricity for about 475 homes, when running at full capacity. How many would be needed for a town of only 100 000 people?

The bad one · Dec 31, 2011

Ron there is no commercial fishing allowed in what is called the "Box" around wind turbines. Reason being the connecting cables. So, the structures will create nursery grounds for fish.

However, there is some evidence starting to emerge that the magnetic field created by the cables is interfering with migratory fishes navigational system. Like pigeons fish have magnetic particles in the brain that help them navigate the oceans.

geoffmaynard · Dec 31, 2011

The bad one said:
However, there is some evidence starting to emerge that the magnetic field created by the cables is interfering with migratory fishes navigational system. Like pigeons fish have magnetic particles in the brain that help them navigate the oceans.

"Some evidence" is more politician-talk than scientist talk surely Phil. There's 'some evidence' that that I'm a brilliant angler, but that don't mean it's true

Having said that - I have noticed that the areas beneath low hung power cables crossing rivers and canals seem to be fishier than other areas so there could be something going on.

dezza · Dec 31, 2011

Jeff Woodhouse said:
I don't know why we don't try and do without electricity completely

Just a point on electricity. It is the most efficient way of powering vehicles known to man. It is the generation of that electricity that is the problem. Most of it being produced by burning fossil fuels which is nasty and retrograde. And then they talk about "carbon capture". There is only one response to this and that is bollax!! Where do you think the carbon goes?

The single most effective method of generating electricity is by nuclear fusion. If the major powers of the world would put the wealth they spend with alacrity on arms, into nuclear fusion research, we would solve the world's energy crisis toot sweet!

Am I right, or am I talking bullshit?

no-one in particular · Dec 31, 2011

I wouldn't have thought they would allow fishing of any sort near these wind turbines so, as a haven for fish certainly. They do not allow commercial fishing in the Bristol channel and consequently the sea fishing is twice as good as where I live in the south east.
I once read of a group of tropical islands where the fish were declining at an alarming rate. The locals called in a fish scientist and he selected an area around one island and banned all fishing from it. This acted as a larder for the whole area; when it became over populated the fish migrated to the other islands and solved the problem. In my view this could be done to all our oceans. Just stop all fishing in large specially selected areas where the fish can multiply and this will in time populate other areas. A constant sort of natural larder. Would stop the complete extinction of species as well.

barbelboi · Dec 31, 2011

Ron The Hat Clay said:
Just a point on electricity. It is the most efficient way of powering vehicles known to man. It is the generation of that electricity that is the problem. Most of it being produced by burning fossil fuels which is nasty and retrograde. And then they talk about "carbon capture". There is only one response to this and that is bollax!! Where do you think the carbon goes?

The single most effective method of generating electricity is by nuclear fusion. If the major powers of the world would put the wealth they spend with alacrity on arms, into nuclear fusion research, we would solve the world's energy crisis toot sweet!

Am I right, or am I talking bullshit?

Exactly, the fuels are plentiful, safe since any malfunction results in a rapid shutdown, no atmospheric pollution leading to acid rain or "greenhouse" effect. Radioactivity of the reactor structure, caused by the neutrons, decays rapidly and can be minimised by careful selection of low-activation materials.
Jerry

The bad one · Jan 1, 2012

geoffmaynard said:
"Some evidence" is more politician-talk than scientist talk surely Phil. There's 'some evidence' that that I'm a brilliant angler, but that don't mean it's true
Having said that - I have noticed that the areas beneath low hung power cables crossing rivers and canals seem to be fishier than other areas so there could be something going on.

No Geoff it is not political talk! It is independent scientists across the board who have been studying it, and the evidence is not as yet conclusive enough to state with absolute scientific certainty that the power cables around the windfarms are the main cause of the problem.

As with all rigorous scientific studies, it takes a huge amount of data collecting to come to an absolute scientific certainty.
Google it, the evidence there is so far, is out there.

If that evidence prove conclusive, then an informed cost benefit judgement can be made on the evidence whether we continue with the expansion of the farms.

It may well be that the judgement is to continue the expansion as the risk is within an acceptable level. However, we, anglers, should not shy away from a critical assessment of such technologies if such technologies are outside the acceptable risk and may damage migration of fish through the oceans.
Green technologies should mean what they say on the tin, Green! If they cause damage to any flora and fauna of the biosphere outside the acceptable risks, then they ain't Green!

A Haven for fish?

dezza

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barbelboi

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Jeff Woodhouse

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dezza

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cg74

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soffit

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eddyfish

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barbelboi

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The bad one

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geoffmaynard

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dezza

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no-one in particular

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barbelboi

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The bad one

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