flightliner
Well-known member
Old fashioned yes, natures styrafoam, but great for float bodies. Anybody here ever used it??.
elderberry pith
- Thread starter flightliner
- Start date
ravey
Well-known member
Not knowingly used an elder pith float, although Gerry Woodcock (Gerry's of Nottingham) used to make a range of pole floats which he sold over the counter and mail order.
Alan Tyler
Well-known member
Lovely stuff, but very fragile. Next time I make any, I'm wondering about cutting out a slice - think small,slim "fishing Gazette" bung - so the line can lie in that and not cut into the body.
By the way, I found that, if you want a fluted body, some of the really thick types of bramble stem can be peeled, leaving a light pith with a tough coat - and five grooves to grip the flow.
By the way, I found that, if you want a fluted body, some of the really thick types of bramble stem can be peeled, leaving a light pith with a tough coat - and five grooves to grip the flow.
no-one in particular
Well-known member
I have a elderberry tree, never thought to look at it. I will now, I like to make a few floats now and again. I also have brambles, better have a look at that as well.
Yes indeed.
I still have a few Elderberry pith floats knocking around in my tackle room . . . . . .
itsfishingnotcatching
Well-known member
That's a 10,000 square feet warehouse to the uninitiated
.On a serious note for those, like me, who hadn't got a clue about this
The Flee & Float: Taking the Pith
Derek Gibson
Well-known member
Yes Flight, I made dozens as a young 'un back in my school days for myself and the rest of the crew. Mostly for use in the Rivelin valley on the river, and the old dams, happy memories. As I type this looking through the window there is a large elderberry bush at the top of the garden. I feel a project coming on.
flightliner
Well-known member
I have one or two in a cupboard that I made years ago. I also have an elderberry tree over my garden wall ( filthy thing) that Overhangs my property. I lop off a branch or three from time to time and yesterday a thick stem that I put down to dry for the pith at a later date.
Derek-- I used to cut all mine as a youth for floats at ecclesfield dam-- happy days.
Derek-- I used to cut all mine as a youth for floats at ecclesfield dam-- happy days.
Knowing pretty much the ages of the contributors to this thread, does anyone else see a commeon theme?
I wonder if Elderberry pith would make a very bouyant pole float body, for the sort of float that one might use for pastefishing?
Derek, Mike?
I wonder if Elderberry pith would make a very bouyant pole float body, for the sort of float that one might use for pastefishing?
Derek, Mike?
Derek Gibson
Well-known member
Peter, Mick will be the man to answer that, as I know nothing about pole floats. So having said that, off the top of my head I couldn't see why not.
flightliner
Well-known member
Peter, it would depend on the pith, density is all, if its dried out very slowly I reckon its pretty similar to balsa, if its dried quickly as I have experimented with in my microwave oven it can at times become case hardenedI (a dry outer layer preventing the inner one from releasing further moisture so retaining a less bouyant ability).I've used it on the Trent as I have balsa and polystyrene and have found it generally fit for purpose, on a pole, no,sadly or otherwise I didnt get swept up with the pole revolution ( I have one but dont use it that often), but Its well worth trying.
I got into the pole revolution about 1990 and never looked back as I love fishing that way.
I just wondered as for paste fishing you do need a very buoyant float, so maybe well dried Elderberry pith might be the answer . . . . .
I just wondered as for paste fishing you do need a very buoyant float, so maybe well dried Elderberry pith might be the answer . . . . .
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robtherake
Well-known member
Still making them for when a tailor-made just won't do. A family of "stillwater khakis" work better than the Drennan originals they're loosely based on - the bamboo stems seem to give them better stability in windy conditions, especially when loaded with lead wire. The same materials make excellent driftbeaters - the very fattest pith stems making bodies carrying up to 5 SSG.
It's not the toughest material though. It's easy to work, but that softness has a downside with bodies getting bruised and dented easily.
---------- Post added at 13:22 ---------- Previous post was at 13:18 ----------
The material's a bit soft for floats that will take a lot of hammer. You could try using a rock-hard clear nail polish to add a bit of strength, but standard varnishes/finishes on pith-bodied floats are damaged just by rolling about in a float tube with others.
It's not the toughest material though. It's easy to work, but that softness has a downside with bodies getting bruised and dented easily.
---------- Post added at 13:22 ---------- Previous post was at 13:18 ----------
The material's a bit soft for floats that will take a lot of hammer. You could try using a rock-hard clear nail polish to add a bit of strength, but standard varnishes/finishes on pith-bodied floats are damaged just by rolling about in a float tube with others.
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flightliner
Well-known member
Lovely floats Rob, top job,and you're right saying shop bought sometimes just cant do the job.
I must say my experience with pith is different.
I agree it is very buoyant more than balsa (in its natural state) very similar to foam but that's were the advantages end IMO.
Its very delicate and prone to damage. If you seal it with any protective coating (which you will need to) to prevent it being damaged you loose the advantages of it being more buoyant.
You can use anything you like to seal it PVA, superglue, sanding sealer its very absorbent and you may need multiple coats of sealer, which add to the weight of the pith.
In the end I see very little reason for using it. Balsa is a much better material IMO.
But nice to use a traditional natural material "experiment" .
I agree it is very buoyant more than balsa (in its natural state) very similar to foam but that's were the advantages end IMO.
Its very delicate and prone to damage. If you seal it with any protective coating (which you will need to) to prevent it being damaged you loose the advantages of it being more buoyant.
You can use anything you like to seal it PVA, superglue, sanding sealer its very absorbent and you may need multiple coats of sealer, which add to the weight of the pith.
In the end I see very little reason for using it. Balsa is a much better material IMO.
But nice to use a traditional natural material "experiment"
.
wes79
Well-known member
Not used it myself, however I can see the appeal in many ways.
I reckon Rosebay Willowherb (Chamerion angustifolium) stem would make an excellent float for the lift method when targetting Tench close in, there is loads of it around and while snapping off a piece to use why not try some of the pith like I did, which no joke is not unlike sweetened popcorn!
Rosebay Willowherb: Taking The Pith
flightliner
Well-known member
Interesting info that wes, there's a broadleaf weed that Ray Mears once mentioned that tastes just like apple, I nibble on it at times on my walks around my village-- lovely stuff but I can't recall its name.
lambert1
Well-known member
Thanks Alan, I had been looking at bramble pith, which as you say is fluted and will be drying some. I have several elder pith floats that I have made and although they are certainly rough and ready I have caught a fair few fish on them. I also work on the premise that if I lose one it has cost me very little.
tryanythingtwice
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i too have made trotting floats out of it but as others have stated it's not a particularly tough material. I used to find that the floats got damaged quite easily when moving from swim to swim if the bodies came into contact with rod rings. Peter Wheat wrote an article for the old Angling magazine entitled "The Anglers Tree" or something along those lines extolling the virtues of the berries, the pith etc. I went back to balsa, though the styrofoam used in the proper Topper Haskins crowquill avons might be closer to elder pith and I guess would be of a more consistent density than either. I couldn't tell you for sure though as I never managed to get hold of any as the trees don't appear to grow in South West London.
All my pole fishing floats are of elder pith and made quite a few years ago. Don't want anything else and have spares in all weights.
In trying to keep the low weight and making them durable I use the following scheme:
Make the rough shape on the raw material;
Put a single coat of at least 50% thinned clear dope on the rough shape
(dope from the model shop, old fashioned stuff used to put on paper wing covering on model airplanes);
Fine shape the float using finer grades of sandpaper;
Finish with multiple layers of at least 50% thinned polyurethane yacht varnish, sand in between layers.
All work, including the painting is done on an improvised lathe which helps keeping layers thin and even. Eyelets are made from thin copper or brass wire (0.3 mm). I glue them to the body before painting, which helps them stay put. All antennae are of Tonkin only. Of course these are (partly) painted. Some fluorescent, some black which works excellent in most conditions.
An old rod builder (long gone now) taught me to harden the finish with household vinegar. Cannot explain but I believe it helps and adds up to the artisan spirit of it all.
As said I love them. In fact, writing about them made me decide to make a nice display of them in front of me
Ow! don't use pigmented paint on the body, only water based colours if you must . Elderberries make a nice water based tint if you like.
Water based varnish can be used but to my experience it's heavier. I tried it without the dope once.
In trying to keep the low weight and making them durable I use the following scheme:
Make the rough shape on the raw material;
Put a single coat of at least 50% thinned clear dope on the rough shape
(dope from the model shop, old fashioned stuff used to put on paper wing covering on model airplanes);
Fine shape the float using finer grades of sandpaper;
Finish with multiple layers of at least 50% thinned polyurethane yacht varnish, sand in between layers.
All work, including the painting is done on an improvised lathe which helps keeping layers thin and even. Eyelets are made from thin copper or brass wire (0.3 mm). I glue them to the body before painting, which helps them stay put. All antennae are of Tonkin only. Of course these are (partly) painted. Some fluorescent, some black which works excellent in most conditions.
An old rod builder (long gone now) taught me to harden the finish with household vinegar. Cannot explain but I believe it helps and adds up to the artisan spirit of it all.
As said I love them. In fact, writing about them made me decide to make a nice display of them in front of me
Ow! don't use pigmented paint on the body, only water based colours if you must . Elderberries make a nice water based tint if you like.
Water based varnish can be used but to my experience it's heavier. I tried it without the dope once.