ATr ambassadors

tuolumne fisher

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
467
Reaction score
1
they were announced with great fanfare, and certainly contain many of the high profile members of the angling community
so does anyone know what they've been up to, or will be up to
the ambassador terry hearn was on tight lines a couple of weeks back, but keith failed to mention his ambassadorship, or ambassadorial activities
perhaps if an ambassador is registered on this forum, he could share with us all, his experiences during the role, and his aspirations for the future
 

Peter Jacobs

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 21, 2001
Messages
31,031
Reaction score
12,203
Location
In God's County: Wiltshire
perhaps if an ambassador is registered on this forum, he could share with us all, his experiences during the role, and his aspirations for the future

I think that Ruth from echocarp is a member who used to contribute here . . . .

I too would be interested in hearing how these ambassadors have fared.
 

bennygesserit

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
6,046
Reaction score
360
Location
.
they were announced with great fanfare, and certainly contain many of the high profile members of the angling community
so does anyone know what they've been up to, or will be up to
the ambassador terry hearn was on tight lines a couple of weeks back, but keith failed to mention his ambassadorship, or ambassadorial activities
perhaps if an ambassador is registered on this forum, he could share with us all, his experiences during the role, and his aspirations for the future


given the dismissive nature of Mike Heylin's post on the shambolic thread I wouldn't hold your breath
 

terry m

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 14, 2010
Messages
5,888
Reaction score
4,207
Location
New Forest, Hampshire
the ambassador terry hearn was on tight lines a couple of weeks back, but keith failed to mention his ambassadorship, or ambassadorial activities.

Given the fact that Keith Arthur spends most of his time waffling about himself, his own opinions and his own beliefs, even when in the presence of an angling great such as Terry Hearn, means that I was not surprised that he did not mention it.

Arthur is so wrapped up in himself that I am surprised anyone appears on his show more than once.
 

bub81

Well-known member
Joined
May 19, 2012
Messages
49
Reaction score
0
Location
Bournemouth
I'm not a member of the angling trust.

Fear not though, I wear a crucifix.

I can see many people are passionate that everyone join up, and I understand that. Good intentions etc.

However, I had sympathy with the guy on Keith Arthur's radio show, who phoned up and berated Keith a little, for practically telling us to join every week, but never having anybody on. I half wonder if that caller was Terry M!?

It grates with me that people are aggressively insisting we join the AT, but we never hear from them, and more to the point never hear of exactly what physical, actual, hard benefits to anglers like me.

I had a look at their website and it all seems a bit wishy-washy re solid progress on things important to me.

What have they done to improve my club waters and day ticket waters? As far as I know my club does a great job of maintaining and stocking, all by themselves. There are no big, fat Americans around (the crayfish, I mean), and no bird watchers are trying to buy it and no animal rights protestors have snapped my rod. My local river, the beautiful stour, is monopolised by clubs which charge a small fortune to join. The free bits are full of litter and scumbags and the day ticket bits are over-crowded. Do they do anything to stop clubs taking on stupid amounts of water including great stretches of the best rivers, and charge £150 to £250 for the privilege so that only a retiree/fulltime angler with a good pension can get his money's worth in a year?.....or are these the kind of elite clubs they are in and they love?

The club I'm in is £50 a year, has 8 excellent lakes and plenty of stream fishing.

Now, if they freed up some bigger stretches of the Stour (without needing a hellicopter to gain access) or if they went around pushing po...achers in the water, I'd join for a lot more than 50p!
 

bennygesserit

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
6,046
Reaction score
360
Location
.
Great post Bub !

The fear with the ATr is that its a jobs for the boys type deal.

Last year I bought a license from the post office but they gave me the wrong one ( the 17 pound one ) i was told I had to claim the money back and by another license, I bought another license but never claimed the money back. Lets say every angler bought a double license , i.e. a license for four rods , wouldnt that do more good for our fishing than spending the money joining the AT ?
 
Last edited:

Jeff Woodhouse

Moaning Marlow Meldrew
Joined
Jan 2, 2002
Messages
24,576
Reaction score
18
Location
Subtropical Buckinghamshire
we never hear from them
Oh if only that were the case some days!!!

Of course, in order to hear a lot of stuff you do have to be a part of it and by not joining or taking an active part you are bound to be excluded to some degree. However, they do release plenty (oh so many 'plenty') of press releases on either their achievements or on cases they are fighting or events they are holding.

For me it's an even greater number of 'plenty' since I get them still because I was once an editor of this site, I get them duplicated because I am secretary of the TVAA which also acts as an Angling Trust Consultative, and they are also sent out to the Secretary of the Angling Trust Thames Region Forum who also sends them, yet again, to me because I also sit on that body. How I sometime wished we did never hear from them, three or four emails per day, not counting duplicates and triplicates! (And there's even more when emails fly around to the EA Hydro Sub-committee, because daft old me is on that also - representing the ATr)

But fear not, even with your Crucifix on, for many of those same press releases are published on Fishingmagic, just read the front page! A lot of those stories originate from the Angling Trust.

Of course not everything they are doing is broadcasted immediately and most won't be updated to the general membership until such time as there is a conclusion, successfully, we hope. There are a great body of people scattered across the country who are fighting for anglers' rights and the protection of fish and it's all coordinated by the Angling Trust. There's also the work carried out by Fish Legal pursuing the polluters of our rivers, which some of your membership goes towards, of would if you joined.

In fact, as I've been writing this the ATr's Chairman, Mike Heylin, has just sent yet another email to our ATTRF groups wondering/questioning why the EA granted permissions and licences for the building of the Romney Hydro scheme that should have been working last November and still sits there motionless since someone forgot to connect it to Windsor Castle and asks if this is gross incompetence. That same email is also sent to the head management at the EA Thames regional HQ to drive the point home. It's subtle, it's background, the public never usually hear of it, but it goes on continuously and often works.

OK, so I am a member of Angling Trust, proud of it, and I will tell you what they are there NOT to do. They do NOT get involved telling clubs and individuals what they can and can't do re where to fish or what waters they can acquire or how much they can charge. They are NOT there to come along and 'improve' your waters or pick up litter, that's down to you, your club and your regional EA fisheries team (get involved!) Furthermore, because of anglers like yourself who do/will not join for whatever lame reason you can find, they do NOT have the funds to buy up precious waters like the RSPB do to protect them for all anglers, sadly.

What they have achieved though in the three+ years since they were established as one national group has been nothing short of remarkable. But why should you believe that when to castigate them for not making you read of their successes is a much easier option. And it saves you £25 a year. :wh

---------- Post added at 21:17 ---------- Previous post was at 21:09 ----------

Lets say every angler bought a double license , i.e. a license for four rods , wouldnt that do more good for our fishing than spending the money joining the AT ?
Benny, I wrote an article a while back statign why we need both the EA (fisheries) and the Angling Trust.

I WOULD POINT YOU TO IT WITH A LINK BUT SOMETIME AGO 'SOMEONE' AT FM CHANGED MY STATUS AND I CAN NO LONGER VIEW ARTICLES. :mad:

I simply get the message
"Restricted access.
You don't have sufficient privileges to view this page."


That's what you get for being a previous editor of FM!!! Thanks a bundle and one reason I don't post much on here any longer.
 

bennygesserit

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
6,046
Reaction score
360
Location
.
Jeff you mention Mike Heylin , why haven't the AT removed the deliberately misleading photos of fish supposedly mangled in British Hydro schemes ?
 

Jeff Woodhouse

Moaning Marlow Meldrew
Joined
Jan 2, 2002
Messages
24,576
Reaction score
18
Location
Subtropical Buckinghamshire
Jeff you mention Mike Heylin , why haven't the AT removed the deliberately misleading photos of fish supposedly mangled in British Hydro schemes ?
Ermmmmmmm, because they were, it seems. Just not the type of hydro scheme Pondy and his group are proposing.

I can now post a link to that article - It is 'ATr v EA - The Battle'

The only way I could find it was by signing off FM and viewing it as joe soap. As Jeff Woodhouse a former editor of FM I am NOT allowed to read my own work... Pathetic! :mad:
 

bennygesserit

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
6,046
Reaction score
360
Location
.
Ermmmmmmm, because they were, it seems. Just not the type of hydro scheme Pondy and his group are proposing.

I can now post a link to that article - It is 'ATr v EA - The Battle'

The only way I could find it was by signing off FM and viewing it as joe soap. As Jeff Woodhouse a former editor of FM I am NOT allowed to read my own work... Pathetic! :mad:

No were the photos not from old fashioned Dutch schemes ? If you put an emotive photo like that and do not quote any of your sources what else are they lying about ? Seen it all before , in microcosm, with various club committees
 

tuolumne fisher

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
467
Reaction score
1
nice one chaps, but wot about the ambassadors, dont no-one know one, or aint they registered on 'ere
are they a replacement or do they compliment the famous five, super seven, or naff nine angling celebs that were greeted with similar fanfair last year, or are they the same persons with a new title
and 'ere's another question, why is the mike heylins former position now voluntary, with no salary, yet the national campaigns coordinator aint
surely this salaried national campaigns manager, a former public servant for 25 years should be more public, leading the campaigns so they create a benefit on the ground

either which way you cut it, the ATr from the ofski has failed to generate grass roots support, its viewed by a large group of anglers as being irrelevant and toothless, in its defence it trots out the old ACA/fish legal, all they've done is get paltry fines for gene pool elimination, not changed legislation or altered the status quo
until the 14000 individual members realise that they are in the minority, and there must be a reason other than apathy, then the future aint bright
the TAC in an effort to get non ATr members opinions heard, got some of 'em to attend an open ATr meeting at a hotel near heathrow airport, the parking cost was £15, the drink costs a rip off, but they did put their views across to mike heylin, sadly I couldn't attend as I was at a residents association meeting, who wanted fishing banned on their local bit of river thames
anyways aint 'eard about any more open ATr meetings, but the residents did withdraw their calls to ban angling
 

bennygesserit

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
6,046
Reaction score
360
Location
.
Ermmmmmmm, because they were, it seems. Just not the type of hydro scheme Pondy and his group are proposing.

I can now post a link to that article - It is 'ATr v EA - The Battle'

The only way I could find it was by signing off FM and viewing it as joe soap. As Jeff Woodhouse a former editor of FM I am NOT allowed to read my own work... Pathetic! :mad:

I did take the time to read your article Jeff very interesting , your point about ATr having to build an infrastructure is a telling one for me , is that where the money goes ? Are they transparent in telling the public where and how they are spending the money ? How much of it goes in salaries ? There are a lot of people who give their valuable time to angling for nothing , thats evident from posts on this forum , but are these new ambassadors getting paid ?

---------- Post added at 07:28 ---------- Previous post was at 07:27 ----------

Oh besides being interesting I thought your article was very clear and well written !
 

Jeff Woodhouse

Moaning Marlow Meldrew
Joined
Jan 2, 2002
Messages
24,576
Reaction score
18
Location
Subtropical Buckinghamshire
the ATr from the ofski has failed to generate grass roots support, its viewed by a large group of anglers as being irrelevant and toothless, in its defence it trots out the old ACA/fish legal, all they've done is get paltry fines for gene pool elimination, not changed legislation or altered the status quo until the 14000 individual members realise that they are in the minority, and there must be a reason other than apathy, then the future aint bright
Jim, your observations are pretty accurate, but a little unfair IMO.

Even before the ATr there was very little interest in national groups from anglers and the best relied more on the specialist angler (and all too few of them) than the average 'pleasure' or casual angler and I include many match anglers in that too. I don't know that it is altogether apathy, is it just typical of many anglers 'freeloading', letting others do all the paying and work whilst they sit on their wallets and enjoy whatever benefits might come? I doubt that I'm being too severe on them because I have asked people if they'd join and they do come up with all manner of lame excuses as to why they can't/won't join.

If you're looking for instant achievements it ain't going to happen. Just look at the power of the RSPB, the numbers of members they have, but then look at their history - 120 years of it! Wait until the Angling Trust has been going 120 years and your great-grandchildren might be proud to call themselves members, but ashamed that their great-grandfathers couldn't be bothered to support it in its early years. That's if it lives that long of course because there's nowt that will kill off a new society better than a lack of funding and we (all anglers) are its only source, no one else will give it money. Ask not what the Angling Trust can do for you, but what you can do for the Angling Trust (with apologies to the late jam doughnut, President John F. Kennedy :)). Give it cash to work with.

As far as I am concerned, I want Angling to have a voice that will be heard by the policitians and the ATr is the only show in town that can achieve that. Nothing comes close nor will do, so you either get on board or just say you don't give a sh*t about angling's furture. If you don't like the way it's being run, better to get on the inside and change it rather than pi$$ on it from a great height, IMO. It isn't perfect, it will take time, but it's all we have. (Apologies for the crudities, but that's the truth of it.)

BTW, the ambassadors are NOT paid as far as I am aware. Mr Salter is and a few others, but he is working part time as are some others and they also get a payment. If every angler joined they'd have upwards of £25m and then they could pay more professionals and have a better lobbying force and bigger, louder voice in Parliament. You do not get what you aren't prepared to pay for, there's no such thing as a free lunch. Professional work has a price.

Are they transparent in telling the public where and how they are spending the money ? How much of it goes in salaries ?
Not an awful lot as far as I know, Benny. Much of it will be in travelling expenses, but in order to find out, JOIN and then ask them (probably in their annual report given at the AGM that I don't attend). If you're not happy, quit and never join again, or step up to the mark and change it from within.

Glad you read it, Benny, you might detect that I too am not entirely happy with certain aspects of either organisation, but rather than dismiss either or both, I work with them to improve (hopefully) the lot of every angler.

To be frank (or is it my mate who's a Frank?) I'm not all that bothered about ambassadors and such like, people who in general want to maintain a name for themselves whether good or bad. I'm more interested in the finer detail of what goes on in the background amongst the 'commoners' and the volunteers and others who exert pressure on the influential people in our society. It is they that will mark the great achievements of the ATr, not the John Wilsons or the Terry Hearns (unless they get their hands dirty also). Always it's the unsung heroes that you never hear of that achieve much rather than those that wear the accolades of fame.

Preaching over, get your coins out now (paper notes are better as they don't wear the pewter) for the collection! :)
 
Last edited:

tuolumne fisher

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
467
Reaction score
1
nice one jeff, accurate will do for me
the RSPB refuses to comment on the 6 million birds that are killed by domestic cats each year, so a prime example of dont speak the truth if its unpallatable, no surprise that as the RSPB are held up as a pukka example, the ATr are willing to follow the model
anyways ambassadors, wot aint needed are ambassadors that the 14000 members like, its the ones who appeal to non ATr members that are need

the ATr was launched to represent anglers, it aint managed it, and it dont seem to wanna do it either
it seems to be heading towards becoming a governing body funded by clubs and quangos, with representations and input from those same quangos and clubs, its employees and policies drawn from that same gene pool
there are many angling stalwarts who assisted the ATr in its beginning, who now feel discarded and thankless, the prime example has gotta be in the recent anglers mail, les webber
was there an investigation into the excessive cost of the ATr website ?
did the ATr rep who attended the abingdon hydro meeting explain why he didn't converse with anyone while there

anyone with a single brain cell realises that angling will be stronger if it is organised, but only 14000 think that it is being organised correctly, if it truly wants to be representative, it wants to listen and act on things that require some unpallatable questions
its moral fibre is compromised by its ability to seek undisclosed donatees, funding individual salaries
its decision to employ mr salter, who is also working for the countries biggest continual polluter, and is on a nice pension for his 25 years of public service, or as he's known locally 3 salaries salter
why cant he work for nuffin for the benefit of his brothers of the angle, who knows

there are two things that trickle down from the top, one is sh*te, the other is moral fibre, if you aint prepared to offer the latter, then wots left is the former, hence the majorities attitude
 
Top