Feeding a swim...

Some days I see anglers arrive at their stillwater peg/swim and fill it in with loosefeed before even wetting a line.
Having filled it in they don't get a bite. In goes another load of loosefeed in a vain attempt to get them feeding
This process goes on all day and they still don't get a bite.

Is it better to start fishing a single hookbait and take it from there before feeding anything at all?

It probably depends on the swim and the target.

I remember the first time i read about Ian Heaps, Ivan Marks and the others in a world championship match (i think it was the one Heaps won) and they started off at the whistle with a dozen cricket ball sized balls of groundbait on their long pole line, never mind the loose feed. Unfortunately this was a difficult approach to emulate as a 13 year old at the time with limited paper round money.

Generally speaking, for the fishing i do, it is usually in with the light loose feed from the off unless i know its a waiting game water and i need a carpet of bait out to hold a roaming shoal.

Back in 1991 the European Supercup was fished on Holme Pierpoint by 200 top anglers. I watched in awe as one Belgian angler put 56, yes, 56, large (bigger than grapefruit) balls of groundbait in during the 5 minute baiting period, all laced with bloodworm and joker. When the whistle went he shipped out the float cocked , trimmed and sailed under for a 4oz roach, and he did this for the next 20 casts as well. Incredible!

I use the suck it and see approach by feeding a very small amount of feed of maybe a third of a big pole cup,I'll generally give it 15 or 20 mins on the bottom if no bites I'll slowly move up in the water if still no luck I'll put more feed in which usually consists of 5 cups in a bin lid type of area if you imagine 5 spots on a dice this is how I try to get it then return to the bottom fishing on the center spot, I only do this during the warmer weather in the winter months I very rarely loose feed much at all probably 5 or 6 pinkies every 30 mins or so, I guess it's trial and error depending on venue and weather amongst other things.
I must add that I've had some rotten sessions where I couldn't buy a bite no matter how I've loose fed or what method I've employed but also had some productive days when I couldn't do anything wrong, I guess that's what I love about fishing.

Sent from mobile using tapatalk

It depends. I know a few places where filling it in is the kiss of death, and a couple of others where they'd have the spod as well if you reeled in any slower.

peter crabtree said:

Is it better to start fishing a single hookbait and take it from there before feeding anything at all?

Click to expand...

I have no idea. I am sure I feed to much, but if you don't feed what attracts the fish into your swim? I feed low food value items, ground bait and hemp for example.

I tend to feed a little as soon as I get to a swim , a litle more as I tacked up and a final hand full as I start to fish

But I do feed the margins well and top up during a session before fishing them

I absolutely agree with what PJ is asking in that fishing a single hook bait to begin with is the ONLY way forward to begin with...I'm not talking about matchmen, who have a different agenda when feeding different 'lines', but more about a single days fishing.
I'm also not saying I don't use any feed at all because I do, BUT never do I spray the swim with feed BEFORE starting to fish and never with groundbait, which, for my money can kill a swim stone dead before you cast a line!

It goes without saying that the feed question depends entirely on a number of factors...Time of year, subject species, water temperature, as well as what can be expected from a certain water which can only be ascertained from fishing it many times......
On arrival I will tackle up and get myself sorted. Next comes plumbing the depth and deciding if I will fish (say) on the bottom or mid water (or somewhere in between) and this will, to some extent depend on target species. Once I've decided where my float will sit (within a 12" circle or so) in the swim I cast out and THEN fire out a few samples of the hookbait. I will keep casting to a minimum and only add a few more samples when I do so.

HOWEVER, should I start to catch immediately or get regular bites then I will feed more often BUT NOT stupidly to the extent that they stop feeding!! Like all things fishing, it's a question of balance and keeping the fish interested rather than stuff them full of food BUT I do realise that it depends entirely on species and holding a shoal of bream in a swim, for example is entirely different to a shoal of roach and consequently it doesn't do to be pedantic around the subject......

Like PJ I have lost count of the times I have seen many orange sized balls of ground bait go into a swim and then when packing up the lobber of said balls tells me " the roach are not 'avin it today"..........................................

No, for me it's little and often, only if nrcessary and working on the premise that 'you can put it in but you can't take it out again' ....

Many will disagree with me I'm sure, but it works for me and I don't do half bad...(sometimes!!)

I think it depends greatly on the water,there is some i fish ,where spodding a kilo + of pellets and numerous pints of maggots at the beginning of the session is the only way to go,especially where bream are concerned,then every hour or 2 top it up with another load of bait,as is another fishery where balling in 8/10 tennis ball sized balls of soaked pellets and corn before you have started is the way to bag up,as a general rule of thumb,it seems to be aimed more at my bream and tench fishing though.i find with roach,rudd,perch crucians,its generally a case of little and often,even when i carp fish i generally only use a hookbait with a small p.v.a bag,or stringer,then just a few freebies near my hookbait,never mass bait !,though i rarely fish for carp tbh.
And as regards chub fishing i think prebaiting a swim with a few pieces of breadflake definitely helps,never had to fill my swim in with bait mind you.
But again saying this i do still believe it all depends on the venue!!this is just generally how it seems with the venues i have fished or currently fish



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I never use the single hookbait approach when float fishing unless I am targeting something that I can actually see. The little and often approach generally works, and if they start feeding do not overload the swim, just enough to keep them interested but not overfed. Knowing that 'just enough' quantity is one of those variables dependant on target species, water, weather, time of year etc etc etc. One of those variables that only experience will steer you through.

Many years back I used to have access to unlimited quantities of stale bread, and by unlimited I mean lorryloads, available every day!

So wanting to catch quite a few 3/4 - 1-4 Rudd for pike baits (I know but it was +200acres of water and I had it to myself) I took 3 or 4 sackfulls, soaked them and prebaited a swim, on the day of fishing I repeated the same process and ledgered bread on top.
Bites were always immediate, every single time, the bait hardly ever settleing for half a minute before the line tightened.

My problem was getting fish SMALL enough for my requirements, many of the fish were 2-8 to 3lb with two going over 3-8 mg: amazing fishing indeed.

On our/my lake we have a limit of 2kg per angler per day.

Just read the early entry by chub on the block re Ivan Marks and Heepsy filling the venue at the world champs.
I am pretty sure this would have been groundbait stuffed with BLOODWORM.
This was a common practice in the world champs and other continental matches.

On most commercials ,I start off with a kinder pot of bait,and go in on it,and see what happens,i don't feed anymore until I get bites or catch a fish,then guage it from there....my margin line, I don't feed till the last 2 hours ,then a couple of large pots of groundbait and I large one of dead maggots,if its a deep margin then probably feed heavier baits such as corn and hemp,...then feed after every fish...If I,m feeding a shallow line,down the track etc,then I feed 6 casters(f1,s) or pellets(carp) every 30 seconds...In colder weather I don't usually feed anything and just rely on single hookbaits,and see how the fish respond and try tapping in small amounts...that's the way I,ve learnt...that you can put it in,but you cant take it out!!!!Chef

In the warmer months I usually throw in a large ball of GB into 2 likely looking swims before setting up, one a couple of rod lengths out and another in a likely looking margin.

I usually fish the far swim first and continue feeding both swims with wallnut sized GB every cast until I get a bite. If after 1 hour nothing then I'll rest it and switch to the margin swim. Once I get them feeding confidently Ill fish the margin almost exclusively.

I use DINNERbell so I don't have to prepare, mix or riddle my GB these days.

PS. I only ever use 1Kg of GB in any given session (usually 8-10 hours) cos I'm from Yorkshire!

laguna said:

cos I'm from Yorkshire!

Click to expand...

You wouldn't bl00dy think so letting your maggots drink at £140 per pint!

You need to be careful when discussing amounts of feed. Unless you quantify it, it's pretty meaningless. At a water I used to fish, several members were discussing exactly this for some time to try to find patterns, and some of us were saying we were baiting very heavily, and others said they were baiting very lightly. When we were specific about the quantities being used, it turned out we aere all using pretty much the same amount. We just had different ideas about what was a lot and what was a little.

The other important thing is to distinguish between attraction and feed. You can put out a large volume of bait with almost no food in it, and a small amount of bait that is very filling. So quantity/volume/time needed to bait up does not tell the whole story either.

I grew up fishing what would be classed as natural waters in todays world and we always thought it best to feed a few balls of groundbait to start your float swim off and then loose feed over the top. I suppose this was what was advocated at the time. The fish were not always in your swim and I suppose the groundbait would keep any pasing fish in your swim.

With the increase in commercials I think the match anglers fishing them started to implement new techniques and feeding patterns (or re-hashed old ones depending on your pov).

The best guy I have witnessed fishing commercial venues feed 7 pellets at a time. And was really good at getting into quick catching and feeding rhythems. When I asked him about this he said piling in bait at the start brings too many fish into the swim and you get too many liners/foul hooked fish.

He said he tweaked his 7 pellet feeding technique from when he used to roach fish the canal with hemp and tares.

I have to say I've given my feeding parameters a lot more thought since reading various posts by anglers such as John Step/Chefster/PC (among others) more to confirm (or otherwise) that I'm basically keeping abreast of modern thinking and not just relying on old (but generally reliable) tactics. That's not to say I change everything on a whim but it's never an bad thing to question why you do certain things that have probably become habit or take on board the thinking of others...

Personally I believe 'matchman' methods of feeding have a lot to offer any angler looking to improve catches particularly around silver or any shoal fish and it can do little harm to follow the 'little and often' theme used by the matchemen...at least to begin with!!

As I said in my original post, it doesn't do to be pedantic around these matters...

Big roach? how critical can you get around feeding eh??

Depends on a number of factors:-

- time of year
- species of fish and numbers in water
- river or stillwater
- size of lake or river
- weather conditions
- previous history/ experience of water

Yesterday I was sitting by the lake and thinking about the same thing. When I came back home I was about creating a thread with a very similar topic before I saw this

Every time (talking about float fishing) on arrival at the swim I arrange my tackle and equipment. Then I start plumbing the depth which takes 15 to even 30 minutes (of course it doesn't take so long if I already know the swim very well).
I believe that feeding (especially with groundbait) before plumbing the depth may even disrupt the plumbing process.
After plumbing I usually throw in 3 tangerine-sized balls of groundbait, catapult 1 handful of 4 mm pellet and 2 pouches of sweetcorn. Sweetcorn is also my main hook bait.

So, yesterday I was fishing the waggler (laying on) on 25-acre lake. My main target species were: tench, bigger roach, crucians, smaller carp. I fed exactly as I described above.
I didn't have any bites for the first 30 minutes. After that time I caught 4 skimmers and had a few little bites in about 15 minutes. I fired out another pouch of sweetcorn. Within another 20 minutes I took a few more skimmers. Then I started wondering if there was ANY food (any amount of groundbait and sweet corn) left on the bottom of my swim (??). Of course I continued feeding regularly using 10-15 grains of sweetcorn. After a few hours I threw in another 3 tangerine-sized balls of groundbait.

All in all, I caught about 40 unwanted intrusive skimmers, 1 tench, 1 carp and a few nice roach, using 0.5kg of groundbait, one tin of sweetcorn and maybe 3 handfuls of 4 mm pellet during an 8-hour session.

Given the above, do you think I use too less or maybe too much feed?