Broken tips and wrap-overs

nottskev · Jun 21, 2017

I didn't want to hijack the Shakespeare thread, but I'm interested in the stuff that keeps coming up about Acolytes and their fragile tips.

This time last year I had an urge to buy (yet) another 14' rod.
A couple of friends urged me to go for the Drennan. But I like things that have come out well in the long-term road-test, so I went for a second Shimano Diaflash 14', even though the Ebay price for a mint one was higher than I paid for the first in 1995. (When I said "long-term".....

)

No regrets, but here's the interesting bit. I have re-ringed (re-rung?) the old one's tip with single leg rings, of the same height, spaced the same. With the original model and its double-leg rings, you can fish a whole session and never a wrap-over. With the re-ringed one, you'll get wrap-overs several times. As you do with a quiver-tip, I'm normally keeping a close eye that all's well at the tip end, and I'm careful to avoid mishaps, but the potential is there for something to go wrong. You can see from the pic how similar the tips are.

Anyone like to suggest why only the re-rung one gets line problems?

108831 · Jun 21, 2017

How very interesting,could it be the single leggers have some flex,whilst the original twin legged rings are rigid,maybe it's just enough to allow a bit of line twist to be imparted...who knows...:wh

binka · Jun 21, 2017

Or maybe that the slope on both sides of the double legged rings allows the line to slide back off whereas the single leg traps it?

mikench · Jun 21, 2017

....and I thought fishing was a simple and straightforward pastime

iain t · Jun 21, 2017

The Acolytes that got the tip damage were the 15ft models. Most were down to careless users not used to the finesse of the rods. I've only heard these rumours when the 15ft first came out but since then only one here and then. I love my 2 Acolytes, I've abused it at times hitting the tip on the ground and no damage. The tip does bounce that cause wrap on the last 2 rings after unhooking the fish but doesn't most soft float rod tips do this. I've had Barbel, Carp of 35lb, Chub and silvers safely landed without worrying about tip damage. It just an old rumour that does it causes every now and then. I wouldn't swap mine for any other float rod

108831 · Jun 21, 2017

mikench said:
....and I thought fishing was a simple and straightforward pastime

Don't be daft.....

iain t · Jun 21, 2017

Time to get the old tank ariels out again

nottskev · Jun 21, 2017

I wouldn't swap mine for any other float rod[/QUOTE]

I'm glad yours is performing so well. I'm not meaning to promote one brand over another; we've all got our favourites and any brand can put out flawed individual rods. I've seen the "wrap-over" idea put forward a few times as a possible cause of tip breakages, and in the absence of better explanations, it's a possibility. And now that I get frequent wrap-overs on one of two virtually identical rods, I asked for views on why. I was prompted to think of Acolytes in this context by a post on here earlier, and before I posted I did a quick google and soon found a dozen or so people posting about tip breakages, so I didn't think I was recycling rumours to peg my query to it. I hope you land many more big fish on yours.

Mark Wintle · Jun 21, 2017

One thing I learnt a very long time ago to avoid tip ring tangles on match rods is to make sure the angle of the end ring is slightly LESS than 90 degrees ie 85 degrees, certainly not the 120 degrees shown in the photos.

nottskev · Jun 21, 2017

Mark Wintle said:
One thing I learnt a very long time ago to avoid tip ring tangles on match rods is to make sure the angle of the end ring is slightly LESS than 90 degrees ie 85 degrees, certainly not the 120 degrees shown in the photos.

Thanks for the comment. A slap on the wrist for Shimano

But since both tip rings are the same, I'm not sure it tells me why one tends to wrap-over a lot and the other never.

And just out of interest I checked the first three float rods I turned up, none of them noted for bad design, and none prone to the wrap-over problem, but all with tip rings pretty similar to the two Diaflash tip rings.

Top to bottom:

Daiwa Amorphous Whisker waggler

Shimano XXX

Harrison GTi Custom

108831 · Jun 22, 2017

Lovely rod the triple x,I wish I hadn't got rid of mine...

Richox12 · Jun 22, 2017

binka said:
Or maybe that the slope on both sides of the double legged rings allows the line to slide back off whereas the single leg traps it?

That seems possible. So bend the single leg guides to a more acute angle and they may not catch the line ??

trotter2 · Jun 22, 2017

I would imaging a more acute angle would make the problem worse.
Line would get trapped under the leg.
At least that's my take on it .

Richox12 · Jun 22, 2017

trotter2 said:
I would imaging a more acute angle would make the problem worse.
Line would get trapped under the leg.
At least that's my take on it .

But the leg would be angled forward more not back. So any line getting behind the leg would encounter a shallower angle that side.

greenie62 · Jun 22, 2017

Mark Wintle said:
.... make sure the angle of the end ring is slightly LESS than 90 degrees ie 85 degrees, certainly not the 120 degrees shown in the photos.

Confused I be!

Not sure which angles were being referred to here - the leg or ring - and wrt (with respect to) the axis of the rod, the tip itself, or the leg?

I have annotated the original tip photo to seek clarification:

OR - have I totally misread the advice - and we're talking about the angle that the Angler is holding the rod?

trotter2 · Jun 22, 2017

Richox12 said:
But the leg would be angled forward more not back. So any line getting behind the leg would encounter a shallower angle that side.

Sorry mate totally confused perhaps its just me.
Forwards :towards the rod tip?

Mark Wintle · Jun 22, 2017

greenie62 said:
Confused I be!

Not sure which angles were being referred to here - the leg or ring - and wrt (with respect to) the axis of the rod, the tip itself, or the leg?

I have annotated the original tip photo to seek clarification:

OR - have I totally misread the advice - and we're talking about the angle that the Angler is holding the rod?

It's the angle between the axis of the rod and the actual eye. I tried uploading an image but as the useless software on here makes it a game of chance I have seemingly failed!

Peter Jacobs · Jun 22, 2017

I understand that the software for photos will be changed out next week .. . . .

I guess after that folk will have to find something else to moan about . . . .

S-Kippy · Jun 22, 2017

Peter Jacobs said:
I guess after that folk will have to find something else to moan about . . . .

Don't worry PJ....I can do that !

rayner · Jun 23, 2017

Tips will not be broken if you check if the line is wrapped before making every cast, it's easy enough and only takes a second.

Broken tips and wrap-overs

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