80lb braid does seem a touch excessive... I use 50lb braid when fishing medium/heavy lures but not to avoid crack-offs, it's so I can drag my not inexpensive end tackle out of pretty much any snag - I've straightened the hooks on quite a few pike sized lures way before reaching the breaking point of 50lb braid. Perhaps he is using the wrong knots - the braid I use (Power Pro) has the correct knots illustrated on the packaging, which are similar to, but fundamentally different from anything I'd use with mono. Through using them and regularly removing the few feet of braid closest to the end tackle I can honestly say I've never had a lure crack off!
The Alternative Angler ? DVD Review
- Thread starter drhaddock
- Start date
E
Evan NotMightyAtAll
Guest
Now who said you couldn't do serious writing of quality when you want to.... decent review and thanks.
Must confess I can't break a 30lb line without using a thick glove or fingerstall or wrapping the line round a bankstick to pull with (<u>ESSENTIAL</u> you do one or t'other with braid, don't for heavens sake try to break even 8 lb braid with your unprotected fingers or its very painfulcheese cutter time). 30lbs iscertainly enough to straighten any of the trebles I ever use for coarse fishing, the sea boys maybe not but....
Plus which if using a lure then you have the line tied to a trace before the lure anyway, can't see any hinge effect prejudicing a decent braid knot there. Mind, always worth doubling over braid before tying the right knot (especially commend the rapala knot aka no slip knot for loops and loops to traces in braid). I do take the trouble to go look at the manufacturer's various websites to check which knots they recommend, as not all braid is the same by any means at all, some knots just don't work in one but do brilliantly in another.
Must confess I can't break a 30lb line without using a thick glove or fingerstall or wrapping the line round a bankstick to pull with (<u>ESSENTIAL</u> you do one or t'other with braid, don't for heavens sake try to break even 8 lb braid with your unprotected fingers or its very painfulcheese cutter time). 30lbs iscertainly enough to straighten any of the trebles I ever use for coarse fishing, the sea boys maybe not but....
Plus which if using a lure then you have the line tied to a trace before the lure anyway, can't see any hinge effect prejudicing a decent braid knot there. Mind, always worth doubling over braid before tying the right knot (especially commend the rapala knot aka no slip knot for loops and loops to traces in braid). I do take the trouble to go look at the manufacturer's various websites to check which knots they recommend, as not all braid is the same by any means at all, some knots just don't work in one but do brilliantly in another.
Kevin Perkins
Well-known member
Evan
Not entirely sure that it was serious, certainly honest, though! And not meant to be knocking copy, either, Fox products have a well deserved reputation for quality, but lashing out £9.99 on what appears to be just 2 guys out on 'jolly' isn't going to enhance that much, if at all.
And to echo your sentiments, I a quite sure that it is the knot that is the cause of the problems with the braid 'cracking off'. Butto have an 'expert' on the DVD telling people that just doubling the breaking strain will solve the problem seem to be mssing the point somewhat!
Not entirely sure that it was serious, certainly honest, though! And not meant to be knocking copy, either, Fox products have a well deserved reputation for quality, but lashing out £9.99 on what appears to be just 2 guys out on 'jolly' isn't going to enhance that much, if at all.
And to echo your sentiments, I a quite sure that it is the knot that is the cause of the problems with the braid 'cracking off'. Butto have an 'expert' on the DVD telling people that just doubling the breaking strain will solve the problem seem to be mssing the point somewhat!
W
Wolfman Woody
Guest
Point about the knot -
Dave (Mr Kryston himself) Chilton recommends that to strengthen any knot in braid, double over the line first (as Evan suggests above). If you then tie a four turn grinner, you actually get an eight tunr grinner.
That's what the man himself recommends, I don't know if it actually strengthens the knot, but to have so many turns it will surely cushion the strangulation effect to some extent. Can't hurt.
A strange coincidence, us both having reviewed the same video at same time and agreeing to some extent. Got to hand it to you though, Kevin, yours is very bl**dy funny, mine i'nt!
Dave (Mr Kryston himself) Chilton recommends that to strengthen any knot in braid, double over the line first (as Evan suggests above). If you then tie a four turn grinner, you actually get an eight tunr grinner.
That's what the man himself recommends, I don't know if it actually strengthens the knot, but to have so many turns it will surely cushion the strangulation effect to some extent. Can't hurt.
A strange coincidence, us both having reviewed the same video at same time and agreeing to some extent. Got to hand it to you though, Kevin, yours is very bl**dy funny, mine i'nt!
Kevin Perkins
Well-known member
Jeff
With my level of experience and expertise I only have the option to try and make it funny, whereas your review was even-handed, and contained very valid comments anda great deal of perspicacity.
With my level of experience and expertise I only have the option to try and make it funny, whereas your review was even-handed, and contained very valid comments anda great deal of perspicacity.
C
Cakey
Guest
nice one Kevin
P
Peter Jacobs (ACA, SAA, CA)
Guest
I really enjoyed reading the article, open, honest and to the point.
PS sadly though with those qualities Kevin, you'll never get a job on any of the weeklies.
[insert HUGE daft smiling face!]
PS sadly though with those qualities Kevin, you'll never get a job on any of the weeklies.
[insert HUGE daft smiling face!]
F
Fred Bonney
Guest
Thanks for saving me a tenner Kevin, no, not really Iwouldn't have bought it anyway.
Great review though, you said enough in your description,that even if I did want to buy it, I wouldn't now,as I've seen it in my minds eye.
Great review though, you said enough in your description,that even if I did want to buy it, I wouldn't now,as I've seen it in my minds eye.
K
Kevin Perkins
Guest
Peter
It would be refreshing if more manufacturers stepped out of their comfort zone and offered items out for honest and unbiased reviews.
Experienced anglers such as Jeff Woodhouse can be relied on to give their honest opinion, and in Jeff's case will offer constructive solutions to problems or queries they have with the product. Far better that, than the 'safe' 8-9/10scores that you regularly see in certain publications.
If all new tackle scores so well , and therefore by default is just about perfect,what is point of reviewing it ........?????
It would be refreshing if more manufacturers stepped out of their comfort zone and offered items out for honest and unbiased reviews.
Experienced anglers such as Jeff Woodhouse can be relied on to give their honest opinion, and in Jeff's case will offer constructive solutions to problems or queries they have with the product. Far better that, than the 'safe' 8-9/10scores that you regularly see in certain publications.
If all new tackle scores so well , and therefore by default is just about perfect,what is point of reviewing it ........?????
W
Wolfman Woody
Guest
Well said Kevin, I mean the last paragraph.
As for your reference to me, all I can say is I take after George Washington - "Father, I cannot tell a lie. Twas me that chopped the cherry tree down hitting the khazi."
If something is great , really mind-blowing I go overboard, but if it falls below standard then I must tell it like it is. I just couldn't mislead people with a false claim and I know Kevin is like that too. We've both probably blown our chances of getting any review stuff from Fox, but believe me, I'd be willing to help them beyond belief if they just wanted to do it right.
As for your reference to me, all I can say is I take after George Washington - "Father, I cannot tell a lie. Twas me that chopped the cherry tree down hitting the khazi."
If something is great , really mind-blowing I go overboard, but if it falls below standard then I must tell it like it is. I just couldn't mislead people with a false claim and I know Kevin is like that too. We've both probably blown our chances of getting any review stuff from Fox, but believe me, I'd be willing to help them beyond belief if they just wanted to do it right.
Deanos
Well-known member
How right you are, reviews by upstanding HONEST anglers, who can remain unswayed by big business no matter what temptation is put before them!
I thought the dvd was great, best I have ever seen, in fact I watched it twice!
(please forward X2 Fox floodwater Barbel rods to me in payment for the above review, ta very much).
I thought the dvd was great, best I have ever seen, in fact I watched it twice!
(please forward X2 Fox floodwater Barbel rods to me in payment for the above review, ta very much).
wayne brooks
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well done kev thats why i come here for advice, i haven't bought a magazine for five yrs.
if i wanted a catalogue i'd go to argos (loads a pics and free lol)
if i wanted a catalogue i'd go to argos (loads a pics and free lol)
wayne brooks
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fox should stick with the luggage side of things, i haven't found better yet
G
Gary Knowles
Guest
Perhaps I shouldn't take the bait as I'm sure Kevins piece is only meant as a bit of fun but there are a couple of things that I can't help but comment on. And yes Dave is a mate of mine, and no, I havent seen the DVD but I will try and be neutral.
Firstly whats wrong with wearing sunglasses?, Dave does it all the time (as do I) when lure fishing, so it isnt for effect, as it does give you much better subsurface vision, helping to to see how your lure is working and also to spot any follows from fish. Personally I don't care whether a presenter waers glasses or not providing the topic is interested, I couldn't give a stuff whether I can see the whites of their eyes...
"His appearance isn't helped by having his sleeves rolled up displaying heavily tattooed, almost Popeye-like forearms"…'kin ell mate that’s who/what Dave is, why should that distract from the content or validity of a DVD….personally I rather listen to someone who actually knows his stuff than a pretty boy presenter, but hey, each to their own.
"In fact they don't unhook the fish, as Dave the Demon Dentist sets to with fistfuls of ironmongery and snips the hooks, which is what he then proceeds to do with every pike they land"..well persoanlly I'd congratulate this rather than piss-take. Pike welfare at its best I'd say and therefore quite a misguided comment if you don't mind me saying so Kevin, wit is one thing, critisising good practice is quite another. If everyone did this when lure fishing you would see a lot less damage to lure caught pike.
"Barbless hooks would probably be a better option for those of us not sponsored by a tackle company and not wanting to have to replace hooks every time they catch a fish"…...wrong again I'm afraid, like most pike anglers I know Dave uses Eagle Claw trebles on his lures and pays for them out of his own pocket. I too crop trebles if they don’t come out easily and when bought in bulk large trebles work out about 35p each, a small price to pay I think whether sponsored or not. Barbless hooks?..when fishing for 30lb+ pike or possibly even bigger..I think not mate…lets be realistic.
"And a lot of the soft lures available these days are actually moulded to the hook, making replacement difficult, to say the least" …Once again, not quite correct, most of the plastics these day do have a single moulded in the back but the trebles on replicants and dawgs are hanging from split rings on the bottom and are easilly changed, I know I do mine regulalry when I snip them or they get blunted on snags.
"For those who take their safety seriously, it should be noted that both presenters continue to wear their buoyancy aids"……marvelous isn't it critised when photographed not wearing them, critisised when they are. For the record when I come ashore for a few casts or lunch I generally leave mine on too….and not a camera or logo in sight.
Firstly whats wrong with wearing sunglasses?, Dave does it all the time (as do I) when lure fishing, so it isnt for effect, as it does give you much better subsurface vision, helping to to see how your lure is working and also to spot any follows from fish. Personally I don't care whether a presenter waers glasses or not providing the topic is interested, I couldn't give a stuff whether I can see the whites of their eyes...
"His appearance isn't helped by having his sleeves rolled up displaying heavily tattooed, almost Popeye-like forearms"…'kin ell mate that’s who/what Dave is, why should that distract from the content or validity of a DVD….personally I rather listen to someone who actually knows his stuff than a pretty boy presenter, but hey, each to their own.
"In fact they don't unhook the fish, as Dave the Demon Dentist sets to with fistfuls of ironmongery and snips the hooks, which is what he then proceeds to do with every pike they land"..well persoanlly I'd congratulate this rather than piss-take. Pike welfare at its best I'd say and therefore quite a misguided comment if you don't mind me saying so Kevin, wit is one thing, critisising good practice is quite another. If everyone did this when lure fishing you would see a lot less damage to lure caught pike.
"Barbless hooks would probably be a better option for those of us not sponsored by a tackle company and not wanting to have to replace hooks every time they catch a fish"…...wrong again I'm afraid, like most pike anglers I know Dave uses Eagle Claw trebles on his lures and pays for them out of his own pocket. I too crop trebles if they don’t come out easily and when bought in bulk large trebles work out about 35p each, a small price to pay I think whether sponsored or not. Barbless hooks?..when fishing for 30lb+ pike or possibly even bigger..I think not mate…lets be realistic.
"And a lot of the soft lures available these days are actually moulded to the hook, making replacement difficult, to say the least" …Once again, not quite correct, most of the plastics these day do have a single moulded in the back but the trebles on replicants and dawgs are hanging from split rings on the bottom and are easilly changed, I know I do mine regulalry when I snip them or they get blunted on snags.
"For those who take their safety seriously, it should be noted that both presenters continue to wear their buoyancy aids"……marvelous isn't it critised when photographed not wearing them, critisised when they are. For the record when I come ashore for a few casts or lunch I generally leave mine on too….and not a camera or logo in sight.
G
Gary Knowles
Guest
"Back to the lures, and I am particularly taken by Dave Kelbrick as he proceeds to show us what he considers to be a lifelike roach imitation in black/gold glitter finish. There are not many roach that look like that in my neck of the woods, unless they are friends of Dorothy, if you catch my drift. But I find I cannot take my eyes of the heavily chromed bicycle chain that Dave is wearing as a bracelet and can't help wondering if such a glittering article wouldn't make a far more attractive pike lure than the stuff he is showing us………"……Well Kevin you may be into checking out blokes jewelrey but I'm not, and the black/gold glitter lure that as you know contains just a few specks of gold glitter wouldn’t be as affective as his bracelet (assuming it’s the black/gold glitter replicant) has caught me and blokes I know loads of fish to upper twenties this season…it’s a really, really, top lure. So you stick to a bracelet and I'll use the rep!
"And some might take issue with DK's statement that 80lb braid is essential to avoid crack-offs when using bigger lures"…then some may be wrong, you chuck a big replicant, rooter, dawg or similar weighted lure, have an ovverun on your multiplier and 65lb power pro will snap like cotton…I know, its happened to me. I too use a minimum on 80lb for the bigger lures on jerk rods.
"A small section on spoons was included and amongst the selection of spoons shown are some with hooks fitted to the middle of the spoon blade, which according to DK is to help with pike coming up short to the bait. If the pike are failing to hit the treble at the back of the spoon, fitting one even nearer to the angler isn't going to help a lot, is it?"….agreed in principle, although he could be refering to the pike nipping the middle rather than engulfing the spoon, Still for the record I've told Dave this, in fact I'd go further and say a fish hooked on the middle treble could 'lever' itself off, that’s why I remove the middle treble on my fox spoons.
"In conclusion, it's easy to be flippant"….yes it is, and normally I'd read this and just ignore some of the things in it but I believe at one point you actully belittle some pretty good pike welfare practices, which really needs pointing out.
"or am I just talking b*ll*cks, as usual…..!!"……I wouldn't go that far mate, but there are a few incorrect and quite, petty comments in this latest piece.
Finally "Deano's"…Dave is one of the most honest, down to earth, genuine blokes, let alone anglers I've ever met, I'm sure he'd be less than impressed with your comments.
"And some might take issue with DK's statement that 80lb braid is essential to avoid crack-offs when using bigger lures"…then some may be wrong, you chuck a big replicant, rooter, dawg or similar weighted lure, have an ovverun on your multiplier and 65lb power pro will snap like cotton…I know, its happened to me. I too use a minimum on 80lb for the bigger lures on jerk rods.
"A small section on spoons was included and amongst the selection of spoons shown are some with hooks fitted to the middle of the spoon blade, which according to DK is to help with pike coming up short to the bait. If the pike are failing to hit the treble at the back of the spoon, fitting one even nearer to the angler isn't going to help a lot, is it?"….agreed in principle, although he could be refering to the pike nipping the middle rather than engulfing the spoon, Still for the record I've told Dave this, in fact I'd go further and say a fish hooked on the middle treble could 'lever' itself off, that’s why I remove the middle treble on my fox spoons.
"In conclusion, it's easy to be flippant"….yes it is, and normally I'd read this and just ignore some of the things in it but I believe at one point you actully belittle some pretty good pike welfare practices, which really needs pointing out.
"or am I just talking b*ll*cks, as usual…..!!"……I wouldn't go that far mate, but there are a few incorrect and quite, petty comments in this latest piece.
Finally "Deano's"…Dave is one of the most honest, down to earth, genuine blokes, let alone anglers I've ever met, I'm sure he'd be less than impressed with your comments.
Hi Gary
Maybe Dave would care to come on here and address these comments himself - not that there's anything wrong with you doing so - but to hear things from the man himself would be good.
Or Mick Brown - I know he was on here a couple of years or some one was using his name
Hope you take this the right way Gary and maybe ask Dave or Mick to respond -Like I said it would just be nice to hear their side of things.
Maybe Dave would care to come on here and address these comments himself - not that there's anything wrong with you doing so - but to hear things from the man himself would be good.
Or Mick Brown - I know he was on here a couple of years or some one was using his name
Hope you take this the right way Gary and maybe ask Dave or Mick to respond -Like I said it would just be nice to hear their side of things.
G
Gary Knowles
Guest
The reason Dave or Mick don't come on forums like this is they just can't win. Everyone already has an opinion on sponsored anglers….obviously they can't be honest they are sponsored. And if you are implying they should come online to argue their honesty…why the f**k should they have to do that?.....how would you feel ifsomeone asked you to do the same?
Anyway, the truth is I didn't respond to defend Dave, the main reason I responded was I felt Kevin was belittling good practice in pike welfare, when he made the comment about cropping hooks and inferring unsponsored anglers wouldn't do this. If it werent for that part of the review I would probably not have commented at all.
Idon't have a problem with Kevin, far from it....i just didn't like a couple of the comments in the article and the 'honesty' part of the thread that followed it.
Anyway, the truth is I didn't respond to defend Dave, the main reason I responded was I felt Kevin was belittling good practice in pike welfare, when he made the comment about cropping hooks and inferring unsponsored anglers wouldn't do this. If it werent for that part of the review I would probably not have commented at all.
Idon't have a problem with Kevin, far from it....i just didn't like a couple of the comments in the article and the 'honesty' part of the thread that followed it.
Hi Gary
I'm not asking Dave or Mick to come on here to argue their honesty - I thought that if they it would be nice to hear them state their reasons for why they did certain practrices.
I fully understand the wearing of sunglasses when lure fishing - I do this myself - but did they not think to take them off when addressing the camera - maybe they did, maybe the sun reflected off the water as it can sometimes do - this I know make it difficult not to squint and this would look worse on film than wearing sunglasses.
I can understand the wearing of life jacket on shore if like you say they are only on shore a few minutes and then back on the boat - it would be a waste of time to take them off.
I only know these 2 anglers from TV and Magazinest unlike yoursel so can't comment on either man but Mick comes across a down to Earth chap on TV.
My opinion on sponsored anglers? Bloody good luck to them - getting paid or at least free gear to fish - it's what we all dream off.
If either came on there I'd not be knocking either of them - just trying to cadge a free daysout fishing with them - there is some much I could learn about lure fishing ( or any other kind) from them.
BTW Gary - do you ever give free days out with you - I could do with a tip or two and I know a place that's got a nice 25 plus pike in it up Sheffield way? Go on I'll buy you a pint.
I'm not asking Dave or Mick to come on here to argue their honesty - I thought that if they it would be nice to hear them state their reasons for why they did certain practrices.
I fully understand the wearing of sunglasses when lure fishing - I do this myself - but did they not think to take them off when addressing the camera - maybe they did, maybe the sun reflected off the water as it can sometimes do - this I know make it difficult not to squint and this would look worse on film than wearing sunglasses.
I can understand the wearing of life jacket on shore if like you say they are only on shore a few minutes and then back on the boat - it would be a waste of time to take them off.
I only know these 2 anglers from TV and Magazinest unlike yoursel so can't comment on either man but Mick comes across a down to Earth chap on TV.
My opinion on sponsored anglers? Bloody good luck to them - getting paid or at least free gear to fish - it's what we all dream off.
If either came on there I'd not be knocking either of them - just trying to cadge a free daysout fishing with them - there is some much I could learn about lure fishing ( or any other kind) from them.
BTW Gary - do you ever give free days out with you - I could do with a tip or two and I know a place that's got a nice 25 plus pike in it up Sheffield way? Go on I'll buy you a pint.