Braid and related opinions.

Derek Gibson · Sep 1, 2016

As one who has tested and used them since their inception, I am a convert and cannot see a time when this will change. Seeing that they have added nothing but advantage to my fishing.

I believe that most anglers nowadays are aware of the plus's associated with these lines. And yet some steadfastly refuse to use them which puzzles me. Perhaps that may be due to the fisheries they frequent having a ban on such lines. And yes I am familiar with the oft quoted horror stories, which I find peculiar, since I have never experienced any of those quoted.

So my question is, in the spirit of sound debate why is there such a resistance in some?

Lord Paul of Sheffield · Sep 1, 2016

I've used braid when feeder fishing in winter as it shows shy bites up well but if not feathered carefull you can get crack offs

greenie62 · Sep 1, 2016

Nice one Derek - Main reasons IMO are:
- too good to be true (e.g. 12lb BS with thickness of 4lb mono!)
- Just ain't fair!
- Not transparent - therefore can be seen by fish and will spook 'em!
- Knots are problematic (unless you give them a couple of extra turns)
- Tangles are impossible to pick apart!
- You can see the effects of abrasion (invisible on mono)
- It's only for Sea-fishing and Yank luremen!
- It's too new - we haven't determined the good/reliable brands yet!
- It's a nightmare in the wind!
- It starts off floating then it sinks - what's going on?
- Dangerous - if you pull for a break it can take yer fingers off!
Some of which are true and we just need to find a way to use it properly!

Derek Gibson said:
... why is there such a resistance in some?

Ohm's Law! - depends if you're wearing wellies

sam vimes · Sep 1, 2016

It has its plus points, but it certainly has negatives. Some of those negatives are vastly overstated or total fallacy. However, the tin lid on the real or imagined negatives is cost. Many people will choose to believe every old wives tale as an excuse to avoid paying for braid.

Personally, I love the stuff, but I am prepared to work within its limitations. It suits some applications and is totally inappropriate for others. My preference is to use it for trotting, it's on my most regularly used centrepins.

Keith M · Sep 1, 2016

The main reason that I don't use braid very often is that I'm not convinced of its abrasion resistance; plus I like a certain amount of stretch in my line especially when fishing at close to medium ranges.

I do usually use braid hooklengths when carping but not the flat braid or ultra fine braid because of the perceived danger of mouth damage.

I also very occasionally use a floating braid when long trotting although I haven't done so for quite a few years now mainly because I fish some narrow bendy rivers which are lined with sharp edged rushes and as I have already said I'm not convinced of braids abrasion resistance.

One method that nearly always sees me using braid is drop Shotting for Perch as it allows me to see and feel the tiniest of bite indications.

Keith

terry m · Sep 1, 2016

I use braid for all my piking, have done for years, I could not imagine going back to mono for predator fishing.

Not quite sure why I have not used it for other fishing, I just have not, and maybe it's because line stretch is not so critical in run of the mill fishing as it is in predator fishing?

For me the drawbacks are wind knots, hellishly difficult to untangle, and I have suffered the odd cut to my fingers and by gum it does cut deeply.

I don't buy (pardon the pun) the cost issue, the much longer life greatly offsets that.

sam vimes · Sep 1, 2016

terry m said:
I don't buy (pardon the pun) the cost issue, the much longer life greatly offsets that.

Perfectly true, but most people just don't think like this. I know plenty of people that would call someone an idiot for buying a £200 rod. The same people would think nothing of buying a £50 rod now and replacing it every year with a rod with a slight incremental price rise. At the end of four years they've spent more than £200 and still have don't have a rod as good as the £200 rod that the "idiot" bought and is still using.

mg:

The same applies with braid. Most folks can't stomach the prospect of paying £20 for a small spool of Powerpro when they can pay less than a fiver for more of their favourite mono. The fact that the braid will last more than four times as long is pretty much irrelevant. Throw in a few ridiculous, but seemingly plausible, braid negatives, from anglers that are seemingly knowledgeable and experienced, and it's little wonder that many won't take the plunge.

john step · Sep 1, 2016

I am a recent convert to braid for my sink and draw piking. Casts better/further and I feel the takes much better as when it gets colder , old essox doesn't always hit the bait with a whack!

robtherake · Sep 1, 2016

I bought a S/H Shimano 4010 baitrunner with one spool already loaded with braid of about 20lb b/s. It was a couple of years before I tried it for stillwater feeder fishing and I was amazed at the difference in bite registration - shy bites became unmistakeable, but what was most revealing was the activity between bites showing activity in the swim. Quite a bit of tip/indicator movement preceded most proper pulls, some of which - I'm convinced - was just backwash from browsing fish rather than genuine line bites. It was possible not just to anticipate the bite before it happened, but to know that fish were there even if you weren't getting any action, prompting a change of bait or tactics where you may otherwise have stuck it out with the original presentation.

Given my predeliction for soft/progressive rods I already had the tools for the job, which made things easier still. I haven't experienced an increase in hook pulls and I don't believe that the visibility of braid deters fish: it's much softer than nylon, which is probably more important. I've experimented (as has John Step) with the Drennan hooklength braids for floatfishing, which haven't caused any damage to mouth or body either.

Neither have I experienced the lifting of scales so often levelled at braid. The biggest issue has been casting with soft wet fingers, where a few superficial cuts inspired a degree of caution.

Its natural tendency to float can be a problem, but a quick pull through a piece of tungsten putty has largely countered that.

iain t · Sep 1, 2016

99% of my hook links are made from soft sinking braid for rivers. One reason i like it is i can spot any abrasion marks straight away. I feel it has a more natural movement that mono which can be a bit stiff in the water sometimes. But i won't use it as a mainline because there has to be some give when a fish lunges off downstream. Ok the tip acts as a shock absorber but with a braid line attached which is going to give way first, the fishes mouth or the rod tip?.

tigger · Sep 1, 2016

I use it for some types of fishing and use mono for others. I like it for lure fishing and feeder fishing if the conditions favor it. I think the diameters are way above the ones stated and a lot of the breaking strains are also way over egged.
If I was limited to one choice it would be mono for me.

mikench · Sep 1, 2016

On everyone of my cards waters ( over 40) braid is banned. That is a full stop! Not even a hook link. I use it for sea fishing only.

robtherake · Sep 1, 2016

mikench said:
On everyone of my cards waters ( over 40) braid is banned. That is a full stop! Not even a hook link. I use it for sea fishing only.

A blanket ban exists to rub out the bad practices of a minority. Used sensibly, braid causes few problems.

The most idiotic ruling, IMHO, is the restriction of hooks to below a certain size, presumably to discourage the use of heavy equipment. What actually happens is that anglers continue to use inappropriately heavy tackle with the smaller hooks, thus increasing the probability of a hook pull and exacerbating the initial problem.

tigger · Sep 1, 2016

robtherake said:
A blanket ban exists to rub out the bad practices of a minority. Used sensibly, braid causes few problems.

The most idiotic ruling, IMHO, is the restriction of hooks to below a certain size, presumably to discourage the use of heavy equipment. What actually happens is that anglers continue to use inappropriately heavy tackle with the smaller hooks, thus increasing the probability of a hook pull and exacerbating the initial problem.

I'm not convinced about that Rob, in a lot of cases people using hooks small enough so as to pull out under pressure do use lighter lines of which would snap before the hook does pull.
I would say larger hooks are going to do far more damage to a fishes mouth.
Imo barbless hooks are a serious problem and a major factor in mouth damage as the point goes in right to the bend of the shank and then prods about back and forth under the skin making a hole in the flesh. The larger the hooks used the larger the area of damage. Also if a fish is hooked inside the mouth then there's a high chance that the braid will cut it's mouth badly as it's pulled against it. I reckon this problem would be much worse on a holiday camp venue (that's not meant to be a nasty comment Rob, but I know you found there was some badly damaged fish on a holiday camp venue).
Jmo of course bud

.

robtherake · Sep 1, 2016

tigger said:
I'm not convinced about that Rob, in a lot of cases people using hooks small enough so as to pull out under pressure do use lighter lines of which would snap before the hook does pull.
I would say larger hooks are going to do far more damage to a fishes mouth.
Imo barbless hooks are a serious problem and a major factor in mouth damage as the point goes in right to the bend of the shank and then prods about back and forth under the skin making a hole in the flesh. The larger the hooks used the larger the area of damage. Also if a fish is hooked inside the mouth then there's a high chance that the braid will cut it's mouth badly as it's pulled against it. I reckon this problem would be much worse on a holiday camp venue. Jmo of course .

You'd think so, Ian, but there's a similar mix of anglers with various skill and knowledge levels as you'd find elsewhere.

I'm generalising, of course, and my experience is limited to a certain number of venues thus far, yet mouth damage seems to be worse at some than others, where the only difference is a hook size limitation, usually size 10 max, which has been retrospectively applied to help solve the problem. For many instant carpers, their one-size-fits-all equipment is a set of 3lb TC rods and big pit reels, regardless of venue, and they haven't yet acquired the skillset needed to temper their approach at close range. I've sat close to a few examples in recent months and seen some horrific "beachcaster" striking methods applied to running fish that were already hooked: it really makes you cringe. Please don't think that I'm targeting the regular, committed carp angler, who is quite a different animal - skilled, respectful and worthy of respect. It's the unprepared beginner with a poor understanding of the whys and wherefores, dealing with fish that are way too powerful for their limited ability, both on and off the bank. I also think that a lot of this damage occurs in the net during the struggle to subdue the fish and extract the hook, often on a tight line.

Pole angling with incredibly strong gear begets similar issues, as I've mentioned before. Safe in the right hands, perhaps, but too potent for some.

Braid is almost universally banned at these places, as are barbed hooks and fixed rigs, including method feeders. I'm with you on the barbless issue, although I can see the logic of insisting on barbless to expedite the unhooking process where there are likely to be a fair proportion of inexperienced and woefully unprepared beginners struggling to deal with unhooking a big and lively fish.

tigger · Sep 1, 2016

robtherake said:
You'd think so, Ian, but there's a similar mix of anglers with various skill and knowledge levels as you'd find elsewhere.

I'm generalising, of course, and my experience is limited to a certain number of venues thus far, yet mouth damage seems to be worse at some than others, where the only difference is a hook size limitation, usually size 10 max, which has been retrospectively applied to help solve the problem. For many instant carpers, their one-size-fits-all equipment is a set of 3lb TC rods and big pit reels, regardless of venue, and they haven't yet acquired the skillset needed to temper their approach at close range. I've sat close to a few examples in recent months and seen some horrific "beachcaster" striking methods applied to running fish that were already hooked: it really makes you cringe. Please don't think that I'm targeting the regular, committed carp angler, who is quite a different animal - skilled, respectful and worthy of respect. It's the unprepared beginner with a poor understanding of the whys and wherefores, dealing with fish that are way to powerful for their limited ability, both on and off the bank. I also think that a lot of this damage occurs in the net during the struggle to subdue the fish and extract the hook, often on a tight line.

Pole angling with incredibly strong gear begets similar issues, as I've mentioned before. Safe in the right hands, perhaps, but too potent for some.

Braid is almost universally banned at these places, as are barbed hooks and fixed rigs, including method feeders. I'm with you on the barbless issue, although I can see the logic of insisting on barbless to expedite the unhooking process where there are likely to be a fair proportion of inexperienced and woefully unprepared beginners struggling to deal with unhooking a big and lively fish.

It's like a minefield of cock-ups Rob

mg: and most likely the combination of them all in one way or another

mg:.

robtherake · Sep 1, 2016

tigger said:
It's like a minefield of cock-ups Rob mg: and most likely the combination of them all in one way or another mg:.

That just about sums it up!

There's some really bad anglers out there, man. They can make rules till the sun don't shine and it won't make a ha'porth of difference.

The once a year holiday anglers are the most likely to lose a lot of fish, but quite a few of them are still using their old light-line gear from before they were wed and had kids getting in the way and see no need to change despite getting done on a regular basis.

It's the ones who believe all the tackle hype and turn up loaded for bear before they've even wetted a line for the first time that cause most of the damage. Hands-on policing's the only option that can make a difference, but who's got the time to do that, or to be able to afford a bouncer to do the job for them, with all the aggro it entails. Like you say, mate: it's a circular issue.

Mind you, I'm only just shaking off the ring-rust myself. When you go regularly you build up a serious level of skill, like all sports, as long as the ability's there in the first place.

laguna · Sep 2, 2016

I've recently started to use braid for short hooklinks on the method but not mainline and certainly not for speci carp for reasons said plus others.

One major consideration I have is that braid is designed to collapse when pulled taught and this is often said to be a positive when its not. A collapsed braid will conform to the fishes mouth, but its edge will cut like a blade of grass can cut your finger.

steve2 · Sep 2, 2016

Use it for most of my pike fishing, lure and bait fishing. I say most because some of the waters I fish have a ban on it so I need 2 sets of spare spools some with braid and some with mono.
I always wear a glove when pulling off a snag, braid will cut you. I always do the same when using strong mono.
I think the reason there is a blanket ban on some water is to protect the God called Carp.

Bob Hornegold · Sep 2, 2016

Derek

I absolutely hate the stuff, I hate the feel of it when playing fish, I hate the sound of it going through the eyes when winding in.

Knowing the advantages and liking the stuff is a different thing, I use it for Drop Shotting, but that's about the only time.

Bob

Braid and related opinions.

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Banned

Well-known member

Well-known member

Banned

Well-known member

Banned

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member