''Iconic Rods''

Derek Gibson · Jul 3, 2015

With nothing better to do during this current heatwave, I was becoming increasingly grumpy. How do I know you ask? The simple answer is Mrs G. told me in no uncertain terms, ''for heavens sake, why don't you take the opportunity to tidy up your fishing tackle, you seem to enjoy playing with your toys''.

Needing no further bidding, I set to work to restore some kind of order to the rods, some of which had invaded the good lady's domestic space.

As with many others, I have amassed more tackle over the years than even I realised. From the better cane examples up to the more current Carbon samples. Well, to cut a long story short,(did I hear a ''thank god''), I began to compare Carp/Avon rods from the early cane to the more modern glass and carbon. Not from the efficiency aspect because that's been done to death, but more from the original concept, and how it has developed over the years, it really is remarkable.

The MK1V Carp and Avon were the ''foundation'' from which all other rods of this type were spawned. Rod lengths have increased, along with test curves,rod rings improved and abbreviated rod butts,(I still prefer cork), and it has to be said, much progress has been made. That being said, I still feel we may have left something along the way.

Peter Jacobs · Jul 3, 2015

It is good to take a setp further back from the MkIV's to the forerunner being the Wallis Wizards too.

I have lovely refurbished examples of both the Wallis Wizard and the Walker MkIV Avon and the action of the Wizard seems a little "softer" from tip to middle section whereas the MkIV has stiffer middle and butt sections.

If you compare those to a modern Harrison Avon blank (I have both the Regular and the Stepped-Up versions) then the difference is amazing, and yet both the modern versions (to me at least) seem to be less "forgiving" to a hooked fish than their cane predecessors.

Derek Gibson · Jul 3, 2015

Correct on all points Peter. Realising that the Wallis was a little soft in the tip to middle section, it was a natural progression for ''Walker'' to increase strength in those areas when designing the MK1Vs.

no-one in particular · Jul 3, 2015

I have often wondered how the original concept of split cane came about. What thought processes did someone have to decide to split a piece of cane in 6 lengthways and glue and whip it all back together. Why did they think this would make a better rod? Was it just a lucky experiment or was there any logical thinking behind it?
The best description of cane I heard is "its sweetness of action", I have always thought that describes it best.

barbelboi · Jul 3, 2015

With B James & Son being my local t/s in the 50’s, and Jim Bruce Snr being a good friend of my late father, I have a lot of fond memories of the development of the MK1V’s and the ill fated cane landing net. The MK1Vs for me will always be one of those ‘special’ rods as that’s what I grew up with - thankfully I didn’t have to pay for one, they were £8.11s in the mid 50’s.......

nicepix · Jul 3, 2015

I've had a lot of cane rods, coarse & fly and still have a Chapman's 500 Light Avon. Not in the B&W league. More a utility model. The only rod that comes close in action and feel to the old cane rod is an Ugly Stick spinning rod of roughly the same length and test curve.

The old Ernie Stamford swing tip rods were similar in action and in their day were regarded as 'iconic'.

flightliner · Jul 3, 2015

It's all about what was relative to you as an angler at any paticular period in your angling life.
Sure, Walkers input along with others was monumentel but up here it was so very differant.
Rods from the late fifties were all about fine and far off on the likes of fenland rivers or trotting on the Trent, rods were therefor priased for their ability to do as described.
Ernie Stamfords swingtips arguably won more matches than any others in history and in the early sixties when glass fibre had taken over from cane a Collin Stevens match rod was a must have -- again in fenland.
The development of rods just goes on getting better and better to what we have today but man is almost out of the final product on account of computerisation.
These days my angling tends to be towards bigger fish along with days chasing silvers, say with the stick float on the Trent. So many of my rods have lineage back to "fifties" for which I gratefull to the developers of the time but on balence (for me at least) they only did for some what others did for me---- if I could choose a time to repeat fish in my angling life ---- the sixties---in fenland --- no doubt!!

peterjg · Jul 3, 2015

Sorry fellas, split cane rods in their day were the best but compared to a decent carp rod made of carbon there is no compare.

Iconic carp rods: Century Mk1 Armalites 21/4 tc x 12ft.

Iconic glass float rod: Bruce and Walker Flyer 12L, in it's day (early '70s) was the best now compared to a Drennan Acolyte Ultra it's 'orrible. It is called progress.

Fishing rods are like cars, everyone, quite rightly, has there own opinion of what is good.

barbelboi · Jul 3, 2015

Whoa, steady on there. Speaking for myself I don’t remember stating cane was best – the thread’s about ‘iconic’. Now iconic to me means ‘widely known and acknowledged especially for distinctive excellence’ Take a look here – I’m all for carbon and appreciate the innovators in the development of rods over the years , I certainly wouldn’t want to swap my Normarks and Harrisons (although some years old) for cane and expect a better rod............

binka · Jul 3, 2015

I wish I was around in the cane era, although cane is what I started out with it was a pass me down relic of the past during my early years in the late 70's and not a rod of that period.

I would dearly love to own a set of modern day reincarnations such as the Bruce & Walker Hexagraph cane Avons but at £750+ a piece it's way out of my league.

I have no idea how true it is but have heard it said that no hollow material such as glass or carbon can mirror the action of the solid cane Avons due to the hollow centred blanks "ovalling" in shape under extreme compression.

Without doubt the king of the float rods in my early youth was the Shakespeare President and shortly after that the boron replacement, a common aspiration amongst all those building their biceps holding a Shakespeare Strike all day long

tigger · Jul 3, 2015

I can think of quite a few iconic rods but they're all carbon

.

I suppose cane's ok if you grow tomatoes lol.

Windy · Jul 4, 2015

tigger said:
I can think of quite a few iconic rods but they're all carbon .

I think those of us who had (and still have) the privilege of owning and using a Bruce and Walker CTM13A or 13AA in the 1970's would beg to differ a little. Post cane, pre carbon and the heyday for fibreglass.

OK, when you take it out of the bag for a waggle these days it no longer comes close, weighs a ton by comparison and doesn't have the sophistication of modern cad cam construction. But back then there was nowt to touch it and completely dominant (though the odd few ABU match rod users might disagree).

nicepix · Jul 4, 2015

Windy said:
I think those of us who had (and still have) the privilege of owning and using a Bruce and Walker CTM13A or 13AA in the 1970's would beg to differ a little. Post cane, pre carbon and the heyday for fibreglass.

OK, when you take it out of the bag for a waggle these days it no longer comes close, weighs a ton by comparison and doesn't have the sophistication of modern cad cam construction. But back then there was nowt to touch it and completely dominant (though the odd few ABU match rod users might disagree).

That's right. The ABU Ferralite Mk.6 had its admirers in the match fishing world. And they weren't all odd :w As did the Milbro Enterprise although I wouldn't have given one house room.

If you were to restrict any description of anything as iconic to purely modern day products you would be ignoring the Spitfire, Jaguar E Type, original Apple Mac amongst others. Rather narrow minded in my opinion.

Peter Jacobs · Jul 4, 2015

Would anyone put the original Shakespeare President rods in the Iconic range?

In their day they were the bees-knees and almost every match angler owned at least one . . . . . .

I still have mine

binka · Jul 4, 2015

Peter Jacobs said:
Would anyone put the original Shakespeare President rods in the Iconic range?

Yup....

binka said:
Without doubt the king of the float rods in my early youth was the Shakespeare President and shortly after that the boron replacement, a common aspiration amongst all those building their biceps holding a Shakespeare Strike all day long

sam vimes · Jul 4, 2015

I rather suspect that your choice, with some exceptions, of what constitutes an iconic rod, will give a fair indication of your age bracket. It never ceases to amaze me at some of the junk that people get wistful over! However, I can acknowledge that a rod can be iconic even if I think it's a load of old rubbish.

Not for one moment do I believe that everything new is better. No more than I believe that every period rod, that was considered to be excellent at the time, is automatically better than more modern alternatives.

nicepix · Jul 4, 2015

sam vimes said:
...............

Not for one moment do I believe that everything new is better. No more than I believe that every period rod, that was considered to be excellent at the time, is automatically better than more modern alternatives.

That sums it up for me. But certain things can be regarded as 'iconic' whether they were good or bad, at the time or now. Things that defined the era such as mini skirts, or broke new ground, or even just because they were regarded as cool. The Raleigh Chopper would never be chosen for its speed or handling and hasn't been made for decades. But everyone knows what one is. Even kids of today.

Alan Tyler · Jul 4, 2015

There's one group of rods in which "iconic" models are strangely lacking: pre-fibreglass match rods. Especially the ferruleless, reed-to-reed jointed ones.
I know of the W. Allcock "Princess", and that's it.
Odd.

greenie62 · Jul 4, 2015

Alan Tyler said:
There's one group of rods in which "iconic" models are strangely lacking: pre-fibreglass match rods. Especially the ferruleless, reed-to-reed jointed ones....
Odd.

Why do you reckon that is Al?
Were they too fragile to last to become iconic? ...Too unwieldy? ....unbalanced? ...not favoured by a big name? Or too late on the market and fibreglass arrived too quickly for them?
What d'ya reckon? I can't remember seeing or using any - when are we talking about?

Tight Lines!

Bob Hornegold · Jul 4, 2015

" Iconic "

A much over used word in my opinion.

I have and still use cane rods of many verities, I have some wonderful Fibre Tube Glass blank rods, and the latest in Carbon rods.

Was the Drennan Tench or the latest Hardy Ultra rods not suppose to be iconic ?

Or compare the older Carbon Carp rods to those being used today.

I do believe you needed more skill to land a decent fish on Cane rods as the modern carbon rods take so much abuse.

But that might be because I learnt to play fish on cane, before glass fibre and then carbon.

Everything changes, can you imagine a car without a synchromesh gearbox, the first car I owned did not have synchromesh on first gear and the lorry I drove had no synchromesh on any of the gears, you learnt to double de clutch.

So iconic, I don't think so, enjoyable, yes.

Bob

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