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Andy "the Dog" Nellist (SAA) (ACA)
Guest
Really enjoyed your article Mark and congratulations on your latest 2lb'er.A river "two"on a trotted baitis an unfullfilled ambition of mine.
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Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA)
Guest
Mark, thanksI enjoyed that. It is interesting that you use commercial groundbaits over mashed bread which most seems to use.Is there any particular reason?
Graham Whatmore
Senior Member
The elusive big river roach, it isprobably every river anglers dream to catch roach over 2lb on the float and god knows I have tried enough over the years. I have caught a 2lb roach in Chad lake and a 2.5lb roach on a feedered pellet on the Severn but never one on the float on a river.
I know next to nothing about the Stour that you fish Mark but I guess it can't be that much different to the Severn and Wye where there are swims that consistently produce 2lb roach and have done for donkeysyears, these are the ones to concentrate on I reckon and eventually you will strike gold.
Woody will tell you that the Belmont (Wye)produces bigroach, someto over three pounds, consistently in matches and I have had numerous big roach there myself but not 2lb ones yet but my day will come. This is a late autumn/winter roach anglers paradise but it is a bit of a jaunt for you I realise. Stan Lewis's water above Bewdley is another place that has been producing big roach for as long as I can rememberand knowing you I think you willeventually suss it out on your local river Stour.
Nice article anyway and I look forward to your account of the 4lb roach caught in atrocious conditions on a stretch that has never seen a roach before./forum/smilies/tongue_out_smiley.gif
I know next to nothing about the Stour that you fish Mark but I guess it can't be that much different to the Severn and Wye where there are swims that consistently produce 2lb roach and have done for donkeysyears, these are the ones to concentrate on I reckon and eventually you will strike gold.
Woody will tell you that the Belmont (Wye)produces bigroach, someto over three pounds, consistently in matches and I have had numerous big roach there myself but not 2lb ones yet but my day will come. This is a late autumn/winter roach anglers paradise but it is a bit of a jaunt for you I realise. Stan Lewis's water above Bewdley is another place that has been producing big roach for as long as I can rememberand knowing you I think you willeventually suss it out on your local river Stour.
Nice article anyway and I look forward to your account of the 4lb roach caught in atrocious conditions on a stretch that has never seen a roach before./forum/smilies/tongue_out_smiley.gif
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Peter Jacobs (ACA, SAA, CA)
Guest
Mark, another great article, and congratulations on the latest 2 pound river Roach.
Nigel, I wouldn't dare to try to answer for Mark, but personally, I prefer to use neat continental groundbaits for Roach fishing over mashed bread because I think that the mash fills up the Roach too quickly. Also, it lacks the attractants of continental groundbaits that are essential (IMO) especially for Winter Roach fishing.
Nigel, I wouldn't dare to try to answer for Mark, but personally, I prefer to use neat continental groundbaits for Roach fishing over mashed bread because I think that the mash fills up the Roach too quickly. Also, it lacks the attractants of continental groundbaits that are essential (IMO) especially for Winter Roach fishing.
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Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA)
Guest
They are probably easier to use as well Peter.I currently have 6 cut up loaves drying out in my airing cupboard much to Jane's bemusement.
If you read the old Avon masters such as Parker, they went to great lengths to get just the right constituncy of mash and in fact used something more akin to a ball of paste which over 20 minutes or so would just sit at the head of the swim releasing tiny particles of bread to attract the roach but not feed them.He would then put in another.
Graham, I must have a day with you on the Wye one day.Maybe the back end of this season?
If you read the old Avon masters such as Parker, they went to great lengths to get just the right constituncy of mash and in fact used something more akin to a ball of paste which over 20 minutes or so would just sit at the head of the swim releasing tiny particles of bread to attract the roach but not feed them.He would then put in another.
Graham, I must have a day with you on the Wye one day.Maybe the back end of this season?
Steve Spiller
Well-known member
Congrats Mark, lovely fish.
Interesting point about mashed bread Peter, do you mean mashed by hand or liquidised?
I can see that mashed by hand would fill the roach up, but would liquidised (in a blender) bread fill them up?
Interesting point about mashed bread Peter, do you mean mashed by hand or liquidised?
I can see that mashed by hand would fill the roach up, but would liquidised (in a blender) bread fill them up?
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Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA)
Guest
Steve, liquidised bread would not,I suggest have sufficient volume to get to the bottom in a decent flow and would be flushed out of the swim too quickly.Good in a cage feeder though.
Graham Whatmore
Senior Member
I agree Nigel, anywaymashed bread is a great attractant because it spreads throughout the depth and draws the fish upstream but as with all feeding the amount you feed and the frequency of that feed is all too important.
Nigel you know you have an open invitation whenever you fancy it, theres a bed waiting and we don't charge that much for B & B you know./forum/smilies/wink_smiley.gif
Nigel you know you have an open invitation whenever you fancy it, theres a bed waiting and we don't charge that much for B & B you know./forum/smilies/wink_smiley.gif
Tanis Half Elven
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Really good article that Mark.
Regards John Searls book,the huge Roach in this book area joy to look at.Let alone catch mate.A freind is off to the HA tommrow after a large Roach,I hope he does well.
Regards John Searls book,the huge Roach in this book area joy to look at.Let alone catch mate.A freind is off to the HA tommrow after a large Roach,I hope he does well.
Mark Wintle
Well-known member
Graham,
The fustration nowadays on the Stour is that swims that produced 2lb roach 20 years ago, albeit occasionally, now only produce roach to 8oz, and this is a consistent problem. add in that much of the river that I fish is hardly fished means that there are few pointers to where the roach might be lurking. It is starting to look like the prospects are better in summer than winter whereas it used to be the opposite. I have had summer 2's from the Stour but they are hard to tempt even when located. I am looking forward to this Saturday, hoping to find them but won't hold my breath. With the conditions being tricky at best it makes for challenging fishing when you have to make the most of Saturdays.
As for mashed bread; I've used it for chub on the Stour and for roach on the Frome. It's OK but many of the swims I fish are simply too deep and powerful for it to work at all.
All I would ask those that swear by mashed bread is whether they ever get days when they empty the river because that is what can happen with the right groundbait.
The fustration nowadays on the Stour is that swims that produced 2lb roach 20 years ago, albeit occasionally, now only produce roach to 8oz, and this is a consistent problem. add in that much of the river that I fish is hardly fished means that there are few pointers to where the roach might be lurking. It is starting to look like the prospects are better in summer than winter whereas it used to be the opposite. I have had summer 2's from the Stour but they are hard to tempt even when located. I am looking forward to this Saturday, hoping to find them but won't hold my breath. With the conditions being tricky at best it makes for challenging fishing when you have to make the most of Saturdays.
As for mashed bread; I've used it for chub on the Stour and for roach on the Frome. It's OK but many of the swims I fish are simply too deep and powerful for it to work at all.
All I would ask those that swear by mashed bread is whether they ever get days when they empty the river because that is what can happen with the right groundbait.
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Paul (Brummie) Williams
Guest
Nice one mark......i do hope i manage a big river roach before the season ends.
Graham, that stretch of the Wye gets some stick nowadays eh mate.......my PB came from the opposite bank on trotted maggot.
I will have mixed emotions if a stillwater fish ever betters it, as it probably will.
Maggot/caster has always been my number one roach bait, but lately i have really been giving bread some time, leaving the maggots at home to stop temptation.
I have worked harder for fewer fish.....but with a decent average size, including a Salwarpe 11/2lber, a river that usually throws up small roach........tried to put a pic up here but i'm to thick!
Graham, that stretch of the Wye gets some stick nowadays eh mate.......my PB came from the opposite bank on trotted maggot.
I will have mixed emotions if a stillwater fish ever betters it, as it probably will.
Maggot/caster has always been my number one roach bait, but lately i have really been giving bread some time, leaving the maggots at home to stop temptation.
I have worked harder for fewer fish.....but with a decent average size, including a Salwarpe 11/2lber, a river that usually throws up small roach........tried to put a pic up here but i'm to thick!
Steve Handley
Active member
I've not been fishing for a couple of weeks now, due to work commitments and the current state of our riversafter all that rain, but after reading your article Mark, I'm now chomping at the bit to get back on the river.
I've been lucky to have caught a 2lb roach on the float and the bomb, but it is the sight of the float travelling along the current, the sudden dip under the surface and the resulting swirl on the surface of big roach that I enjoy the most. Pure heaven!
I fish mashed bread the majority of the the time, but these are on the upper stretches of the rivers, where the occasional marble sized is thrown inand disperses into a attractive milky cloud,with somepieces sinking slowly before hopefully being interceptedby the resident roach. It is then a question of matching that natural fall through the water with your floatfished breadflake
For me, we are coming up to the best time for roach fishing and that's the back end of the season. My leave is booked and my swims are planned out (weather permitting).
I've been lucky to have caught a 2lb roach on the float and the bomb, but it is the sight of the float travelling along the current, the sudden dip under the surface and the resulting swirl on the surface of big roach that I enjoy the most. Pure heaven!
I fish mashed bread the majority of the the time, but these are on the upper stretches of the rivers, where the occasional marble sized is thrown inand disperses into a attractive milky cloud,with somepieces sinking slowly before hopefully being interceptedby the resident roach. It is then a question of matching that natural fall through the water with your floatfished breadflake
For me, we are coming up to the best time for roach fishing and that's the back end of the season. My leave is booked and my swims are planned out (weather permitting).
Neil Maidment
Moderator
For me location was nota problem! Mark very kindly emailed me that photo with a few lines of darkly veiled hints. After several searching emails he finally coughed up a bit more info and three days after his fine Roach, I was there. Fishing the wrong side of the river to start with but eventually finding the right area.
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The river was in even better nick and I had several net Roach with half a dozen over 1lb. The best didn't quite make 2lb but was a very welcome 1lb 13oz:
Apparrently, if I as much as whisper the location, I'm dead!
Seriously, thanks for your generosity Mark, I had an excellent days fishing with those Roach and some decent Dace, Chub and a bit of pike trouble as well!
Mark has had oodles more big Roach than I and his article makes frustrating sense of Roach fishing on the Dorset Stour.
As can be seen from the followingphoto, it was many years ago, I fished a particular stretch many, many times for it's famed Roach but failed consistently. Finally on just one day I had 8 good Roach with the best going 2lb 11oz. Never before, never again!
/forum/smilies/big_smile_smiley.gif
The river was in even better nick and I had several net Roach with half a dozen over 1lb. The best didn't quite make 2lb but was a very welcome 1lb 13oz:
Apparrently, if I as much as whisper the location, I'm dead!
Seriously, thanks for your generosity Mark, I had an excellent days fishing with those Roach and some decent Dace, Chub and a bit of pike trouble as well!
Mark has had oodles more big Roach than I and his article makes frustrating sense of Roach fishing on the Dorset Stour.
As can be seen from the followingphoto, it was many years ago, I fished a particular stretch many, many times for it's famed Roach but failed consistently. Finally on just one day I had 8 good Roach with the best going 2lb 11oz. Never before, never again!
Graham Whatmore
Senior Member
I appreciate the problem Mark and sympathise but it should be safe to assume there are big roach in there somewhere and being creatures that shoal according to size, where there is one there are more. Really big fish are few and far between but they do tend to hang arounda shoal of relatively big fish, its just a case of snagging that particular one in the melee for the feed.
One nasty thought did cross my mind is that they have become late or night feeders due to all the problems associated with rivers these days, clear water, low levels to say nothing of aerial predation so maybe an after work approach may be the answer. Obviously winter conditions would give you more chance and it isn't the most comfortable time to fish I know but it is a possibility worth considering I reckon. Personally I wouldn't entertain winter night fishing but you are a bit more resourceful and determined than me.
One nasty thought did cross my mind is that they have become late or night feeders due to all the problems associated with rivers these days, clear water, low levels to say nothing of aerial predation so maybe an after work approach may be the answer. Obviously winter conditions would give you more chance and it isn't the most comfortable time to fish I know but it is a possibility worth considering I reckon. Personally I wouldn't entertain winter night fishing but you are a bit more resourceful and determined than me.
Steve Handley
Active member
I've noticed similar problems especially when the waters clear. A swim can seem absent of big roach (a big roach in my books is anything over a pound), but come dusk they can suddenly appear and feed with gusto. Unfortunately, this window of oppertunity only gives about a hours fishing, as myclub rules don't allow night fishing. Then again, as Graham says, I too would'nt be to keen on fishing through a cold winters night anyway.
There are also times when big roach are reluctant to take a moving bait and you can improve your chances by fishing a bait hard on the bottom. I've noticed this several times when struggling to get a bite on trotting abait along the current, but a change to a light link-legered bait can sometimes result in a larger specimen.
There's a nice article in this months tcf magazine featuring John Bailey and his return to the River Wensum fishing for specimen roach. As he states, the majority of his big roach were caught at night.
There are also times when big roach are reluctant to take a moving bait and you can improve your chances by fishing a bait hard on the bottom. I've noticed this several times when struggling to get a bite on trotting abait along the current, but a change to a light link-legered bait can sometimes result in a larger specimen.
There's a nice article in this months tcf magazine featuring John Bailey and his return to the River Wensum fishing for specimen roach. As he states, the majority of his big roach were caught at night.
Peter Rothman
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I tend to use liquidised bread as a feed for the upper stour. Most of the above threads talk about mashed bread. Why is mash better?
The largest roach I've had from the upper river was 1lb 8oz, and as Mark writes, the larger ones are difficult to locate and perfect conditions are all to few and far between at this time of year, especially at the weekends!. It is frustrating, but ultimately rewarding. Unfortunately I am away this weekend and have to wait until the next weekend
The largest roach I've had from the upper river was 1lb 8oz, and as Mark writes, the larger ones are difficult to locate and perfect conditions are all to few and far between at this time of year, especially at the weekends!. It is frustrating, but ultimately rewarding. Unfortunately I am away this weekend and have to wait until the next weekend
Mark Wintle
Well-known member
Peter,
Some years ago I had a couple over 2lb on the DDAS waters on the upper Stour - one on caster and pole in summer, the other on bread over groundbait in winter. But generally they now top out at 1-08 on their waters there. I do know of some very big roach on one water on the upper Stour but catching them is another matter. I know a couple of locals fish hard for them and as it's 25 miles away and conditions need to be perfect I don't bother.
Some years ago I had a couple over 2lb on the DDAS waters on the upper Stour - one on caster and pole in summer, the other on bread over groundbait in winter. But generally they now top out at 1-08 on their waters there. I do know of some very big roach on one water on the upper Stour but catching them is another matter. I know a couple of locals fish hard for them and as it's 25 miles away and conditions need to be perfect I don't bother.
I fished the HA today. Pretty tough fishing but I managed 2 roach, biggest just over 1lb, the other a few ounces short of 1lb. Both fish came to trotted bread, no more than a foot out, along side the reeds on the near bank margin. I was using liquidized bread as a feed, but was interested to hear about using the ground baits.
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Fred Bonney
Guest
Nice read Mark,appetite wetted