''The Fundamentals''

Derek Gibson · Nov 10, 2015

Such as closing farm gates, leaving no litter, no fires on the bankside, or simply following the Country Code. They seem to be at an all time low, why should this be? Or am I just being naive.

ian g · Nov 10, 2015

Derek , I think it's just a society thing . I live in rural Shropshire and am always amazed at the rubbish people leave on our local lanes. McDonalds bags and neatly bagged empty bottles and cans being the most popular , just tossed casually in a roadside ditch . Why don't they take it home? I don't even think it's a youngsters thing people just seem to have lost respect for their surroundings I'm not really sure why.

thecrow · Nov 10, 2015

I don't think you are being naïve as it is as you say getting worse, imo its a reflection of the general falling standards within society, these standards have imo fallen since the namby pamby PC brigade eroded the discipline that the younger people in our society received.

steve2 · Nov 10, 2015

It is not just the youngsters to blame. They are not the ones fly tipping the rubbish, it's people like us who want things done cheaply and employ anyone who will get rid of their rubbish. A local park recently had 2 lorry loads of someones household rubbish dumped near what is a nice fishing lake. Cost over £5000 to remove it.
As far as closing gate is concerned some members of our club won't even shut and lock the gates to their own lakes.

greenie62 · Nov 10, 2015

Good point Derek,
If you add on the impact of 'fly-tipping' - it's a miracle that more ROs haven't banned all public access to their land!

This is one of the reasons that the Mersey Basin Rivers Trust has a monthly river clean-up - in conjunction with other local countryside stake-holders - including dog-walkers, birders, ramblers, ecologists, neighbours, etc. Events

These 'events' sometimes draw public attention and support with a clear age-related split in the on-lookers - the older 'spectators' giving their approval - the youngsters getting stuck in as well - the exception in support being the 20-40ish group which seem baffled by the effort: "Whatcha doin' that for?", "Who's payin yer?", " Why bother?", are typical queries.

IMO - It would seem that we 'lost' a generation - about a generation ago - perhaps those brought up in the 'Thatcher years' - where personal greed was 'good' and any thoughts of the 'Big Society' were a long way off!

Perhaps that's getting a bit too political for the forum - apologies to the Mods if it is - I'm just trying to look for a reason behind the breakdown of reasonable 'Fundamentals' that Derek raised.

mg:

thecrow · Nov 10, 2015

greenie62 said:
the exception in support being the 20-40ish

Who's age just happens to coincide with the period that has passed since discipline became a dirty word.

peter crabtree · Nov 10, 2015

This was the scene outside the gates of one of my club lakes last week.....

greenie62 · Nov 10, 2015

thecrow said:
Who's age just happens to coincide with the period that has passed since discipline became a dirty word.

Sorry kid - they didn't re-introduce 'discipline' 20 years ago!
How come the 'undisciplined' teens and younger kids seem to have more regard for the environment than their parents generation?

---------- Post added at 10:41 ---------- Previous post was at 10:35 ----------

peter crabtree said:
This was the scene outside the gates of one of my club lakes last week.....

mg: At least it's all in a heap ready to go on the back of a lorry!

mg:

[Sorry PC - not meaning to belittle the impact!]

ciprinus · Nov 10, 2015

greenie62 said:
Sorry kid - they didn't re-introduce 'discipline' 20 years ago!
How come the 'undisciplined' teens and younger kids seem to have more regard for the environment than their parents generation?

probably because the kids have see what their parents have done with this country as a whole, not just the environment.

Peter Jacobs · Nov 10, 2015

Derek Gibson said:
Such as closing farm gates, leaving no litter, no fires on the bankside, or simply following the Country Code. They seem to be at an all time low, why should this be? Or am I just being naive.

I would totally agree with you Derek, failing standards all around in my opinion.

It is not all hat strange that on my syndicate venue there is never so much as a dropped matchstick whereas on the next (club leased) stretch of the same river is can resemble the local tip!

wanderer · Nov 10, 2015

The Human Rights Act virtually did away with discipline in society, no caning in Schools, no smacking the little screaming brat, no respect for authority and older people, i was and still am a little bit of a rebel, but my generation knew the boundaries and the penalties for crossing them, as for the rubbish, i blame the stupidity of local authority waste management policy, make it free and easy to dump your rubbish in the right place.

steve2 · Nov 10, 2015

I work part time at a local school, over the past few years we have all noticed that the behaviour of the kids as changed for the worst. I was talking to one of the senior staff members this morning about this and he said that this year 7 intake is the worst he can remember. We are talking here about 10/11 years old kids who basically tell a teacher to f**k off.
We have already been told that next years intake is worse.
My son is a teacher and had chairs thrown at him, been sworn at and had parents threaten him because he tried to discipline their butter wouldn't melt in their mouths brats.

We have local free to use waste tip but it doesn't the dumping of rubbish else where.

sam vimes · Nov 10, 2015

Whether the facts of the matter concerned are reality or not, it's invariably the case that every generation moans about those that come after it. I'm not quite as old as many on here, but I'm no spring chicken either. I sometimes find myself following similar negative trains of thought about those younger than I. However, if I really think about it properly, I realise that it's invariably complete nonesense that's more a product of my ageing along with a dollop of rose tinted spectacle wearing. Plenty of older people (and anglers) do things that utterly appall me. Age doesn't necessarily bestow wisdom or values.

Yes, there are plenty of complete scratters out there, but there always were, and probably always will be. A portion of those that end up as perfectly reasonable and respectable adults will have been scratters in their younger days. Some take many years to change, some never do, and some never need to from being decent kids.

wanderer · Nov 10, 2015

Ihave to say, i do agree with much of what you say Sam, i was an out and out hooligan in my youth, inter city firm, bad boy, we do grow up but my parents values showed through in the end and age gave me concerns for the feelings of others, some people are born with it, the wildness of youth may be a temporary issue, i hope so, repentant yobbo.

Cliff Hatton · Nov 10, 2015

I can throw some light on this. For 8 years I was a supply teacher, starting at the age of 51. I hadn't stepped inside a secondary school since leaving school age 16. EVERYTHING HAD CHANGED. No standards of any kind in most of the schools I taught in. No discipline. The majority of kids plugged-in to MP3s; every kid texting; drinking fizzy pop in class; no order in the corridors; language that would have had my generation barred from school; litter; no respect; no self restraint.
Handwriting was used as a PUNISHMENT. English and geography lessons largely just cut and paste jobs - no real research or learning - just cut it from a website and paste it in. I could count the good schools I taught in on one hand, indeed, FIVE.
We're now reaping the 'benefits' of all this (see 'Anytown' on a Friday or Saturday night and note the comments from the CBI, that many job applicants can barely spell their own names))

robertroach · Nov 10, 2015

I sometimes visit the Chesil Beach in the summer for an evening's fishing. It is really shocking how much rubbish is left on the beach by the holidaymakers who come to fish. They are mainly adults, not children. Similarly on the road edges there are literally tons of rubbish which get thrown out of car windows. I am sure this is because of adults if not directly then because they are not telling their kids not to do it.
It's easy to blame the next generation. It's our generation at fault for not passing better values on.

peterjg · Nov 10, 2015

I agree with all that has been said. The other issue that drives me nuts is dog s!!t on the bank (and paving and paths). But what I find mind boggling is the fact that some dog owners pick up the s!!t in a plastic bag and then throw the bag in a hedge or hang the bag from a bush - I just can not understand the mentality of these 'people'.

bracket · Nov 10, 2015

Living in Dorset, as I do, you don't need a calendar to know when the holiday season has begun. You have a reminder at every lay by, they are all full of junk food packaging. I have a friend who owns a touring park and on occasion I help out. You cannot believe the rubbish that is left. At on point I put up a notice to the effect "When the floor is full up please feel free to use the dustbins". It had no effect. The most bizarre example was a pair of families with a raft of kids who, after a two week stay, up and went home leaving everything, tents, sleeping bags, tables chairs all the cooking apparatus, a multitude of rubbish, food and a quantity of empty beer cans that even I would have been proud of. It's not a question of upbringing , attitude or discipline, for me it's pure bone idleness. Pete

maggot_dangler · Nov 10, 2015

One of the worst examples i have seen .

A bin wagon pulls into a KFC buys food & drink sits in wagon eating and drinking finishes meal drives out of said KFC car park opens the window and tosses the litter in the road ....

PG ...

wa1115 · Nov 10, 2015

I blame the parents for the way the little fu@k3r5 behave in school. My f'ing kids have respect and discipline and if the little c@#t5 step out of line oh do they know about it! A good old fashioned boll@(king and clip around the back of the tw@44ing head soon pi55ing sorts em out

Sent from my LG-E410i using Tapatalk

''The Fundamentals''

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

AKA Simon, 1953 - 2022 (RIP)

Well-known member

Well-known member

Moderator

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member